[maxlfreedman]

Hello all!

I am in the process of moving away from the land of film, and moving to a digital camera system. My previous setup consisted of a hasselblad 500c and a nikon coolscan 8000 for scanning, however for me it is time to move fully digital (I mean I already scan everything). Originally I was looking at the fuji GFX cameras, but even used they're fairly pricy. A friend of mine told me about the pentax 645 digital cams, and they seem intriguing.

The 645D seems to check off all my boxes honestly. I'm coming from a manual focus system, so any autofocus is a plus, and 1 fps is plenty. I mostly shoot landscape type work, with a little bit of daylight street mixed in for fun while traveling. Therefore, I don't think the CCD sensor (and accompanying "bad" high iso performance) is that big a deal, even with film I rarely shot film stocks that were iso 400 or higher. My question is that although the 645D has a fairly high megapixel sensor, and the pentax 645 mount has plenty of good glass, how are users of the 645D liking the system 10 years after the initial release? Is there anything I should watch out for? I figure I can save money now getting and heavily using a 645D, and then move to a 645z if I feel it's needed. But that of course depends on if the 645D is still a competitive system at the price they seem to be going for these days.

Thank you so much for your help!

[drivel]

It’s slow to load photos after being taken, but if you’re working purely methodically, I wouldn’t expect it to be a problem. You could always get a 645 film camera when you eventually feel the need to shoot film.

Hello all!

I am in the process of moving away from the land of film, and moving to a digital camera system. My previous setup consisted of a hasselblad 500c and a nikon coolscan 8000 for scanning, however for me it is time to move fully digital (I mean I already scan everything). Originally I was looking at the fuji GFX cameras, but even used they're fairly pricy. A friend of mine told me about the pentax 645 digital cams, and they seem intriguing.

The 645D seems to check off all my boxes honestly. I'm coming from a manual focus system, so any autofocus is a plus, and 1 fps is plenty. I mostly shoot landscape type work, with a little bit of daylight street mixed in for fun while traveling. Therefore, I don't think the CCD sensor (and accompanying "bad" high iso performance) is that big a deal, even with film I rarely shot film stocks that were iso 400 or higher. My question is that although the 645D has a fairly high megapixel sensor, and the pentax 645 mount has plenty of good glass, how are users of the 645D liking the system 10 years after the initial release? Is there anything I should watch out for? I figure I can save money now getting and heavily using a 645D, and then move to a 645z if I feel it's needed. But that of course depends on if the 645D is still a competitive system at the price they seem to be going for these days.

Thank you so much for your help!

[UncleVanya]

That is a tough question. I don't shoot medium format so take what I say with a grain of salt.

PRO:
40mp is still pretty reasonable for any camera. Medium Format is stable at 50 and 100mp typical - and 40mp for an older camera isn't bad.
Uses the same (affordable) lenses that worked on the 645 film cameras as well as some newer lenses. These also work on the 645z or 645 film bodies if you add one.
CCD colors - if that's your cup of tea.

CON:
Cropped 645 - basically about a 1.3x upscale of Full Frame. This applies to MOST of the more affordable medium format digital cameras.
Dynamic Range is compressed compared to modern sensors. EDIT: BY SOME SOURCES: Even a basic K-3 (not a K-3iii or even K-3ii) has about the same or more dynamic range. EDIT: DXOMARK says the dynamic range is better than I realized.
Very limited support for this system outside of Ricoh. This may be a non-factor unless you are a professional with obligations that requires access to accessories and support with a professional level.

I'm leaving out the slow frame rate, poor low light performance etc. as you indicated these were not factors.

[SylvainB]

The 645D is slow, without liveview, but still very capable camera. The rear screen is fixed, too. The crop factor has been mentioned by Uncle Vanya.
If you are ready to work without liveview on a slow camera by today's standard, then you should be fine. The 645D was an excellent camera when it was released, so it is able to take fine pictures. It is just that there are more modern cameras now, with new tricks and better performances that may not be of interest to you, as I see it.

[RICHARD L.]

I considered the 645D when I decided to purchase a medium-format digital but the 50 000 actuations limit of the shutter (I know, this is just an "estimate" of the probable longevity of the shutter) made me choose a 645Z instead. I never regretted my choice. This 50 Mpx is an excellent camera.


