Pentax 67 vs Hasselblad 500cm reliability-wise

johnha · 12-03-2018, 04:10 PM

Old cameras come in kinds of conditions, I've only sent things off for CLA/Repair when they're broken or obviously in a bad way. Disassembling an old camera has risk associated with it (how the workshop deal with this risk is something to consider), personally I'm firmly of the belief not to medal with something that works.

Ediz7531 · 12-03-2018, 08:22 PM

Well, camera arrived today, and anticipation quickly turned into disappointment. KEH sent me a 6x7 instead of a 67... Second time buying from them, second time unlucky. Will give them a call tomorrow.

rjm007 · 12-04-2018, 09:43 AM

Originally posted by Ediz7531

Well, camera arrived today, and anticipation quickly turned into disappointment. KEH sent me a 6x7 instead of a 67... Second time buying from them, second time unlucky. Will give them a call tomorrow.

Bummer - shame it wasn't the other way round....

Ediz7531 · 12-12-2018, 08:33 PM

Got lucky and found one from Roberts Camera. It’s on its way to Eric as I type.

Question: it comes with a grid matte focusing screen with a center circle but without a fresnel or split. Presumably it’s either the BG-60 or BG-80. How can I tell the difference?

Last edited by Ediz7531; 12-12-2018 at 09:14 PM.

tuco · 12-16-2018, 03:04 PM

Originally posted by Ediz7531

...
Question: it comes with a grid matte focusing screen with a center circle but without a fresnel or split. Presumably it’s either the BG-60 or BG-80. How can I tell the difference?

Congrats.

As you noted both the BG-60/80 have a grid but with no split or microprisms.

The BG-60 is a standard screen and is compatible with all the 6x7 lenses. The BG-80 is a brighter screen and is especially suited for telephoto lenses. You can experience corner darkening with this matte and the following lenses: The 35, 45, 55, 75, 75 shift, 55-10mm zoom and 90-180mm zoom per the Pentax 67II Interchangable Focusing Screen operating manual.

The 67II interchangeable frame holding the matte has the model number on it. If the matte is taken out the the interchangeable frame to put into a 6x7/67, I don't know how you'd tell which one you have from looking at it. Perhaps if you can experience corner darkening with one of those noted lenses or not you'd know.

Ediz7531 · 12-17-2018, 09:34 PM

Originally posted by tuco

Congrats.

As you noted both the BG-60/80 have a grid but with no split or microprisms.

The BG-60 is a standard screen and is compatible with all the 6x7 lenses. The BG-80 is a brighter screen and is especially suited for telephoto lenses. You can experience corner darkening with this matte and the following lenses: The 35, 45, 55, 75, 75 shift, 55-10mm zoom and 90-180mm zoom per the Pentax 67II Interchangable Focusing Screen operating manual.

The 67II interchangeable frame holding the matte has the model number on it. If the matte is taken out the the interchangeable frame to put into a 6x7/67, I don't know how you'd tell which one you have from looking at it. Perhaps if you can experience corner darkening with one of those noted lenses or not you'd know.

Thanks! I only briefly tested pointing and focusing with the 105mm lens on. I also bought the 75mm 4.5 lens. Will test using that lens when the camera comes back from Eric.

johnha · 12-18-2018, 09:42 AM

IIRC replacing the screen is a service centre job, if you have a preference for a different one it might be an idea to see what Eric might be able to do?

Ediz7531 · 12-18-2018, 09:45 AM

Originally posted by johnha

IIRC replacing the screen is a service centre job, if you have a preference for a different one it might be an idea to see what Eric might be able to do?

Indeed, I asked Eric and he has spare standard focusing screens. I'll see if I can get used to the grid-matte.

tuco · 12-18-2018, 09:46 AM

Originally posted by johnha

IIRC replacing the screen is a service centre job, if you have a preference for a different one it might be an idea to see what Eric might be able to do?

I put a new matte in my 6x7. It's not hard. Just be careful not to drop any of the tiny shims and screws.

Silent Street · 12-18-2018, 09:35 PM

Originally posted by johnha

IIRC replacing the screen is a service centre job, if you have a preference for a different one it might be an idea to see what Eric might be able to do?

That's the correct advice (from Pentax) and conventional wisdom would strongly suggest following that path (service centre).
You can do it yourself, but you will need patience to establish correct and accurate focus at 3 points in the centre (near and far, using a magnifier/loupe) and make adjustments with the screws and shims. Each tiny shim is matched to a specific position and sometimes a change is required when focus cannot be accurately achieved.

