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11-17-2010, 01:55 PM   #31
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I wouldn't worry too much about old lens supply drying up...there are a LOT out there. The M42 Taks are just one group of old MF lenses.

On the extra step for MF I was talking about, when shooting from a tripod this would be no big deal at all. For photography with the camera in my hands, I don't like it. Here's a very simple explanation:

On lenses with an "A" on the aperture ring (like Pentax A lenses), you can set the lens to this, select your aperture on the camera instead, focus, press shutter release and the camera stops down (adjusts aperture) the lens to meter and take the exposure.

On lenses without this setting (like M, K, M42 lenses), you set the aperture ring to the aperture you want, focus, press the green button (this is the extra step) to allow the camera to meter the scene, then press the shutter release.

Reasons I (personally) don't like this process (I understand why others don't mind) are that I like to select aperture with the wheel on the camera, and I don't like having to press the green button before I shoot. This may not be a big deal to you at all.

11-17-2010, 01:59 PM   #32
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Ira is referring toM42 Taks which are spiraling in price (likely due to the wide cross platform compatibility combined with their great colour reproduction). I think a lot of canikon and m4/3 users are buying these lenses and prices have jumped significantly in the last year or so

K an M lenses can still me had at good prices, with the possible exception of the (I have bought 8 lenses recently and the most expensive was $50 and the cheapest was $13.56 - all in good shape)
the 85mm and the 20 mm do run to more money though
A lenses have climbed in price because they are easier to use (you can use aperture priority for instance and no need to stop down and meter from manual mode by pressing the green button- the one extra step - personally i don't have any issue with this i usually shoot in manual mode anyway)

If i were you I'd grab a couple of manual lenses
m or k 50 1.4 or 1.7 (the 1.7 is dirt cheap and excellent remember i grabbed one in London for 10 pounds a month ago)
The 100mm f 4.0 macro (i have the non macro f2.8 and it's amazing and tiny)
if you see any takumur m42 at the boot sales and markets and it's a reasonable price grab it, you can always sell it on and they are quite nice lenses
11-17-2010, 02:02 PM   #33
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All you have to do is go to eBay and look at the prices of M42 Taks, way preferred over k mounts because of build quality. They're all steel and built like tanks:

Not a piece of plastic to be seen.

The fast and wonderful Super-Tak 50 1.4...a gift from God...could be bought for 50 bucks about a year ago. Today, you're lucky to snag one in good condition for $125. My Super-Tak 85 1.9 in mint was had for $270. Now, fair conditions start at $275.

The popularity of Pentax DSLRs have driven up the demand for old Pentax glass. This doesn't mean
this old glass is worth the price for everyone, but this glass is certainly unique, and the demand continues to grow.

Continually driving up prices,
11-17-2010, 02:03 PM   #34
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Thank you all for your quick replies ...

edit - Is the Sigma 70-300mm DL Macro Super worth getting - I have seen it for 30? Not the recent APO version

11-17-2010, 02:08 PM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by edgedemon Quote
Can someone help me with this 1 extra step bit? I have no idea what you are referring to?
A Prime is a high quality lens with a fixed focal length - ie no zoom?
The thing is that with A-lenses the automatic exposure system(s) of the body are fully functional, with K/M you need use M-mode and green button for on-demand metering (which is not too bad, actually).

Prime = fixed focal length. Pentax prime = good (or execellent) prime :-)

QuoteQuote:
Why will the market be dry and prices sky high?
Based on NaCLH2O comments can someone give me a couple of K primes that I can keep an eye out for? Ideally for depth of field and shooting close up things such as dripping liquid?
Ira - you have me worried now - one reason for choosing Pentax was the availability of cheapish old MF lenses..

So much to learn
It seems that the price of the old Pentax lenses has been going up recently. With the oldest ones, the M42 Takumars, this seems to have been especially severe, probably because these can be used with other brands (especially Canon).

