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07-13-2021, 04:19 PM - 1 Like   #166
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Apologies for not being able to make a clear point. I suppose my reaction was more in context of the OP's question.

From what I read I was rather disappointed with Hasselblad. Secretly I wanted it to be some high end super technology with ultra secret sauce that would produce images making Pentax (and Fuji) look like toys from amateur hour.

Apart from the Hasselblad rebranding issues of other cameras, their flagship model the, H6D seems to be a rather limited camera system. Perhaps the quality of the lenses are ultra superior, but I suspect not. The camera seem to lack functional ergonomics.

Worth $40k plus?

An alternative to the 645z?

Having a decent range of lenses?

Suitable for outdoor work on a hike, and studio as well?

Weather sealed?

I guess not.....

07-13-2021, 09:37 PM - 5 Likes   #167
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Just to prove a point - tongue in cheek

Taken with my Pentax 645z+ 200c and P645 A* 600mm - uncropped. Want more info about the Pentax 645z+ 200c?

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Last edited by TDvN57; 07-13-2021 at 09:44 PM.
07-14-2021, 02:41 AM - 2 Likes   #168
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QuoteOriginally posted by TDvN57 Quote
Just to prove a point - tongue in cheek

Taken with my Pentax 645z+ 200c and P645 A* 600mm - uncropped. Want more info about the Pentax 645z+ 200c?

.
That's tongue ON cheek
07-14-2021, 06:22 AM   #169
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QuoteOriginally posted by TDvN57 Quote
Just to prove a point - tongue in cheek

Taken with my Pentax 645z+ 200c and P645 A* 600mm - uncropped.

Want more info about the Pentax 645z+ 200c?


Nice.

At least a hint.

07-14-2021, 09:46 AM   #170
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QuoteOriginally posted by TDvN57 Quote
Just to prove a point - tongue in cheek

Taken with my Pentax 645z+ 200c and P645 A* 600mm - uncropped. Want more info about the Pentax 645z+ 200c?

.
What's a 200c ?
07-14-2021, 04:05 PM - 2 Likes   #171
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The 645z+ (plus) is a 200mpx version. The suffix "c" refers to the processor. It implements a similar technology as the Hasselblad H6D 400mpx camera, creating a super resolution 200mpx image.

To maintain portability, manage heat and speed, the AI based processing module is a separate module.

-------------------------------------

I am tempted to stop here, but in the interest of those that has not caught on yet and not wishing to mislead; the "c" module is a computer/laptop with ACR using the "Enhance" function.

Why am I posting this? What is good for the goose is good for the gander.

I suppose my motivation is to make a point that compared to other high-end brands, the 645z is still a viable camera to purchase in 2021.

The OP's question inspired me to take a hard look at some of the alternatives to the 645z and in my naivety I was "surprised" that a lot of what the others are offering are padded with truck loads of bs, padded with trade offs in functionality.

I hope you all discover that your trusty old 645z can actually function fairly well as a 200mpx camera with the "c" module you probably already own.
07-15-2021, 01:08 AM - 1 Like   #172
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
What bugging me about those medium format camera system is after sales / repair / part services. Pentax 645z is still being sold, not discontinued, even after years of being sold, which is quite reassuring from a professional use standpoint. Continued support seems similar with Hasselblad. When I look at Fuji, things look more chaotic and tuned into the rapid obsolescence, they've changed the battery model since 50S and 50R series (short lived), and lots of lenses can't be bought right now with unknown deliver lead times, which IMHO isn't professional at all. Just imagine you are a professional using Fuji MF and your lens break, so you must stop working? Not serious at all. A professional need to be sure to be able to source equipment when needed and have his gear serviced in short lead times. So yes, 645z isn't new, but there is inventory of cameras and lenses available.
Regarding Fuji lenses not available : I didn't check Fuji's situation, if it is a retailer problem only or the same on Fuji's own site, but you should keep in mind that there is a global semi-conductor supply shortage, and everything with electronics inside is potentially impacted. In what interests us, there are numerous camera manufacturers who stop orders on certain cameras or lenses, or delay the release of new models. I don't think Fuji is already stopping production of GF lenses "just for fun".

If I wanted to be sarcastic, I would add that today, what is available is what is in the inventory and not selling very well in normal times...


QuoteOriginally posted by TDvN57 Quote
Read about the Hasselblad history and camera range over the weekend. Was surprised to see how much "sharing" of rebranded models are going on in the market. At some point Hasselblad sold Fuji cameras re-branded and Leica sold rebranded Panasonics and Sony cameras. The cheaper X1D 50 is basically a Fuji GFX 50 camera.

