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12-24-2017, 08:08 PM - 1 Like   #16
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Yeah I just cant't see how they can even have a competitive offering in the pipeline. Their entire system is built around the OVF, which is fine, but this means that their body will be much larger as we know. But this means that in order to be competitive their lenses have to be well priced and smaller than the mirrorless alternatives, but that is not the case, especially when you look at the 28-45 and 90mm lenses.

Could they go full frame in the 645Z body, yes sure, but then what about all the 28-45mm lenses that we have all purchased for crop body only? It all makes just no sense at all. If I could speculate, I would say that Pentax did not see the writing on the wall with mirrorless even coming to medium format and its hit them for a six.

Heck, Hasselblad is coming out with a 21mm (yes 21mm !) f/4 lens for the X1D. That will be a 16mm equivalent and it takes filters.

I am on board to stay with Pentax for now, given that I have a renewed appreciation for the OVF in my 645z and I love the feeling of a Pentax in my hands. Its just hard to stay on board when you see so many great things happening in the market and Pentax not even following through on a simple lens roadmap.

12-24-2017, 11:13 PM   #17
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For a 645zII, updates for it should be: new BSI sensor, 16-bit Raw, Pixel Shift, UHS-II compatible (UHS-III would be better), improved sync-speed, electronic shutter, AA-si ulator (like in the K1), more AF points (more spread out), improved tethering, improved general video performance, bigger buffer (from 10 to 15 shots)
01-03-2018, 08:25 PM - 2 Likes   #18
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645z

Just want to let folks know that not everyone wants a mirrorless camera. I looked at Sony before buying my current camera and I have no desire to compose photographs through a bad television screen. I love the clarity I get looking at the subject through an optical viewfinder. When I want to go mirrorless I simple go to live view. Full disclosure - I'm shooting with the Canon 5DSR and 5DmarkII and currently taking a serious look at the 645Z.
01-03-2018, 08:27 PM   #19
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Just want to let folks know that not everyone wants a mirrorless camera. I looked at Sony before buying my current camera and I have no desire to compose photographs through a bad television screen. I'm by no means criticizing those who like mirrorless - I'm just standing up for my preferences. I love the clarity I get looking at the subject through an optical viewfinder. When I want to go mirrorless I simple go to live view. Full disclosure - I'm shooting with the Canon 5DSR and 5DmarkII and currently taking a serious look at the 645Z.

01-04-2018, 09:38 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by TedYork Quote
I love the clarity I get looking at the subject through an optical viewfinder.
That being the case, I think you'll be very well served by the 645z.
01-04-2018, 12:26 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by postnobills Quote
That being the case, I think you'll be very well served by the 645z.
Except the 5DsR has an electronic shutter and the Z does not. The 645z could do with an electronic first curtain shutter dearly.
01-04-2018, 07:21 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by TedYork Quote
Just want to let folks know that not everyone wants a mirrorless camera. I looked at Sony before buying my current camera and I have no desire to compose photographs through a bad television screen. I'm by no means criticizing those who like mirrorless - I'm just standing up for my preferences. I love the clarity I get looking at the subject through an optical viewfinder. When I want to go mirrorless I simple go to live view. Full disclosure - I'm shooting with the Canon 5DSR and 5DmarkII and currently taking a serious look at the 645Z.
I have just traded in my A7RII for the mk III, and while I'd still say that I prefer the 645Z overall, the mk III handles better than the mk II, more solidly put together better battery life than the mk II (bigger battery about the same size as the one in the Z). There are some advantages to the EVF, and the one in the mkIII is an improvement - better generally for focussing in poor light, provided there is something bright enough in frame - I took some shots of the moon with the mk III and the FE 100 -400 at 400mm and wide open, and had few problems with focussing. Where EVFs need to catch up is where they get grainy in poor light.

EVFs are definitely getting better. But they still have some way to go. I do like the A7RIII, it's closer in IQ to the Z than the mkII was. So yes, I do think that Pentax does need to picks its shoes up, though there is absolutely nothing wrong with the Z. Could just do with something wider, say 21mm and that lens to take filters. OS? Unless the next body has it in the body, I see no real need for it on the lens. A 21mm f/4 or as far as I am concerned even a f/5.6 would be great without the OS to weigh it down.

In the meantime when I want to shoot wider than the 25 f/4 or 28 - 45 I'm happy to use my A7RIII with the 12 - 24 or with filter, the Batis 18.
01-05-2018, 12:06 PM - 1 Like   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by itshimitis Quote
In the meantime when I want to shoot wider than the 25 f/4 or 28 - 45 I'm happy to use my A7RIII with the 12 - 24 or with filter, the Batis 18.
I have found that shooting the K1 with the Irix 15 and on occasion a 24 (I also have on older Sigma 12-24 which is ok but not great) works very well alongside my Z for the museum installation shots I'm now doing. Being flexible mentally is a boon to work. The Pentax medium format system is great as far as I'm concerned. Clearly you and others here do wonderful work with it....what I think is very much underappreciated by pretty much everyone is that only Pentax has something good in APSC, FF , medium format, and VR/360, Plus the GR series, with a gap now only in 1" sensor size. They have already got a way to use the 645 lenses on the K-mount cameras, and there was a demo a year or so ago on coupling a K1 with a Theta ( I met a pro at my museum who was enthusiastic about the Theta's---he was doing quite a bit of work with them. We have been doing more and more with time lapse at the museum, and a Theta will probably be in my future in the next few weeks...). Now there is an interesting rumor about a curved sensor FF GR---discounted by many but also upheld by at least one corroborating commenter---at an $1800.00 price point (1/2 of a Sony RX1....).