Regards

[ProfessorBuzz]

I have a Z and bought a D as backup. Works fine.

[ChristianRock]

I considered the 645D when I decided to purchase a medium-format digital but the 50 000 actuations limit of the shutter (I know, this is just an "estimate" of the probable longevity of the shutter) made me choose a 645Z instead. I never regretted my choice. This 50 Mpx is an excellent camera.


Regards

As a curiosity, do we have anyone who have exceeded 50K shutter actuations on the 645D? Perhaps the estimate was a bit conservative? Or do we have people who have had their shutter go fail, and if so, what was the shutter count?

[UncleVanya]

As a curiosity, do we have anyone who have exceeded 50K shutter actuations on the 645D? Perhaps the estimate was a bit conservative? Or do we have people who have had their shutter go fail, and if so, what was the shutter count?

645D second shutter failure - PentaxForums.com

645z Shutter Reliability - PentaxForums.com

[w2ck]

Hi,

Completely usable. Low costs for everything. I went the D route last year and it worked out just fine.

Old shooter with new 645D - PentaxForums.com

Stan

[rdenney]

Cameras change fast, but photography does not. A camera that produced stunning images that made us all drool in envy in 2010 still has that capability now, if we approach it that way.


If, on the other hand, we insist on having every current feature, we will never be happy with whatever camera we have, and would always be looking to replace it. That's a decision each person has to make.

Rick "who hates throwing stuff that still works well in the landfill" Denney

[ChristianRock]

Cameras change fast, but photography does not. A camera that produced stunning images that made us all drool in envy in 2010 still has that capability now, if we approach it that way.


If, on the other hand, we insist on having every current feature, we will never be happy with whatever camera we have, and would always be looking to replace it. That's a decision each person has to make.

Rick "who throwing stuff that still works well in the landfill" Denney

I would say that, because of advances in post processing, old cameras keep getting better with time!

Today we have better noise handling and - more important to me - better demosaic'ing. The amount of detail that I get out of my lenses with the K200D developing them via RawTherapee and the AMaZe algorithm, gets me very excited. There's so much details - provided I'm using a good lens - that I don't add any sharpening - even the default sharpening - otherwise the pictures get that ugly over-sharpened look! I think that started in RawTherapee 5.6 (I'm on 5.8 now) despite it having AMaZe before that - but the implementation of it must be different now. I compared K-3 files from RawTherapee and DarkTable both using the demosaic algorithm from AMaZe and RawTherapee clearly gets more details out of the files.

I also get much, much better color handling and all other PP functions are better now than they were a few years ago when I was using Corel Aftershot Pro - which I liked back in the mid 2010s but now things are better.

I've said it before - opening and processing K200D CCD files with RawTherapee actually brings me joy. I can only imagine what 645D files would be like! It's my dream camera but alas, I don't know if I'll ever own one.

[carddassxx]

I concur with rdenney. It's a great system and I haven't chased after any new camera system since purchasing my first 645D in 2017.

It started with 8K actuations and as of last weekend this camera has reached 60K.
Recently the shutter sounds squeaky or sticky. I think it's because of the cold as I noticed it about 7 months ago when it still cool outside in Spring by me (Northern Germany) but the problem went away when it got warmer. This past weekend, when I last used it outside, I took 120 shots and only recall hearing it have this issue a few times. Maybe less than 5 times.

I found a good deal on another used 645D in 2019 and snagged it to have as a backup and not switch lenses as much. i.e. 90mm / 35mm or 55mm / 150mm
This second D body had a clear shutter issue as soon as I received it and I brought in for repairs to get fixed. Turned out the shutter just needed some oil / lubrication. It's been working fine ever since. I think what is happening with my first body might be the same lubrication issue although I won't know for sure until I bring it in. This second body has 25K actuations now.

And I just so happened to find a great deal on a 645Z recently (thanks Fuji GFX switchers!) and added that to my arsenal.
I use both the D and Z somewhat interchangeably with the Z being used more for low-light or high contrast daytime scenes where I can take advantage of that CMOS sensor.

I'm just a hobbyist and photograph mostly my kids (both under 5) and the 645D has always been great and I suppose I use it for action work?
I have missed shots because of the D's slow FPS and also review time where I wanted to see if I hit focus / got the moment and my kids would just run off.
It feels like a photo can take 5-10 seconds sometimes to show up on screen. The Z is amazing with it's less than 1 second review speed and has helped in certain situations where I needed to fire and review faster.

