[Bob L]

......I guess the legacy LF lenses are the only option for higher sync speed. And they only go to 1/500th s (that is, if all the mechanics are working correctly).

Priolite's Hot-Sync battery monoblocs will sync at 1/4000th (albeit not the cheapest solution).

[LensCleaner01]

i really like your answers photoptimist sounds always compent

the bus transfer was rather about the speed generally if the picture isnt downscaled

the size oder amount of pixels should not be a problem anymore
there are RAM´s what have 4,600 GHZ of speed while having over 64 GB of ram is also not a problem anymore thats enough for the amount of pixels even in raw mode
an example would be: "16GB G.Skill Trident Z schwarz DDR4-4600 DIMM CL19 Dual Kit"
it can be used with different bus size transfers also its like the old rambus ram what has own wires for itself

the downscale instead of taking less pixels is a very big improvment for the image quality when making video it fix up so many noise when doing that on pictures the sharpness is more too (gamechange)

just also thinking about the bus speed into more directions i didnt say this so clear sorry for that

but back to the sensor modern cpus have cache´s L1 L2 L3
harddrive discs also have more cache then modern cpu´s for example the "6000GB Seagate IronWolf NAS ST6000VN0033 256MB 3.5" (8.9cm) SATA 6Gb/s " has 256 MB cache
thats probaly because that kind of HDD drives discs cant transfer data in higher speeds
having the current 12 nm technology with over 19,200,000,000 transistors (CPU AMD Epyc 32-core) there should be more then enough room for a cache buffer or equal

it sounds interesting what power that will use if it gets calculated phones have very energy efficient chips , having the 63 watt solution would probably lead to a connector for that power supply
-----
going into a different direction i seen cameras using less then 100 iso maybe would would also be a option for a future version if that makes a bit more contrast or less noise, just to have it for very specific situations
is that only software based ? if so the pentax 645z could get a software upgrade for this

[ivanvernon]

If I owned a D or Z, I would consider looking at the proven winners of the 67 lens line. Because the 645 film lenses and the 67 lenses were designed by the same company, there is the sentiment that they are similar in design type. While that is true in many cases, there are some important exceptions. The 645 legacy glass did not have a Distagon-like lens like the 55mm (latest) on the 67. Nor did the 645 line have an Angenieux Retrofocus variant like the 75 Takumar/Pentax. Both of these would be worth trying with adapter on the Z/D. I believe the 67 had these lenses and not the 645 because the 67 was the company's flagship and got special attention back then.

Good point. I have six of the 67 lenses that I use on my Z and D. These are the 55, 75, 105, 135, 165, and 200. All are nice lenses, and I have become particularly fond of the 105 f 2.4 and the 55mm f 4.0. The 55 is a real favorite, and I even use it on the K-1 for flowers. It has great clarity, rendering, and MFD.

[LensCleaner01]

hmm if the first solutions are to expensiv i maybe got some other idea

how about using both (rolling and leaf shutter)

"While focal plane shutters boast faster shutter speeds of up to 1/8000 sec, they can’t synchronize with a flash at that speed within normal parameters. Leaf shutter lenses can function at higher flash sync speeds up to 1/1600th second since they are built different. This has everything to do with lens construction. Those folks in Denmark can tell you all about.
a connection between lightstrenght and y-sync speed:
1/200th @ f/16 @ 100 ISO (Full Power Strobe)
1/400th @ f/11 @ 100 ISO (1/2 Power Strobe)
1/800th @ f/8 @ 100 ISO (1/4 Power Strobe)
1/1600th @ f/5.6 @ 100 ISO (1/8 Power Strobe)

thinking that the leaf shutter depending where
"
the hasselblad having a leaf shutter of 1/1600 sounds good 1/1000 is already ok for fast moving birds, better sure are 1/2000 but having 1/1000 or more is just awesome

how about adding 2 shutters into 1 camera system ?

