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10-15-2020, 09:24 AM - 1 Like   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by barondla Quote
Spectacular Andromeda image. Wouldn't have guessed it's a single image. Well done.
I give most of the credit to the lens I used. It makes things a lot easier when one is using one of the best lenses ever created. Editing also plays a big part and I am getting better at that but still have a long way to go. Using the right tool for the job along the way is key. I find the RawTherapee is a really good tool once one learns but it takes a lot of learning.

10-15-2020, 04:16 PM   #17
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As almost everybody says above, you want to stay in 16 bits as long as possible!

I would expect the 645Z to be comparable in bit depth to the K-1 and K-3, where I found the maximum pixel values to be just shy of 2^14 (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/...sensors.html):

QuoteOriginally posted by AstroDave Quote
The largest pixel data values for the K-1 (and K-3) are 16316 - just slightly below the absolute maximum we might expect for 14 bits: 2^14 = 16384
10-15-2020, 07:23 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by AstroDave Quote
I would expect the 645Z to be comparable in bit depth to the K-1 and K-3, where I found the maximum pixel values to be just shy of 2^14 (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/...sensors.html):
Yes, all three cameras have 14-bit output to RAW.


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10-15-2020, 08:39 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by AstroDave Quote
where I found the maximum pixel values to be just shy of 2^14
That sounds about right. I think that is the quoted output from those cameras and falls inline with what I have read. Given that they output 14 bits of data I would expect that the actual data is somewhat less than that but I wouldn't think it would be hugely different so saying a bit less than 14 bits of actual data is probably accurate. I am always surprised what I can bring out of the shadows in a raw file where I get close but don't clip the highlights with my K-3 at ISO 100.

10-16-2020, 12:48 AM - 1 Like   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by AstroDave Quote
I would expect the 645Z to be comparable in bit depth to the K-1 and K-3, where I found the maximum pixel values to be just shy of 2^14 (https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/...sensors.html):
QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Yes, all three cameras have 14-bit output to RAW.
Indeed, all three have 14-bit raw, but they don't record the same number of distinguishable colours and tones. DxOMark's colour sensitivity scores show the effective colour depth for each camera, and at base ISO the 645Z records 26 bits of colour depth. For the K-1, it's 25.4 bits, while the K-3 records 23.7 bits. See https://www.dxomark.com/glossary/color-depth/ for a detailed explanation...

Even now, six years after release, the 645Z is one of just a handful of cameras recording 26 bits or more of real colour depth. Phase One's IQ180 digital back is the best of all in this measurement, recording 26.5 bits (especially impressive for a 2011 product)...

Last edited by BigMackCam; 10-16-2020 at 01:28 AM.
10-16-2020, 07:54 AM   #21
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Are folks using PEF or DNG raw files out of the 645z? I've always used DNG out of all the Pentax cameras. Is there a reason to use PEF(other than Pixelshift processing with the Pentax software, which isn't a thing with the 645)?
10-16-2020, 09:55 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by SteveinSLC Quote
Are folks using PEF or DNG raw files out of the 645z? I've always used DNG out of all the Pentax cameras. Is there a reason to use PEF(other than Pixelshift processing with the Pentax software, which isn't a thing with the 645)?
Starting with *istD, I've always used PEF on all my Pentax cameras. Didn't trust Adobe back then. Guess PEF pays off now that I shoot a K-1.

Downloaded RawTherapee tonight. It opened Pentax K-1 PEF file easily. Will play more when time allows.
Thanks,
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01-03-2021, 09:03 PM - 1 Like   #23
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In depth article by Greg Benz that is worth a read. It gives a lot of information and clarification about bit depth, color gamuts and even did a comparison between LR and Capture One.

8, 12, 14 vs 16-Bit Depth: What Do You Really Need?!
01-03-2021, 11:05 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by TDvN57 Quote
In depth article by Greg Benz that is worth a read. It gives a lot of information and clarification about bit depth, color gamuts and even did a comparison between LR and Capture One.

