RAW file types and differences...

DaveHolmes · 11-03-2010, 02:38 AM

I'd been shooting in RAW the other day and then couldn't open my files on my Girlfriends laptop (she has PS-CS4).
I've got the 'RAW File Format' on my K-x set to PEF and it opens fine in Lightroom on my laptop...

PEF vs DNG... And... Should I switch file formats or stay PEF?

Please discuss...

cloudphreak · 11-03-2010, 03:40 AM

If she has the Adobe Camera Raw plug-in installed, PEFs should open fine. Until recently I was using Photoshop Elements 6 (3 versions old!) and with the appropriate version of ACR installed I was able to open PEFs with no problem. I have since upgraded to Elements 9 and just decided to change raw formats to DNG since I plan to use Elements for raw processing and not the Pentax Digital Camera Utility (because I find the interface completely confusing). To my untrained eye, I can't tell the difference between PEF and DNG. Just my 2 cents...

JHD · 11-03-2010, 04:09 AM

Good question - been wondering about that myself but haven't check the manual. I didn't notice any issues with the bundled software using PEF, but for some reason DNG doesn't let me adjust the exposure.

DaveHolmes · 11-03-2010, 05:36 AM

Cheers for the quick replies :-)

Originally posted by cloudphreak

If she has the Adobe Camera Raw plug-in installed, PEFs should open fine

She more than likely does not... I shall sort this out for her if I get chance/remember

Originally posted by cloudphreak

I have since upgraded to Elements 9 and just decided to change raw formats to DNG since I plan to use Elements for raw processing

I use Lightroom3 but this is (previously been using Irfanview) still fairly new to me... Would I be better off switching to DNG also?

Originally posted by JHD

but for some reason DNG doesn't let me adjust the exposure.

Is this going to happen in Lightroom also?

Cheers all... Glad you're here :-)

SpecialK · 11-03-2010, 09:46 AM

PEFs have slightly smaller file sizes. DNG is a standard file type that other programs can read. The popular programs now read PEFs (with the exception of your girlfriend's), so for casual use it does not really matter.

I'm sticking with Elements 6 :-)

einstrigger · 11-03-2010, 10:18 AM

As other mentioned, she probably hasn't updated Adobe Camera Raw plug-in. Adobe updates this every so often to support new cameras being released, both in Photoshop and Lightroom. For example, if you had a K-5 and shoot with PEF, it is still not yet supported by Adobe, but it's only a matter of time.

I say switch to DNG for greater compatibility. I believe there are other threads that have come to the conclusion that there is no drastic difference in quality between PEF or DNG, aside from a slightly smaller file size as mentioned above.

Wheatfield · 11-03-2010, 05:18 PM

I switched to DNG when the K10 came out because Adobe was being really slow to update ACR to read the K10 PEF files.
I've never bothered to switch back as I see no advantage to doing so, and several disadvantages.
I can open my K7 DNG files (and I presume my K5 files) in Photoshop 7 ACR, which is a 5 generation old software.
Not having to have the most up to date software to open files is a definite plus for me, even though I am using CS5.

**cpk** · 11-03-2010, 06:26 PM

DxO tech support suggested I use the PEF format as it is Pentax's native format. DxO was having issues with the DNG format which I had been using prior to starting to use DxO software. Now I shoot PEF files, do my initial processing in DxO, and convert them on output to the DNG format which I then process in Lightroom. Which to use would depend on the user's workflow.

bobmaxja · 11-03-2010, 06:35 PM

I am using PEF with ACDsee Pro 3 with no problem . I can also use DNG

Wheatfield · 11-04-2010, 08:55 AM

Originally posted by cpk

DxO tech support suggested I use the PEF format as it is Pentax's native format. DxO was having issues with the DNG format which I had been using prior to starting to use DxO software. Now I shoot PEF files, do my initial processing in DxO, and convert them on output to the DNG format which I then process in Lightroom. Which to use would depend on the user's workflow.

Was DXO having issues with DNG or were they just in some sort of peeing match with Adobe?
I'd find it quite surprising that DXO could reverse engineer everyone's (closed) RAW files, but they couldn't do the same with what is, essentially, an open source file system.

**cpk** · 11-04-2010, 02:02 PM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

Was DXO having issues with DNG or were they just in some sort of peeing match with Adobe?
I'd find it quite surprising that DXO could reverse engineer everyone's (closed) RAW files, but they couldn't do the same with what is, essentially, an open source file system.

This was last December when I was just starting to use DxO and was having trouble defining my workflow. I was told that Optics Pro required the native file outputs of the camera and that it was not set up to process DNG files from Pentax cameras; although they were reviewing a process to handle these DNG files. Since then I have followed the workflow described above, and it has ceased to be an issue for me. I do not know if they ever did implement that process for handling Pentax DNG files.