I'm not a fanboy for anyone, but I feels like looking objectively at the situation Pentax is the next most interesting company to Sony, even ahead of Fuji.

01-05-2018, 02:50 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by itshimitis Quote
......Where EVFs need to catch up is where they get grainy in poor light.

.......
Exactly!

Alas, this failing of EVFs is baked into the physics and biology on planet Earth. What people classify as "poor light" but still adequate for photography does NOT to have enough photons to create a low-lag, grain-free image. The camera is either forced to boost the ISO to get low lag or have a long lag to keep the ISO low.

For people who want to do photography at dusk or in dimly lit indoor/outdoor situations, EVFs will always suck in some way. The camera makers may be able to give photographers a choice between lag and grain, but they won't ever be able to get rid of that downside.
01-30-2018, 11:25 PM - 1 Like   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by 2351HD Quote
Need......more.......new.........quality.......lenses........first.
I have both the 645D and the 645Z as well as the Sony a7R and a7R III and I still can do more with the files and trust the pentax systems over the sony's. Unfortunately the lenses besides a few are from another era and diminish the systems quality potential. A modern zoom (200 or 300), a 85mm or similar for portraits (the 150mm is to vintage now) and a higher end version of the 55m would be good. If they do come up with a 100mp crop sensor most of the current lenses won't hold up at all.
01-31-2018, 12:30 AM   #26
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Pentax probably needs to go to 100Mp or similar because others have, and FF DSLRs have reached 50Mp. An 'affordable' non-cropped MF sensor could strengthen the 645's position - it would go places FFs cannot usefully go but maintain some of the lower pixel density that gives the beautiful gradations and low noise etc - and their existing lenses could handle it, I believe, even though people are looking for newer lenses for other reasons.
01-31-2018, 01:28 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by larkis Quote
I have both the 645D and the 645Z as well as the Sony a7R and a7R III and I still can do more with the files
Agreed. I had the A7R and was very pleased with it, but the Z is just far better. I'm sure the A7RIII is catching up, but I'm not surprised that the Z still has the edge.
QuoteQuote:
... and trust the pentax systems over the sony's.
mmmmm, I don't know that that's true so much now----although I do think that still photography remains more in Pentax's DNA. The difficulty is video, where Sony is far ahead. And I am using stills and video now side by side in my professional work (although not my personal)
QuoteQuote:
Unfortunately the lenses besides a few are from another era and diminish the systems quality potential. A modern zoom (200 or 300), a 85mm or similar for portraits (the 150mm is to vintage now) and a higher end version of the 55m would be good. If they do come up with a 100mp crop sensor most of the current lenses won't hold up at all.
Well, yes, but my experience is that the lenses still perform very well. It would be nice to see an upgrade, but then there's the cost. I couldn't have done the Z at all without access to legacy glass in the used market, plus the backwards compatibility since I had some lenses from my 645N.
01-31-2018, 01:53 PM   #28
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The files from the A7RIII are a definite step forward. There are some decent steps forward with usability of the camera also.
01-31-2018, 07:23 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by Robert9 Quote
One of my shop owners in Japan where i order my old lenses has written today, that a new 645z will maybe come in 2018. Nothing more about mirrorless or not.
What do you think, is there something on itīs way? I have thought about to buy a Pentax 645z these days, but i also think about Fuji and Hasselblad.
I have an Phase One and never use it, to heavy, to slow. I dont want to have the "first series" like from Fuji or Hasselbald and take better the next one, when they have learned from the faults done now.
With Pentax i believe they had enough time to learn from D to Z, but i am not shure if i really want another DSLR. All my Canons sleep here, while i use the Sony almost all time using focus peaking and old lenses with a shift adapter.
I hope not mirrorless. I test drove one the last month and what I liked about it was the nice clear view finder although I didn't like the fact that it was not 100%. Canon was like that for a while, never understood it.

02-02-2018, 12:44 PM   #30
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I think it's highly unlikely that Pentax will go mirrorless with MF at this stage. Apart from a completely new camera, that would require a completely new lens range. There's still a substantial market for DSLRs in MF - they just need to capitalise on that. There is a fair bit of wiggle room in price between the Z and the next cheapest DSLR, so there is some scope to beat the competition even if they have to raise the price a bit. The main reasons people in that market go for other brands as far as I can see are: higher speed flash sync, tethering support, more top-performing lenses and better pro support structure (plus existing investment in lenses etc, but you can't do anything about that). So it would certainly help if Pentax could address any of these whilst also making the usual incremental improvements.

On the flash sync issue, a new leaf shutter lens would help, or at least working with a flash manufacturer to provide HSS with an existing flash system. On the tethering side, well, they are unlikely to get Phase One to include support, so maybe working with Adobe to produce a decent Lightroom plugin would be a decent compromise.

IBIS is perhaps the other realistic possibility. This would certainly fit in with the perception of the camera as an outdoor machine, and be a first within the market. This would of course also potentially bring pixel shift and AA simulation to add to the list.
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