8, 12, 14 vs 16-Bit Depth: What Do You Really Need?!
Excellent article. Thanks for posting the link. I'll need to read it a few times to absorb most of the info.

Thanks,
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01-07-2021, 03:21 AM   #25
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Adobe CC may s*ck a bit when it comes to subscription, but the photoshop alone is worth it. Affinity Photo is cheap though and is able to process 16bit TIFFs.

LR/Photoshop chain is just too convenient to pass for me. LR is not C1 level in IQ in everything but I would still need PS to finish my stuff.

My advice - drop a HBO/Netflix whatever streamer service and replace it with Adobe CC. Nothing changes in terms of cost. It is too funny that people complain about CC pricing and at the time they run 7 different subs elsewhere
01-07-2021, 05:17 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by MJKoski Quote
My advice - drop a HBO/Netflix whatever streamer service and replace it with Adobe CC. Nothing changes in terms of cost. It is too funny that people complain about CC pricing and at the time they run 7 different subs elsewhere
It's less amusing if you consider the fact that different people have different priorities, requirements and usage patterns than you, Matti.

Someone in my family watches something on Amazon Prime Video almost every day (certainly every other day), which is more often than I use raw conversion and/or image editing software. Plus, we order items from Amazon most weeks, with fast and free delivery covered by my Prime subscription, which more than pays for itself as a result. If I stopped my Prime subscription, my family would have access to less entertainment, we'd pay for many of our Amazon deliveries and be subject to longer delivery times. If I paid for Adobe CC, there'd be some weeks - even the odd month here and there - where I'd get little or no use from it.

Having used Lightroom 6 extensively in the past, Darktable, RawTherapee and GIMP do just fine for me now. Each to his or her own

Last edited by BigMackCam; 01-07-2021 at 06:19 AM.
01-07-2021, 06:30 AM   #27
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Yeah, but it is amusing to own state-of-the-art camera system and gimp it (pun intended) with bubble-gum alternatives.
01-07-2021, 06:49 AM - 1 Like   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by MJKoski Quote
Yeah, but it is amusing to own state-of-the-art camera system and gimp it (pun intended) with bubble-gum alternatives.
Darktable, RawTherapee and GIMP (especially the current versions) are extremely capable - comparable to Lightroom and Photoshop, in fact, if you know how to use them fully. Dismissing them as "bubble-gum alternatives" is, with respect, misinformed and unhelpful.

Last edited by BigMackCam; 01-07-2021 at 03:01 PM.
01-07-2021, 02:28 PM - 3 Likes   #29
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In a way, how others choose to address each other is none of my business. But one of the things I truly enjoy and value about this forum is the friendly, helpful and warm way in which we tend to communicate with one another - even when we're disagreeing or highlighting differing priorities. It's usually possible to say what needs to be said without falling out, creating a distasteful tone or ramping up the animosity such that it's only going to go in a bad direction. After all, we're all friends in photography and probably, at root, have goals we can all respect...

Tell me to butt out, obviously - but it's how I feel, and would hate to see the tone of this wonderful place become more like the way the wider world is these days :-)
01-07-2021, 02:38 PM - 2 Likes   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ed Hurst Quote
In a way, how others choose to address each other is none of my business. But one of the things I truly enjoy and value about this forum is the friendly, helpful and warm way in which we tend to communicate with one another - even when we're disagreeing or highlighting differing priorities. It's usually possible to say what needs to be said without falling out, creating a distasteful tone or ramping up the animosity such that it's only going to go in a bad direction. After all, we're all friends in photography and probably, at root, have goals we can all respect...

Tell me to butt out, obviously - but it's how I feel, and would hate to see the tone of this wonderful place become more like the way the wider world is these days :-)
You're quite right, Ed, and I've edited my last post accordingly. Thanks for the level-headed feedback
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