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10-22-2010, 10:29 PM   #31
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You already received some good advice, and that is what this forum is about. I just may add a comment on the thread title: Inexpensive lenses to try Manual Focus ??

Not all MF lenses are inexpensive and there are some excellent, high-quality and more expensive MF lenses. That is, the Zeiss and Voigtlander lenses are very-highly regarded by the Pentaxian community, with an excellent image quality (IQ), and both series are MF. I cannot comment much on the Zeiss lenses (I do not have one and there are few discussions). But there are several threads and discussions in this forum about the Voigtlander lenses. All are very positive.

These high-quality MF lenses might not be in your budget, for now, but you might consider for future investment. When I was looking for a 50mm lens, I received some excellent advice through this forum that led me to the Voigtlander Nokton 58mm f1.4. The price was relatively reasonable at the time, and I never regret my decision. This is possibly my best lens investment too date.

Food for thoughts....

10-22-2010, 10:48 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
A series lenses communicate focal length and aperture to the camera, so it is saved in EXIF. K and M series lenses and M-42 lenses do not.
No, they don't but he has a K-7 and he is prompted to what focal length is on the camera when he turns it on. So focal length and shutter speed will be recorded to the metadata in Tv mode.
10-22-2010, 11:26 PM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
OK, I think I want that M 50/1.7.

From the Pentax Lens Series Explained article:

"Some recent bodies cannot use M and K lenses or only with some limitations. An example are the *ist D and K (digital) series. In M mode you set the aperture using the aperture ring on the lens; the camera will set the shutter speed when you press the green button (or AE-L button if the camera has no green button). Or you can set the shutter speed manually (there is no exposure read out in the finder to assist you)."

So it will work on the K-7? It sounds like I select my aperture using the ring, frame my shot, and press the green button, and the shutter speed will be set (probably will vary depending on the metering mode I have chosen?)? Now, after I let up on the green button, that shutter speed is set, and I can adjust it if I want....do I have that right?

By the way, for Pentax lenses that don't have an A-position, what are the normal increments, or does it vary from lens to lens?
Todd, it's easier than it sounds, especially if you have shot manual before;

For any pre "A" lens
- Set the camera to "M" mode
- Set the aperture you want
- Focus
- Push the Green button (hold it down for half a second)
- Shoot (sometimes a test shot)
- Use one of the wheels to quickly change shutter speed up or down if needed and you're set.

Depending on the conditions, you're usually good to go for a whole series of shots without having to touch anything.

It's quite easy and if you choose a manual focus "A" series lens, you can use other modes, like Av.

Warning.....It might become addictive.....Pentax has released some legendary lenses over the years that are still hard to beat, but they are expensive. Not that I have them, but the A*85/1.4, or a A*400/2.8 are terrific.

Hope you share some shots with whichever lens you choose.
10-23-2010, 01:09 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
OK, I think I want that M 50/1.7.
...
So it will work on the K-7? It sounds like I select my aperture using the ring, frame my shot, and press the green button, and the shutter speed will be set (probably will vary depending on the metering mode I have chosen?)? Now, after I let up on the green button, that shutter speed is set, and I can adjust it if I want....do I have that right?
That is how it works. On my k-x it doesn't matter how long the green button is kept pressed though: for each press the body does the "stop down to the aperture set on the ring, meter and set exposure time, restore aperture to fully open" drill on its own schedule, in a fraction of a second.

QuoteQuote:
By the way, for Pentax lenses that don't have an A-position, what are the normal increments, or does it vary from lens to lens?
My M50/1.7 has half-stop increments except between 16-22 (min.) there is no intermediate position. I belive this is typical for both Pentax M lenses (and A lenses too).

The M50/1.7 is probably one of the best pieces to get started with, it is reasonably priced, can be found without too much trouble, and I haven't seen the IQ receive anything but praise. Also, the build quality and feel in operation are top notch, it is a plesure to use.