I am hunting for a grid / microprism screen. I have never wavered from that type of exceptionally useful screen during my very long use of 35mm (Canon EOS 1N and 1V). The lack of quick viewfinder horizontal and vertical reference is a constant threat of ending up with off-level horizons, what with the spirit levels of my Manfrotto Mg head being in front, which I makes it mightily irksome to see them in certain situations (such as a recent shoot when prickly lakeside reeds just below the lens threatened to impale my fingers and face!).

Ediz7531 · 12-19-2018, 08:30 AM

Actually on this note, is the standard focusing screen for the 67ii (BA-61?) brighter than the standard one for the 67?

tuco · 12-19-2018, 09:39 AM

On the 6x7/67, the focus screen is spring loaded in place. No adjustments are needed. The shims are to adjust the fit of the folding hood or Prism to the body so it isn't a loose fit.

desertscape · 12-19-2018, 11:58 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Ediz7531

Actually on this note, is the standard focusing screen for the 67ii (BA-61?) brighter than the standard one for the 67?

According to the 67II sales manual, all 4 screens, including the BA-61 were multi coated to improve finder brightness over the older models,

Ediz7531 · 01-04-2019, 10:35 AM

So I got the camera back from Eric. I noticed that focusing at infinity is a little bit off with either of the two lenses I bought, so I hypothesized it's a problem with the screen.

Please pardon the stupid question, but does the screen being misaligned mean that whatever the screen shows as in focus won't necessarily be aligned with the image being in focus on the film plane?

**Alex645** · 01-04-2019, 10:48 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Ediz7531

does the screen being misaligned mean that whatever the screen shows as in focus won't necessarily be aligned with the image being in focus on the film plane?

IF the screen is misaligned then yes, but it could be the lenses as well. Before jumping to conclusions, I would run a test roll with both lenses at infinity and take good notes with shots using the lens on the infinity mark and at what your eye thru the finder appears to be infinity. Shoot with the apertures wide open. Also save a couple shots for a wall or focus chart test at 5 and 10 feet using the OVF for focusing.

12-16-2018, 03:04 PM	#35
tuco Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Pugetopolis Posts: 11,020	Originally posted by Ediz7531 ... Question: it comes with a grid matte focusing screen with a center circle but without a fresnel or split. Presumably it’s either the BG-60 or BG-80. How can I tell the difference? Congrats. As you noted both the BG-60/80 have a grid but with no split or microprisms. The BG-60 is a standard screen and is compatible with all the 6x7 lenses. The BG-80 is a brighter screen and is especially suited for telephoto lenses. You can experience corner darkening with this matte and the following lenses: The 35, 45, 55, 75, 75 shift, 55-10mm zoom and 90-180mm zoom per the Pentax 67II Interchangable Focusing Screen operating manual. The 67II interchangeable frame holding the matte has the model number on it. If the matte is taken out the the interchangeable frame to put into a 6x7/67, I don't know how you'd tell which one you have from looking at it. Perhaps if you can experience corner darkening with one of those noted lenses or not you'd know. Last edited by tuco; 12-16-2018 at 03:21 PM.

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12-03-2018, 04:10 PM	#31
johnha Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Lancashire, UK Photos: Albums Posts: 1,155	Old cameras come in kinds of conditions, I've only sent things off for CLA/Repair when they're broken or obviously in a bad way. Disassembling an old camera has risk associated with it (how the workshop deal with this risk is something to consider), personally I'm firmly of the belief not to medal with something that works.

12-03-2018, 08:22 PM	#32
Ediz7531 Senior Member Join Date: May 2018 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 155 Original Poster	Well, camera arrived today, and anticipation quickly turned into disappointment. KEH sent me a 6x7 instead of a 67... Second time buying from them, second time unlucky. Will give them a call tomorrow.

12-04-2018, 09:43 AM	#33
rjm007 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Uxbridge UK Photos: Gallery Posts: 218	Originally posted by Ediz7531 Well, camera arrived today, and anticipation quickly turned into disappointment. KEH sent me a 6x7 instead of a 67... Second time buying from them, second time unlucky. Will give them a call tomorrow. Bummer - shame it wasn't the other way round....

12-12-2018, 08:33 PM	#34
Ediz7531 Senior Member Join Date: May 2018 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 155 Original Poster	Got lucky and found one from Roberts Camera. It’s on its way to Eric as I type. Question: it comes with a grid matte focusing screen with a center circle but without a fresnel or split. Presumably it’s either the BG-60 or BG-80. How can I tell the difference? Last edited by Ediz7531; 12-12-2018 at 09:14 PM.