[rdenney]

I’m out of date with Hasselblad. Which one has a leaf shutter that goes to to 1/1500? The fastest ones I ever handled only went to 500, except for those that had focal-plane shutters.

Rick “noting the old 1600f and 1000f ‘blads had focal-plane shutters” Denney

[LensCleaner01]

Why Leaf Shutter Lenses Matter - Kern-Photo - Kern-Photo

[SylvainB]

I’m out of date with Hasselblad. Which one has a leaf shutter that goes to to 1/1500? The fastest ones I ever handled only went to 500, except for those that had focal-plane shutters.

Rick “noting the old 1600f and 1000f ‘blads had focal-plane shutters” Denney

Their mirorless X1D has max speed of 1/2000 but uses electronic trick, the real speed of leaf shutters is 1/1000.
Same for H family : lenses until 2016 have a 1/800 leaf shutter, then the new "orange square" ones have a 1/1000 leaf shutter. To get 1/2000 shutter speed, you need an H6D with electronic trick (equivalent of electronic front curtain).

[rdenney]

Yup, I was out of date.

But I’m not thinking fine mechanical construction is better now than three or four decades ago (except in real production cost). I would want to test a 1/1000 leaf shutter speed frequently. Even 1/500 is often more like 1/350, which was close enough for film.

And the bigger the shutter, the more true this is. A leaf shutter that can open big enough for, say, f/2.8 on a 180mm lens is moving a lot of mass. Bigger shutters usually have lower top speeds. That’s why the Zeiss 180/2.8 was usable on the 2000 (focal-plane shutter) only, and the 180mm Sonnar with a leaf shutter was limited to f/4.

Rick “who owns dozens of leaf shutters on various cameras and lenses, and the testers to measure them” Denney

[LensCleaner01]

there is a mod for the samsung nx 500 where you can shot with the electronic shutter

on smaller fotos this always works well but on the highest resolution you often get lines
uncertain what cause this maybe its just a bug maybe not

GitHub - ottokiksmaler/nx500_nx1_modding: Samsung NX500 and NX1 Modding

this was interesting for me because an adapter wasnt accepted by the camera it keept saying no lens found

the thing is that there is barly information about the silizium wafer values except the size of the cmos transistor

lets say you have a capacity charge for a capacitor you know lets say its for 50 volts and can charge 15 uF
if you put a different capacitor like 400 volts with 15 uF that charge doesnt heat up as it did for the 50 volts capacitor

cmos technic has a dielectric field instead its a charge "around the dielectric field"

the next thing is that the value if you calc with less watt/uf/amps/voltage this doesnt heat up , also it need less power to use them

a lot of electronic´s are incredible bad in energy efficiency

there is barly information about this in the internet how with how many a silizium wafer really calcs

i dont know what cmos size was used for the 645z sensor but 12 nm or even 7 nm is thinkable now , probaly also safes some wattage

if the bus is a problem into more other directions as i wrote some posts before why not increasing the bus ? and add some new chips directly from the DDR4 rams and put them on the pentax camera pcb, they not to expensiv either and used with less voltage or underclocked they wont get hot either and provide good speed to work with video or downscaling

downscaling is a huge gamechanger every1 here knows this from the foto´s

[SylvainB]

Yup, I was out of date.

But I’m not thinking fine mechanical construction is better now than three or four decades ago (except in real production cost). I would want to test a 1/1000 leaf shutter speed frequently. Even 1/500 is often more like 1/350, which was close enough for film.

And the bigger the shutter, the more true this is. A leaf shutter that can open big enough for, say, f/2.8 on a 180mm lens is moving a lot of mass. Bigger shutters usually have lower top speeds. That’s why the Zeiss 180/2.8 was usable on the 2000 (focal-plane shutter) only, and the 180mm Sonnar with a leaf shutter was limited to f/4.