Hasselblad shamelessly market their new H6D100s with $15,000 upgrade as a H6D400s. The two cameras are identical, except the 400s has pixel shift and compiles a 400mpx picture, for an additional $15k. Lenses are $5k and up, and very limited in focal range. Want to do long lens pictures? You need a Pentax lens with an adapter. Go figure. The specs don't really impress me although it is sort of half way between the 43x33 format and 645FF. I couldn't figure out who is making the sensor for them.
Regarding Hasselblad, they did have a difficult period regarding strategy, rebranding Sony cameras in a questionnable manner. But that's the only rebranding they have done out of a real business cooperation. They shared the X-pan with Fuji, long time ago. I think it is at the same time that they developed the H line up with Fuji, precisely. H lenses designed by Hasselblad (they have the patents), assembled by Fuji. For the body, it was sold under Fuji's name in Japan, but it was (and still is) made in Sweden.
The X1D has nothing in common with Fuji, except the sensor from Sony, the same as Pentax 645Z one as already mentionned.
Regarding lens prices : there is a huge second hand market on Hasselblad H lenses, so no problem really, even if they are more expensive (but more modern too) than Pentax in average.
I wouldn't call the range "limited" : they are better covered on the wide angle area (16mm equivalent in 24x36 !) than Pentax, and with HTS device, you have tilt and shift on every lens except the 120 macro. Long range is limited to 300mm (200mm equivalent in 24x36), or 510mm with extender (340mm equivalent in 24x36), I think it is enough in most cases.
The H6 camera is a joy to use, ergonomics are ultra simple and functional. Image quality is beyond what I have with the 645Z, no question.
Pentax has lots of tricks, that's obvious, but I don't feel limited at all with the H6.
Weather sealing ? Well, there is a trap with Pentax : the body is (and perfectly !), but not all the lenses. The vast majority of lenses is old and not weather sealed. I can do with 28-45, 55, and 90mm lenses, but that's all (25mm too I think, but I don't have it). On Hasselblad H, there is no official weather sealing, although it will survive a light rain. But if the conditions are dangerous, I'll take the Pentax without hesitation, but with selected lenses only.
The H6D-100c has a 54x40mm made by Sony (only manufacturer in town for MF, if you exclude the strange Leica S system). So it is much closer to old 645 film (really 56x42) than 44x33mm, I would say.
One last thing : you can put a film back on the H6 to make 645 pictures... that can be fun.


Last edited by SylvainB; 07-15-2021 at 02:48 AM.
07-15-2021, 06:52 AM   #173
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For me, Hasselblad went rogue when they discontinued the V mount. Yes, the new bodies are just wonderful but they are way out of my league.

I do own a Hasselblad 500 EL/M with Zeiss 80mm f/2.8 and 6x6 and 6x4.5 film backs. I hope to buy a digital back for it some day.
07-15-2021, 01:25 PM - 1 Like   #174
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QuoteOriginally posted by SylvainB Quote
The H6D-100c has a 54x40mm made by Sony (only manufacturer in town for MF, if you exclude the strange Leica S system). So it is much closer to old 645 film (really 56x42) than 44x33mm, I would say.
One last thing : you can put a film back on the H6 to make 645 pictures... that can be fun.
Having had a look, there are 12 lenses, of these four are HCD and are only suitable to cover 36x48. Two of these are the 24 & 28, the widest FF 645 option is the 35mm. Not a massive improvement over 33x44 really.
07-16-2021, 01:56 AM   #175
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Are the later Phase One systems weather sealed? I am suprised the H series Hasselblads aren't - given they'll be used by the top of the top landscape photographers in the world.

The lack of weather sealing on the 45-85 and 80-160 bothers me less as I bought the lenses used cheaply, but they don't half let in the sensor dirt in a way the sealed 28-45 doesn't. This is quite an important feature of lenses for digital systems as dust spots can sometimes be a real pain depending where they are in the frame
07-16-2021, 03:56 AM - 1 Like   #176
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I think it's wrong to have very high expectation from digital technology. Digital tech isn't cost effective for large sensors, and even increase from 50Mpixel to 100Mpixel isn't much, actually. For really large print, folks using digital (even digital MF) have stitched mosaics of images into >250Mpixel files, sometimes up to gigapixel files.That's why I may never even consider medium format digital and go straight to large format film, get those 400Mpixels scan from an 8x10" view camera, there's no digital equivalent to replace such format. Let's get those 400Mpixel out of a single exposure, now we talk about something special...
07-16-2021, 10:17 AM - 2 Likes   #177
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QuoteOriginally posted by johnha Quote
Having had a look, there are 12 lenses, of these four are HCD and are only suitable to cover 36x48. Two of these are the 24 & 28, the widest FF 645 option is the 35mm. Not a massive improvement over 33x44 really.
Officially, yes, this is correct, but in the real world, they do work on bigger sensor. I use the HCD24 on the 54x40mm sensor without problem. It is like some DA lenses that were designed for smaller APS-C sensors because they had nothing bigger at the time of development, but in fact work on FF.
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