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10-29-2010, 04:18 PM   #16
Ira
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The K-x has come down in price so much, and considering its high ISO capabilities and other features, I can't see the reasoning for passing that up for an older model.

That being said, I have seen dozens of shots with the 20 that make me think that sensor is actually better, regardless of what the evidence and specs indicate.

Maybe guys with 20s just try harder.

10-29-2010, 04:24 PM   #17
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To the OP:

It seems that many people in this thread think little of the K10 at this point. Personally I feel differently about the issue. The K10 now has a very high bang-for-the-buck ratio, especially compared to the K20. You would have a difficult time finding a low shutter count, well cared for example of the K20 for under $600. On the other hand, very nice examples of the K10 can often be had for under $300. The K10 usually sells for less than a comparable condition K200!

The K10 only has two real issues - What is considered a lack of high ISO performance, and issues with metering with manual lenses. Only the high ISO issue was really addressed with the K20, although I have heard there was a slight improvement on the metering front.
10-29-2010, 04:28 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ira Quote
The K-x has come down in price so much, and considering its high ISO capabilities and other features, I can't see the reasoning for passing that up for an older model.

That being said, I have seen dozens of shots with the 20 that make me think that sensor is actually better, regardless of what the evidence and specs indicate.

Maybe guys with 20s just try harder.
But the OP wants sealing, which automatically puts the k-x out of the running.
10-29-2010, 04:34 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ira Quote

Maybe guys with 20s just try harder.
My wife says I'm very trying.

10-29-2010, 08:27 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve Beswick Quote
The K10 only has two real issues - What is considered a lack of high ISO performance, and issues with metering with manual lenses. Only the high ISO issue was really addressed with the K20, although I have heard there was a slight improvement on the metering front.
What do you mean there is an issue with metering with manual lenses on the K10D and K20D?
10-30-2010, 12:55 AM   #21
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Another reason I'm wanting one of the higher end cameras is because of the pentaprism. I haven't gotten a chance to look at a K-x, but the viewfinders on other entry level DSLRs (Canon XS/Nikon D3000) are terrible. I'd be willing to sacrifice the weather sealing if manual focus lenses can be focused reliably with the stock K-x focusing screen. I'm used to split-prism screens, but a new focusing screen adds an extra $100+ to the price.
10-30-2010, 01:26 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by pasteofanchovie Quote
What do you mean there is an issue with metering with manual lenses on the K10D and K20D?
The K10 & K20 are somewhat notorious for metering errors when using lenses without the A setting on the aperture ring. I believe the furthest error reported has been around 2.5 stops, but someone will need to verify that number. The real pain about it is that not only does it vary from lens to lens, but it varies from f stop to f stop. Lenses with the A setting do not have this problem, although I do have one "A" lens that is consistently half a stop off.
10-30-2010, 01:37 AM   #23
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Still worth it? Yes, just as much as the day they were released. Great bodies, but if I was in your situation, I would go the K-7 route if you can squeeze and extra $100 from your budget.

Jason

10-30-2010, 05:38 AM   #24
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I just picked up a K20d, to replace a K100ds, and I love it. The viewfinder, LCD and Auto-WB are all better, and I find high ISO better by about a stop as well. I am sure the K-7 and K-5 are nicer, but I won't know for a couple of years at least.

In the DSLR era, cameras are "obsolete" so fast that it seems almost crazy to buy the latest one. Although I acknowledge that in general buying used electronics is a dicey proposition, a reasonably well-cared for used model offers far more value than a new one. It is certainly possible to get a lemon, or just one that reaches the end of its life early, but that is a risk I decided to take.

I was looking at a K10 until I found the k20 at the right price. I suspect it is also very nice.
10-30-2010, 06:49 AM   #25
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I bought a used k10d from a guy off of craigslist. I got it for $380, this thing is mint on the outside. 14k is the shutter count-that doesn't bother me, thats low to me. I think this camera is great. People who think its out dated just because its older and newer ones were released are crazy. It is an older body, but still an incredible bang for a buck if you're like me-A photographer for himself, just got married, and expecting a child-AKA BROKE
10-30-2010, 07:50 AM   #26
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I continue to shoot a lot with my K20. Considering the price of used ones out there right now, I would probably go that route, although I bet that the K7s will start hitting the marketplace before too awfully long. To me, the biggest benefits of the K7 over the k20 are: video, ergonomics (but it really benefits from the grip), faster fps, better white balance. The biggest negative is that high iso is not quite as good on the K7 as the K20.

The K10 is definitely a step back from the K20 as far as auto focus and high iso ability. The K10s also seem to require significant adjustment with auto focus over time. My K10 eventually required me to down load the debug program and input a significant focus adjustment. Not sure why, but a lot of other users have made a similar comment. That would make me more concerned about getting a used K10.
10-30-2010, 08:11 AM   #27
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Good Morning, Started with the K100 and upgraded 18mts ago to the K20. I like A LOT the additional control - dual selection wheels with the additional control buttons. It is a VERY nice camera.
  • The big difference between the K20 and K10 is the 20 has a CMOS sensor and the 10 has a CCD sensor (see Ash's remarks)
  • The main difference between the K20 and the K7 is body style and size - ergonomics and video.
The 20 is a lot of camera for ~400. I do landscapes (with the lowest ISO I can get - 100 at dusk/night with a tripod) and I do think that a CCD would do a tad better, but the 20 has a number of small items fixed from the 10. I like the 20 very much.

10-30-2010, 08:40 AM   #28
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In canon's world (not sure how much it stands up in pentax land) but the CCD was valued. It renders richer colors. The 1d mkI had a ccd sensor, and it was highly valued.
10-30-2010, 09:16 AM   #29
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i love my k20d and i will wait until the k5 reaches 700 on the used market untill i upgrade, in my opinion i think the k20d is a great camera able to capture images that i want it to and i'm in no way a pro so... why spend a ton of cash on a body that does more than i want or need it to, and save my cash for some killer glass.

i have the k20d grip, da*16-50 and a 50mm f2 all that will run you 1200 used maybe even less. is it worth it... yes
10-30-2010, 09:37 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve Beswick Quote
To the OP:

It seems that many people in this thread think little of the K10 at this point. Personally I feel differently about the issue. The K10 now has a very high bang-for-the-buck ratio, especially compared to the K20. You would have a difficult time finding a low shutter count, well cared for example of the K20 for under $600. On the other hand, very nice examples of the K10 can often be had for under $300. The K10 usually sells for less than a comparable condition K200!

The K10 only has two real issues - What is considered a lack of high ISO performance, and issues with metering with manual lenses. Only the high ISO issue was really addressed with the K20, although I have heard there was a slight improvement on the metering front.

I'm with Steve on this one.

The K10 is still a very viable camera. It's a little too soon to throw it under the bus just yet. I've been using mine for 4 years now and I'm still quite pleased with the results. It's true ISO performance is not great past 400 but there are a lot of good shots to be had at ISO 400 and slower. Prolonged use metering with manual lens reduces the second issue Steve noted to an annoyance level. You get used to compensation and adjust accodingly. It's not great but you can make it work. Those unwilling to deal with the learning curve in this area should probably pass on both the K10 and K20. Perhaps I'm less demanding than most in this regard but I shoot for fun not profit.

I plan to use my K10 until failure and move up to a K5 or whatever Pentax is offering at that point. I suspect/hope this will be some time in the future. Until then the K10 is still going strong.

Tom G
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