11-03-2010, 02:38 AM	#1
DaveHolmes Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 1,501	RAW file types and differences... I'd been shooting in RAW the other day and then couldn't open my files on my Girlfriends laptop (she has PS-CS4). I've got the 'RAW File Format' on my K-x set to PEF and it opens fine in Lightroom on my laptop... PEF vs DNG... And... Should I switch file formats or stay PEF? Please discuss...

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11-03-2010, 03:40 AM	#2
cloudphreak Junior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Ashburn, VA Photos: Albums Posts: 30	If she has the Adobe Camera Raw plug-in installed, PEFs should open fine. Until recently I was using Photoshop Elements 6 (3 versions old!) and with the appropriate version of ACR installed I was able to open PEFs with no problem. I have since upgraded to Elements 9 and just decided to change raw formats to DNG since I plan to use Elements for raw processing and not the Pentax Digital Camera Utility (because I find the interface completely confusing). To my untrained eye, I can't tell the difference between PEF and DNG. Just my 2 cents...

11-03-2010, 04:09 AM	#3
JHD Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Photos: Albums Posts: 1,406	Good question - been wondering about that myself but haven't check the manual. I didn't notice any issues with the bundled software using PEF, but for some reason DNG doesn't let me adjust the exposure.

11-03-2010, 05:36 AM	#4
DaveHolmes Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 1,501 Original Poster	Cheers for the quick replies :-) Originally posted by cloudphreak If she has the Adobe Camera Raw plug-in installed, PEFs should open fine She more than likely does not... I shall sort this out for her if I get chance/remember Originally posted by cloudphreak I have since upgraded to Elements 9 and just decided to change raw formats to DNG since I plan to use Elements for raw processing I use Lightroom3 but this is (previously been using Irfanview) still fairly new to me... Would I be better off switching to DNG also? Originally posted by JHD but for some reason DNG doesn't let me adjust the exposure. Is this going to happen in Lightroom also? Cheers all... Glad you're here :-)

11-03-2010, 09:46 AM	#5
SpecialK Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: So California Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,481	PEFs have slightly smaller file sizes. DNG is a standard file type that other programs can read. The popular programs now read PEFs (with the exception of your girlfriend's), so for casual use it does not really matter. I'm sticking with Elements 6 :-)

11-03-2010, 10:18 AM	#6
einstrigger Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Sacramento, CA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 728	As other mentioned, she probably hasn't updated Adobe Camera Raw plug-in. Adobe updates this every so often to support new cameras being released, both in Photoshop and Lightroom. For example, if you had a K-5 and shoot with PEF, it is still not yet supported by Adobe, but it's only a matter of time. I say switch to DNG for greater compatibility. I believe there are other threads that have come to the conclusion that there is no drastic difference in quality between PEF or DNG, aside from a slightly smaller file size as mentioned above.

11-03-2010, 05:18 PM	#7
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	I switched to DNG when the K10 came out because Adobe was being really slow to update ACR to read the K10 PEF files. I've never bothered to switch back as I see no advantage to doing so, and several disadvantages. I can open my K7 DNG files (and I presume my K5 files) in Photoshop 7 ACR, which is a 5 generation old software. Not having to have the most up to date software to open files is a definite plus for me, even though I am using CS5.

11-03-2010, 06:26 PM	#8
cpk Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Montreal Posts: 638	DxO tech support suggested I use the PEF format as it is Pentax's native format. DxO was having issues with the DNG format which I had been using prior to starting to use DxO software. Now I shoot PEF files, do my initial processing in DxO, and convert them on output to the DNG format which I then process in Lightroom. Which to use would depend on the user's workflow.

11-03-2010, 06:35 PM	#9
bobmaxja Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Laval, Quebec Canada Posts: 2,171	I am using PEF with ACDsee Pro 3 with no problem . I can also use DNG

11-04-2010, 08:55 AM	#10
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Originally posted by cpk DxO tech support suggested I use the PEF format as it is Pentax's native format. DxO was having issues with the DNG format which I had been using prior to starting to use DxO software. Now I shoot PEF files, do my initial processing in DxO, and convert them on output to the DNG format which I then process in Lightroom. Which to use would depend on the user's workflow. Was DXO having issues with DNG or were they just in some sort of peeing match with Adobe? I'd find it quite surprising that DXO could reverse engineer everyone's (closed) RAW files, but they couldn't do the same with what is, essentially, an open source file system.

11-04-2010, 02:02 PM	#11
cpk Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Montreal Posts: 638	Originally posted by Wheatfield Was DXO having issues with DNG or were they just in some sort of peeing match with Adobe? I'd find it quite surprising that DXO could reverse engineer everyone's (closed) RAW files, but they couldn't do the same with what is, essentially, an open source file system. This was last December when I was just starting to use DxO and was having trouble defining my workflow. I was told that Optics Pro required the native file outputs of the camera and that it was not set up to process DNG files from Pentax cameras; although they were reviewing a process to handle these DNG files. Since then I have followed the workflow described above, and it has ceased to be an issue for me. I do not know if they ever did implement that process for handling Pentax DNG files.