Rick “who owns dozens of leaf shutters on various cameras and lenses, and the testers to measure them” Denney

I think I understand what you mean, nevertheless Hasselblad has developped its lens shutter technology gradually, I don't think the real effective speed is far away from what they are claiming. In addition, they are not very ambitious regarding lens apertures : apart from the HC100/2,2 there is the HC80/2,8, and the rest is slower than f/3,2. Same for X1D, no high apertures in the line-up.
On that aspect, Pentax would have nice fast apertures lenses to put in front of a big sensor, in average 1/3~1/2 stop faster than Hasselblad H line up. The question would be about performance in the corners on such full frame sensor.

[rdenney]

I’ve tested Hasselblad shutters in the past, and they were subject to the same truths as Compur (who made them) and Copal shutters. It was normal for Hasselblad users to tape an error table for their principal lenses on the side of the camera back in the day, if they really needed accuracy (such as for transparencies). But that’s perhaps only if historical interest.

I never used the fastest speeds on my Mamiya cameras that I used for the little bit of professional work I did. And I never use them on my view camera lenses now.

I thought it was magic when I tested the electronically timed focal plane shutter in my first Pentax 6x7 and found it to be within 10% all the way to 1000. Leaf shutters are now electronically timed, and maybe that is the difference. Are they using servo motors to drive the mechanism? I’m still not sure I would trust those highest speeds.

When using a flash, it doesn’t matter—the flash controls the exposure. But flash duration is a problem at such speeds. Powerful strobes have a duration longer than that.

Rick “noting the fame of early Leica was partly centered on its slow and quiet focal-plane shutter” Denney

[photoptimist]

there is a mod for the samsung nx 500 where you can shot with the electronic shutter

on smaller fotos this always works well but on the highest resolution you often get lines
uncertain what cause this maybe its just a bug maybe not

GitHub - ottokiksmaler/nx500_nx1_modding: Samsung NX500 and NX1 Modding

this was interesting for me because an adapter wasnt accepted by the camera it keept saying no lens found

the thing is that there is barly information about the silizium wafer values except the size of the cmos transistor

lets say you have a capacity charge for a capacitor you know lets say its for 50 volts and can charge 15 uF
if you put a different capacitor like 400 volts with 15 uF that charge doesnt heat up as it did for the 50 volts capacitor

cmos technic has a dielectric field instead its a charge "around the dielectric field"

the next thing is that the value if you calc with less watt/uf/amps/voltage this doesnt heat up , also it need less power to use them

a lot of electronic´s are incredible bad in energy efficiency

there is barly information about this in the internet how with how many a silizium wafer really calcs

i dont know what cmos size was used for the 645z sensor but 12 nm or even 7 nm is thinkable now , probaly also safes some wattage

if the bus is a problem into more other directions as i wrote some posts before why not increasing the bus ? and add some new chips directly from the DDR4 rams and put them on the pentax camera pcb, they not to expensiv either and used with less voltage or underclocked they wont get hot either and provide good speed to work with video or downscaling

downscaling is a huge gamechanger every1 here knows this from the foto´s

Downscaling only reduces power and increases speed if you can make the whole chip smaller and make all the signals smaller (lower voltages and currents). Neither are possible for a silicon camera sensor. The total size of the camera sensor chip is determined by the sensor format. And the voltages and currents on the analog side of the sensor are determined by the physics of light. The CMOS circuits on a medium format sensor are more than 100X larger than the state-of-the-art for digital circuits. For example, a pixel on the 645Z sensor is 5400 nm across. Sure, you could make smaller pixels (less power per pixel), then then you'd either have more pixels (same total power) or less ability to collect light (lower IQ).

This basic issue is why tiny sensor cameras will always have superior frame rates and video.

Moore's Law about transistor density provides huge performance boosts to digital circuits but it does not apply well to analog ones especially ones where the physical size of the chip can't be shrunk.

P.S. The bus is not the problem here. DDR4 or wider busses would not help y.sync because the limitations in speed are with the huge sensor and trying to get a clean image off of it.