12-17-2018, 09:34 PM	#36
Ediz7531 Senior Member Join Date: May 2018 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 155 Original Poster	Originally posted by tuco Congrats. As you noted both the BG-60/80 have a grid but with no split or microprisms. The BG-60 is a standard screen and is compatible with all the 6x7 lenses. The BG-80 is a brighter screen and is especially suited for telephoto lenses. You can experience corner darkening with this matte and the following lenses: The 35, 45, 55, 75, 75 shift, 55-10mm zoom and 90-180mm zoom per the Pentax 67II Interchangable Focusing Screen operating manual. The 67II interchangeable frame holding the matte has the model number on it. If the matte is taken out the the interchangeable frame to put into a 6x7/67, I don't know how you'd tell which one you have from looking at it. Perhaps if you can experience corner darkening with one of those noted lenses or not you'd know. Thanks! I only briefly tested pointing and focusing with the 105mm lens on. I also bought the 75mm 4.5 lens. Will test using that lens when the camera comes back from Eric.

12-18-2018, 09:42 AM	#37
johnha Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Lancashire, UK Photos: Albums Posts: 1,155	IIRC replacing the screen is a service centre job, if you have a preference for a different one it might be an idea to see what Eric might be able to do?

12-18-2018, 09:45 AM	#38
Ediz7531 Senior Member Join Date: May 2018 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 155 Original Poster	Originally posted by johnha IIRC replacing the screen is a service centre job, if you have a preference for a different one it might be an idea to see what Eric might be able to do? Indeed, I asked Eric and he has spare standard focusing screens. I'll see if I can get used to the grid-matte.

12-18-2018, 09:46 AM	#39
tuco Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Pugetopolis Posts: 11,020	Originally posted by johnha IIRC replacing the screen is a service centre job, if you have a preference for a different one it might be an idea to see what Eric might be able to do? I put a new matte in my 6x7. It's not hard. Just be careful not to drop any of the tiny shims and screws.

12-18-2018, 09:35 PM	#40
Silent Street Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Castlemaine, Victoria, AUS Photos: Albums Posts: 1,151	Originally posted by johnha IIRC replacing the screen is a service centre job, if you have a preference for a different one it might be an idea to see what Eric might be able to do? That's the correct advice (from Pentax) and conventional wisdom would strongly suggest following that path (service centre). You can do it yourself, but you will need patience to establish correct and accurate focus at 3 points in the centre (near and far, using a magnifier/loupe) and make adjustments with the screws and shims. Each tiny shim is matched to a specific position and sometimes a change is required when focus cannot be accurately achieved. I am hunting for a grid / microprism screen. I have never wavered from that type of exceptionally useful screen during my very long use of 35mm (Canon EOS 1N and 1V). The lack of quick viewfinder horizontal and vertical reference is a constant threat of ending up with off-level horizons, what with the spirit levels of my Manfrotto Mg head being in front, which I makes it mightily irksome to see them in certain situations (such as a recent shoot when prickly lakeside reeds just below the lens threatened to impale my fingers and face!).

12-19-2018, 08:30 AM	#41
Ediz7531 Senior Member Join Date: May 2018 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 155 Original Poster	Actually on this note, is the standard focusing screen for the 67ii (BA-61?) brighter than the standard one for the 67?

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12-19-2018, 09:39 AM	#42
tuco Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Pugetopolis Posts: 11,020	On the 6x7/67, the focus screen is spring loaded in place. No adjustments are needed. The shims are to adjust the fit of the folding hood or Prism to the body so it isn't a loose fit.

12-19-2018, 11:58 AM - 1 Like	#43
desertscape Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Arizona Posts: 1,272	Originally posted by Ediz7531 Actually on this note, is the standard focusing screen for the 67ii (BA-61?) brighter than the standard one for the 67? According to the 67II sales manual, all 4 screens, including the BA-61 were multi coated to improve finder brightness over the older models,

01-04-2019, 10:35 AM	#44
Ediz7531 Senior Member Join Date: May 2018 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 155 Original Poster	So I got the camera back from Eric. I noticed that focusing at infinity is a little bit off with either of the two lenses I bought, so I hypothesized it's a problem with the screen. Please pardon the stupid question, but does the screen being misaligned mean that whatever the screen shows as in focus won't necessarily be aligned with the image being in focus on the film plane?

01-04-2019, 10:48 AM - 1 Like	#45
Alex645 Site Supporter Join Date: May 2015 Location: Kaneohe, HI Photos: Albums Posts: 3,526	Originally posted by Ediz7531 does the screen being misaligned mean that whatever the screen shows as in focus won't necessarily be aligned with the image being in focus on the film plane? IF the screen is misaligned then yes, but it could be the lenses as well. Before jumping to conclusions, I would run a test roll with both lenses at infinity and take good notes with shots using the lens on the infinity mark and at what your eye thru the finder appears to be infinity. Shoot with the apertures wide open. Also save a couple shots for a wall or focus chart test at 5 and 10 feet using the OVF for focusing.