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07-07-2009, 05:22 PM   #1
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Obsession

Hi All,

I have an obsession with panoramic format and while i would love to shoot 617, i realise that i can't have everything, seeing i have a 67 and K20D and the expense is not justified for another system.

So, i am going to make a panoramic system based on 67 lenses and K20D ( K-mount digital camera) to create the wide format.

Basically it will be an sliding adapter plate which accepts 67 lenses and K20D (or any KMount) where it can slide sideways from one side across to the other until the lens vignettes. There will be a scale where you know where each frame starts and ends. Then in software you can perform a stitch, which should be very easy because it will be a flat plane surface without curvature distortions of a standard digital panoramic.

So the benefit will be a higher def image than which can be created from a K20D in one shot alone. It will also be a flat plane image that in theory should be easy to stitch as all images are flat not curved. The image size is completely variable up to the 70mm wide as per 67 format equiv of 4.4 apsc images at 23mm X 15mm. 70mm allows 4.4 portrait images at up to 65meg pixel at 3:1 ratio.

I need to try and find an old 6x7 and use the lens mount, so if anyone has one they can part with ?

If anyone has any ideas etc they would like to offer, i am listening. I will add some pictures, diagrams etc as time goes on. Seems a perfect combo really, 67 lenses are cheap, and available in a good range and the Kmount gives me plenty of options.

A digital panorama pentax camera.......mmmm

Cheers Neil


Last edited by knumbnutz; 07-07-2009 at 06:49 PM.
07-08-2009, 12:57 PM   #2
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Hi Neil –
I share your obsession, but I’m having trouble getting my head around your concept. I’ve been contemplating getting a 67ii and trying panoramas with that. I’ll be watching your thread to see how your project goes. Good luck.
07-08-2009, 03:47 PM   #3
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Hi Mike,

I'm glad i'm not the only one.

Just a small update, I have bought a 67 lens to PK mount adapter. This will give me the exact depth i have to play with as well as both mounts. Cost $100AU

I think the whole pano adapter will cost maybe $250.
I wish i still had my milling machine right now, it would be done oh so easily...

Cheers Neil
07-08-2009, 03:58 PM   #4
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Neat idea. Basically you're building a shift adaptor to project the 67 image circle onto the APS-C sensor. I am sure it would work as long as you keep the flange distance. I guess you will be using the 45mm for the wide landscape? It seems like you can shift by quite a bit! I wonder how it would work out.

I have a Hartblei super-rotator 65mm TS lens. If you are interested I can capture 2 shifted images for you to see if that's roughly what you're after (I haven't tried it myself). On a separate note, have you looked into the Pentacon Six lenses? There are shift adaptors for P6 to K that's sold on *bay, I think they go for ~$80. The Mir 45mm (not the greatest) sells for ~$120 so the whole setup could be had for much less than hacking at the expensive 67-K adaptor. Or there's the CZJ Flektogon 50mm for a little more money if you're after quality.

Just an idea

07-08-2009, 08:44 PM   #5
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Howdy Squinty Eyes,

Thanks for the info !! I would love to have the images from the Hartblei sr 65mm TS, but would also love to see what it is and looks like.

Would you have links at all for the Mir45 ?

The adapter is cheap, a chinese copy on the pentax unit. I am actually just using the bits off it, rather than hacking it as such. I saw someone trying to sell the genuine pentax version for about $250.

Great Info

Cheers Neil
07-08-2009, 10:56 PM   #6
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Neil,
What you're embarking on sounds very similar to the Zoerk PSA (panoramic shift adapter).
FWIW, the 45/5 has an image circle that covers an area much bigger than the 6x7 format, so using an APS-C camera you should be able to stitch quite a few frames. A home made adapter would allow you to fully exploit the large image circle, unlike the commercially available models.

Scott
07-08-2009, 11:25 PM   #7
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Thanks Scott.

The beauty is, that apart from the 45 alone, there are many lenses to choose from in the 67 range, some of which i have already, but not yet the 45 although i'm trying.

Reality is that the 617 format is expensive because of the lenses and then you still go thru the scanning procedure etc etc. This will eliminate all that.

Really there is no downside except having to take multiple images and stitch them, the offset is that there is focus comfirm, exposure metering, no out sourced processing of film and scanning and major cost difference (lenses).

Cheers Neil
07-08-2009, 11:32 PM   #8
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Hey Scott,
I Just had a look at their adapter and yes that is it.
They dont go into much detail but I think that the one i will build will be much bigger, taking in the full image circle.
Cheers Neil


QuoteOriginally posted by surfotog Quote
Neil,
What you're embarking on sounds very similar to the Zoerk PSA (panoramic shift adapter).
FWIW, the 45/5 has an image circle that covers an area much bigger than the 6x7 format, so using an APS-C camera you should be able to stitch quite a few frames. A home made adapter would allow you to fully exploit the large image circle, unlike the commercially available models.

Scott


07-09-2009, 12:39 AM   #9
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That's the beauty of the do it yourself model, putting that big image circle to use. From what i understand, a lot of the P67 lenses have similarly large image circles, not just the 45/4. If you orient the camera vertically you should be able to get 6 or 7 frames, so you're looking at 85- 100 megapixels or so, pretty cool.
If you could incorporate tilt, that would be even better. good luck with the project.

Scott
07-09-2009, 06:16 AM   #10
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interested to see what your hacked adapter will look like and the results!
07-22-2009, 01:12 AM   #11
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Hi all,
Just a quick update.

Today arrived by post an almost new 45mm, the PK-67 adapter and 165mm F2.8 and 300mm F4.
The length is perfect to clear the flash housing, pfew !

This weekend or the next i will make the adapter.

Will there be any interested people in purchasing an adapter if it is a reasonable cost (approx $200US~). I am only asking because if there is I will make 2 rather than one as a sample.

Cheers Neil
07-22-2009, 08:59 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by knumbnutz Quote
Basically it will be an sliding adapter plate which accepts 67 lenses and K20D (or any KMount) where it can slide sideways from one side across to the other until the lens vignettes. There will be a scale where you know where each frame starts and ends. Then in software you can perform a stitch, which should be very easy because it will be a flat plane surface without curvature distortions of a standard digital panoramic.

Is all this really necessary? Isn't there software available that stitch as many images as you like and correct for abberations and exposure variations?
07-22-2009, 10:47 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
Is all this really necessary? Isn't there software available that stitch as many images as you like and correct for abberations and exposure variations?
I think with this shift approach the main benefit is that you don't need to correct for the nodal point moving between exposures, thus getting very easy to merge images straight out of the camera.
07-22-2009, 11:13 AM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by SquintyEyes Quote
I think with this shift approach the main benefit is that you don't need to correct for the nodal point moving between exposures, thus getting very easy to merge images straight out of the camera.
What I'm hinting at is that I believe there are software that merge images automatically in spite of different nodal point or aberation. You can even hand hold your camera. Maybe I'm wrong? I've never tried but will soon as I get the K-7.....
07-22-2009, 06:34 PM   #15
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Hi Pal,

Yes software can to a point manipulate images. Nodal points and perspective, not sure.
I have used autostitch which mostly does ok but plenty of times is not up to the job.

I have used CS3 and elements and while they have perspective shift and tilt, it is far from satifactory for me as u loose data through stretching.

Ultimately I believe there is no more perfect solution than a perfect straight image plane.
It is easy to do and processing will be a piece of cake. No blending, no ghosting, no shift, no nodal point, nothing but a flat image.
There is a place for both methods of course but only one is totally distortion free.

Cheers Neil
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