[LensCleaner01]

sorry for me looking so rude just trying to make a contructive discussion about future ideas


then then you'd either have more pixels (same total power) or 2 different charges (more pixels more IQ theoretical up to 380 NM maybe more if the momentum bounced somewhere else to a different position but lets stay for this 1)

lets say we have "2 types of lightrays or photons (particle wave duality)" 1 is hitting the sensor pixel no. 1 and was red
now comes a other photon from the object to the no. 2 pixel 5400 nm away and becomes a blue pixel

now the second scenario:
the object given away more lightrays(photons) "of the same color" and hit pixel 1 with the first lightray particle and the second lightray particle hits pixel 2
then you would have 2 of the same color or same total power in 2 pixels

in this case the charge would have the same charge for both 5400 nm sensor pixels and it would be 10800 nm that could be used
but thats an "if" it goes that way
not if both got a different charge
in case both get a different charge, then you lose IQ because the second information is lost

i only can speculate where the problem is, but the glass i have seen doesnt always produce a high amount of resolution
if the problem is elsewhere then you have to derminate how many resolution is produced and cancel the unneed´s pixels or combine the existing 1´s in a certain matter so this fits up for the IQ
you would have to know how many pixels you have to combine or not

but even if the most lead up to a pixel shift - if only a few pixels do not its a win/win for the IQ , more detail has gathered

the thing about the DDR4 bus was not about the y-sync speed it was about if the transfer of more data/charges from either the sensor or either the software is to much to downscale the pixels from the full sensor (according the pentax 645z is doing the same thing as the samsung sensor what takes 6 megapixels (and less size of is used to gather information) and doesnt downscale from a bigger amount of pixels
i didnt mean to see DDR4 as slot instead of the chips on it, those chips look like the attackment and can be put on a pcb
the thing why i mentioned DDR4 is that ddr4 also work like a rambus ram (rambus ram has own wires so it can be speaken or sended/readed to without having the bus busy)
then it opens a new question why the pentax cant record 24+ frames at 8256 * 6192 or at least 4096 * 2160 if the existing cpu and busspeed can already handle that


downscaling reduse noise in almost excellent way:
$L_{0}$ -Regularized Image Downscaling - Semantic Scholar
Does downscaling a picture remove noise? : photography
noise - Downscaling by skipping rows and columns ? any example images? - Computer Graphics Stack Exchange

when you took a picture in less light with 400*400 pixels you got a lot of noise
but if you took that picture in 4000*4000 pixels and downscale the information what is left or present in the 4000*4000 picture "almost" fix up that noise
the full sensor should be readed out and downscaled, not what i suspect it just use less of the sensor and make the pictures out of that

its a super win/win here
thinking about a codec i could think about the new h265 , with options for "deinterlacing" and a "user setable Bitrate"
the h264 also could be as second option

sorry if i offended any1

here is a picture of a ramchip (not using a slot or something) how it could look on a pentax camera pcb

[kaseki]

This message was very difficult to follow because there appears to me to be confusion between energy (or charge) and wavelength. Suggest reading a bit of the RCA EO Handbook, (republished by Burle.com), copies of which may still be found on the www, or a more formal text on electro-optics.

The link here Rca Electro Optics Handbook. Download free pdf or Buy Books doesn't generate the expected results, but this may be due to script filtering.

Edit: This version is intact other than missing the cover. http://www.ok1rr.com/tubes/burle/Electro-Optics-Handbook.pdf
Edit2: The Burle paperback version is available from Amazon for a measly $9 (used, I think). Original cost from RCA x inflation factor would get one into the $40s at a minimum.

[LensCleaner01]

having a better f-stop would be great

Hasselblad H6D-100c Review - Shooting Medium-Format Video - YouTube

the compare shows for example the red camera can have a f1.4 with less bokeh then f4.0 on the hasselblad h6d
and dont get me wrong the red camera has a big sensor of 40.96 mm * 21.60 , classical digital medium format has 43.8 * 32.8


edit its 40.96
https://i1.wp.com/www.filmanddigitaltimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/DSMC2-Camera-Specs.jpg