10-23-2010, 06:27 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by tuco Quote
No, they don't but he has a K-7 and he is prompted to what focal length is on the camera when he turns it on. So focal length and shutter speed will be recorded to the metadata in Tv mode.
Yes, they don't communicate focal length. They do communicate aperture. Setting focal length for SR has become so automatic for me that I don't even realize I'm doing it. I mostly shoot a 50mm so I don't even have to change focal length most of the time.
10-23-2010, 07:31 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
Thanks to you both. Between those two, the M-lens is definitely looking more attractive, as I am gathering from the reviews that it's got nicer OOF areas, and sharper wide open. How do I find out what the focus throw is for this lens?
my A 1.7/50 goes about 225 degrees. don't know about the M version.
10-23-2010, 08:37 AM   #37
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I find shooting my Super Taks in Tv mode more convenient than pushing that green button when outdoors in good light. You can keep the lens on manual then.
10-23-2010, 11:04 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
Still want some other focal lengths, though. The M42 lenses sound very interesting.
I would stick to K, M or A series. All K-mount, no adapters, easy to swap with DA70: no need to remove adapter ring (may be important).

QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
With some Nikon lenses, I have to set the aperture ring to the smallest aperture for the body to be able to adjust aperture; is that analogous to the "A" position you're referring to?
Yes. There is only a minor difference in construction: Pentax A/F/FA lenses have the "A" position on the aperture ring that is next to the smallest aperture. Click the ring to A and the lens stays locked at the smallest aperture, but in addition lens also signals the body it is in "auto aperture" mode. Same principle as with Nikkor lenses, a bit different implementation.

QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
OK, I think I want that M 50/1.7
Note that 50/1.7 in M, A, F and FA versions are optically IDENTICAL.

QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
So it will work on the K-7? It sounds like I select my aperture using the ring, frame my shot, and press the green button, and the shutter speed will be set (probably will vary depending on the metering mode I have chosen?)? Now, after I let up on the green button, that shutter speed is set, and I can adjust it if I want....do I have that right?
100% right.

Upon pressing the green button you will just hear a short "slap" while stop-down metering is performed and that's all. Takes 1/4s.

QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
By the way, for Pentax lenses that don't have an A-position, what are the normal increments, or does it vary from lens to lens?
Depends on the lens. Usually 1/2 stop, except at smallest apertures. So there are half-clicks, but usually not after f/16, sometimes after f/11. Again, may be different for different lenses.

10-23-2010, 11:27 AM   #39
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Hey, everyone, thank you SO much, I really appreciate all of the responses. I can't wait to get my hands on this camera! I'm a read-the-manual kinda guy, so a lot of the simpler stuff should be cleared up for me within a few hours of getting it, reading, and testing. But I know I'll still have questions, and it looks like this forum will be an awesome place to get help.

QuoteOriginally posted by Ivan Glisin Quote
I would stick to K, M or A series. All K-mount, no adapters, easy to swap with DA70: no need to remove adapter ring (may be important).
This is a good point, and I'll have to see how inconvenient it is for me to install/remove the adapter ring. It may well be that I prefer not to do it unless absolutely necessary. But I'm sure I will get one to try at least, to have access to a larger set of lenses for the future.

QuoteOriginally posted by Ivan Glisin Quote
Note that 50/1.7 in M, A, F and FA versions are optically IDENTICAL.
This sort of sounds like an argument for finding an A version, is that right? I'm sure I would have to pay more for autofocus, so I probably won't be looking for an F or an FA right away, but what about the difference between A and M? If they are optically identical, why wouldn't I want the A? Does the build quality go down or anything?
10-23-2010, 12:07 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
... but what about the difference between A and M? If they are optically identical, why wouldn't I want the A? Does the build quality go down or anything?
It can be a personal choice. But, in general, you'll find a 'A' lens more integrated with a DSLR than a 'M' lens for such things as Av mode and the camera's flash, for example.
10-23-2010, 12:08 PM - 1 Like   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
...
This sort of sounds like an argument for finding an A version, is that right? I'm sure I would have to pay more for autofocus, so I probably won't be looking for an F or an FA right away, but what about the difference between A and M? If they are optically identical, why wouldn't I want the A? Does the build quality go down or anything?
A lenses are more expensive (roughly like $50 vs. $100), but then more convenient to use as auto modes work, including w. built-in / ttl flash (*). Some consider build quality lower in the sense that instead of a all metal construction (M), some plastic is used (A). The aperture ring in fact feels a bit flimsier, but then it can stay at 'A' as aperture can be set with body dial(s). Focus feel is similar (just right, IMHO) with both A and M.