I've also missed shots on the D because of missing focus. Not sure if it's the autofocus system or the peculiarities with whatever lens I was using with the D.
I haven't used the Z system long enough to say if I'm having similar focus 'misses' to generalize it as being medium format's narrow depth of field or something specific to the D.

The Z's live preview is quite nice and great for still work. It's the one thing I missed on the D as I come from the video world and had used a GFX system at an old job often.
That said, when I'm out and about, I'm not using live preview at all so the D still gets equal usage despite having the Z now.

I definitely plan on using, and repairing if needed, the 645D for years to come.

[stevebrot]

Forum member mattb123 shared this stitched pano done with a 645D a few days ago on the "Post your medium format photos" thread where he is a frequent contributor. He seems to be able to make it work.





Steve

[EUMack]

I concur with rdenney. It's a great system and I haven't chased after any new camera system since purchasing my first 645D in 2017.

It started with 8K actuations and as of last weekend this camera has reached 60K.
Recently the shutter sounds squeaky or sticky. I think it's because of the cold as I noticed it about 7 months ago when it still cool outside in Spring by me (Northern Germany) but the problem went away when it got warmer. This past weekend, when I last used it outside, I took 120 shots and only recall hearing it have this issue a few times. Maybe less than 5 times.

I found a good deal on another used 645D in 2019 and snagged it to have as a backup and not switch lenses as much. i.e. 90mm / 35mm or 55mm / 150mm
This second D body had a clear shutter issue as soon as I received it and I brought in for repairs to get fixed. Turned out the shutter just needed some oil / lubrication. It's been working fine ever since. I think what is happening with my first body might be the same lubrication issue although I won't know for sure until I bring it in. This second body has 25K actuations now.

And I just so happened to find a great deal on a 645Z recently (thanks Fuji GFX switchers!) and added that to my arsenal.
I use both the D and Z somewhat interchangeably with the Z being used more for low-light or high contrast daytime scenes where I can take advantage of that CMOS sensor.

I'm just a hobbyist and photograph mostly my kids (both under 5) and the 645D has always been great and I suppose I use it for action work?
I have missed shots because of the D's slow FPS and also review time where I wanted to see if I hit focus / got the moment and my kids would just run off.
It feels like a photo can take 5-10 seconds sometimes to show up on screen. The Z is amazing with it's less than 1 second review speed and has helped in certain situations where I needed to fire and review faster.

I've also missed shots on the D because of missing focus. Not sure if it's the autofocus system or the peculiarities with whatever lens I was using with the D.
I haven't used the Z system long enough to say if I'm having similar focus 'misses' to generalize it as being medium format's narrow depth of field or something specific to the D.

The Z's live preview is quite nice and great for still work. It's the one thing I missed on the D as I come from the video world and had used a GFX system at an old job often.
That said, when I'm out and about, I'm not using live preview at all so the D still gets equal usage despite having the Z now.

I definitely plan on using, and repairing if needed, the 645D for years to come.

Hi,

I’m new to the forum. I love the Pentax 645d CCD colors, however was considering selling mine because I’ve called Pentax and they no longer service this model. May I ask where you got your shutter serviced? Would they also be able to do a replacement? Thank you!

[UncleVanya]

Hi,

I’m new to the forum. I love the Pentax 645d CCD colors, however was considering selling mine because I’ve called Pentax and they no longer service this model. May I ask where you got your shutter serviced? Would they also be able to do a replacement? Thank you!

This may sound hard spirited but I’m not trying to be a jerk:

1) Pentax doesn’t exist as a company Ricoh Imaging is perhaps the closest thing to it you can get. Pentax is a brand.

2) at least in most parts of the world the official repair channels are not owned by Ricoh Imaging - in the USA Precision is the authorized warranty services provider but there are some additional companies that do repair work. Parts can be tricky. Even some currently selling lenses like the DA* 50-135 can be hard to get parts for (at least for out of warranty repairs).

3) even if it is hard to repair a spare body is potentially a cheap insurance policy

Now with all that said… it does give one pause to invest in a system that may not be repairable.