BTW ... I think the manuals for current models are available online as .PDFs. I did read mine while the k-x was in transit :-)

(*) With the k-x multi-segment metering is not available for some reason though, only CW and spot.
10-23-2010, 01:36 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by jolepp Quote
A lenses are more expensive (roughly like $50 vs. $100), but then more convenient to use as auto modes work, including w. built-in / ttl flash (*). Some consider build quality lower in the sense that instead of a all metal construction (M), some plastic is used (A). The aperture ring in fact feels a bit flimsier, but then it can stay at 'A' as aperture can be set with body dial(s). Focus feel is similar (just right, IMHO) with both A and M.

BTW ... I think the manuals for current models are available online as .PDFs. I did read mine while the k-x was in transit :-)

(*) With the k-x multi-segment metering is not available for some reason though, only CW and spot.
Multisegment metering is available with A lenses, the AF point is fixed to center point. Page 282-283 of the manual.
10-23-2010, 02:10 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Todd Adamson Quote
This sort of sounds like an argument for finding an A version, is that right? I'm sure I would have to pay more for autofocus, so I probably won't be looking for an F or an FA right away, but what about the difference between A and M? If they are optically identical, why wouldn't I want the A? Does the build quality go down or anything?
If you want classic Pentax MF lenses to really use with your DSLR, then A series is the way to go. They are very well made and MF feel is excellent, like with Ms. There is a bit of plastic here or there, but it's really very sparse, high quality and all outside, while lens interiors are made of metal like with M series.

With A lenses you'll be able to use all metering modes and P-TTL flash operation (including wireless flash control). Both not possible with M lenses. "A" lenses allow for saving aperture information in EXIF, again not possible with M lenses. In fact, the only thing you will not have with A series lenses is auto focus.

If you could also find A20/2.8 or A24/2.8 that would be great, but beware of high prices: mentioned lenses would typically sell at well over 50% the price of a brand new DA 21 Limited, sometimes even at comparable price. In that case better get DA 21 Limited and you'll be good to go.

If you are looking for auto focus lenses, avoid F series. Most have very flimsy construction. Stick to FA and DA.
10-23-2010, 02:22 PM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
That would be the one, but it is called Mount Adapter K not Mount Adapter B.

PentaxWebstore Mount Adapter K(35m m Screwmount to Bayonet)

I don't know why Chalion thinks they don't make them anymore. They have been in production for 35 years. Pentax must have made millions of them. I paid about $20 for mine on eBay last December.
That's because i'm getting senile in my old age and didn't look on the pentax home store. I just made an assumption that since the transfer to digital cameras they would have stopped production of the adapters. I'm pleased they still make them.

I will say though that the knock off adapters with wider flanges look to be a good option to short the lens contacts to assist with CIF (capture in focus), instead of using aluminum foil to do so while using Takumar lenses.

(CIF is a whole different kettle of fish. Many threads here in the forums about it).
10-23-2010, 02:41 PM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
Multisegment metering is available with A lenses, the AF point is fixed to center point. Page 282-283 of the manual.
Indeed, it was M-lenses that lose multi-segment metering, not A. It would be interesting to know why exactly this is, though. With MF lenses the only use of AF points is focus indication to assist MF so switching to center point only would seem to make sense with the k-x.
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