Look here for K/M/A lenses: Comprehensive Pentax Lens Listings - Pentax Lens Review Database
11-17-2010, 03:04 PM   #36
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Let me +1 the opportunity for the OP to pick up a 100mm macro. There are many varieties in manual focus, including Pentax and off-brand, A and non-A, f2.8, f3.5, and f4, 1:2 plus adapter and 1:1 macro lenses. All shapes and sizes, really. So given the OP's interests, one of these would be a natural starting place (for LBA . . .)
11-17-2010, 03:38 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by edgedemon Quote
Thank you all for your quick replies ...

edit - Is the Sigma 70-300mm DL Macro Super worth getting - I have seen it for 30? Not the recent APO version
See: Third-Party Lenses for Pentax - Pentax Third-Party Lens Review Database

In that focal length the Pentax DA(L) 55-300mm should be worth getting, it has received quite bit of praise and is not too expensive, especially if bought as a two lens kit (18-55+55-300) with the k-x or k-r.
11-17-2010, 04:07 PM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by edgedemon Quote

With regards to close up photography, where I want to shoot things like water dripping, splashes and maybe smoke - what sort of lens would I need for that...

Will I be able to get half decent depth of field with the kit lens...
FYI: The kit lens will not satisfy the serious macro photographer, but it actually doesn't suck.

It's actually pretty convenient if you *aren't* a serious macro photographer, and it's pretty good around f11-16, which'll give you about as much DOF as you could expect, and that lens comes with the quick shift focus feature, which is darn handy, even if it's the only lens I've got that has it and I keep forgetting I even *own* a kit lens. . (Manual focus is often actually easier when getting in real close)


(Also, if you want to do serious macro as a primary concern, zooms may not be your best bet. I mostly become a snapshooter saying, 'Helllooooo, Jimminy Cricket'' once magnification ratios come into play. Until the bellows come out, anyway. )


Last edited by Ratmagiclady; 11-17-2010 at 04:14 PM.
11-17-2010, 06:31 PM   #39
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The K-x's superior high ISO adds two or more stops to all your lenses. Freeze action, shoot natural light in the dark, etc, etc. The extra features of your more expensive camera options pale in comparison.

Really the only thing I miss about the K-x is the lack of a wired remote trigger (for laying photo traps maybe once a year.) - but I suspect most people won't miss that feature much. I don't miss multi-point AF at all being a mostly a non-auto mode shooter.

Dave

PS add the Pentax 55-300mm zoom and the Raynox DCR 150 - those will handle your distant subject and macro needs for a while; perhaps a long, long, while.

Last edited by newarts; 11-17-2010 at 06:40 PM.
11-17-2010, 09:09 PM   #40
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I have not really seen a need for the 55-300mm in edgemon's requirements. My route therefore would be a DA17-70 (unless you go for anything older than the K200) or equivalent and a DFA100 macro (or the mentioned sigma/tamron).

The 17-70 gives a slightly wider field of view than your S95 and while the field of view at the long end is the same. The 100mm adds a little extra reach as well.

Possibly add a DA35/2.4 for lower light conditions indoors if funds allow.

If you want to play with DOF, get an old fast manual focus lens like the M50/1.7

Good luck in your decision; I'm sure that you're now more confused than before
11-18-2010, 01:40 AM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by sterretje Quote

Good luck in your decision; I'm sure that you're now more confused than before
You could say that

Camera will be a k-r as with the cashback offer, there isn't that much between the k-x/r in price

lenses will take a bit of time, Im going to go away and read up a bit, I think a decent macro lens is in order as every summer I go insect crazy

The maybe a fast manual, Im not sure yet, I want to play with the drip effect, but in particular the reflections showing on the liquid as the impact of the drip happens. I have so many ideas for this, and it might be my inexperience as some of them may not be possible and I don't know it yet, but this is why Im buying a camera, to experiment and to produce some slightly strange photo's, and have some fun at the same time...
11-18-2010, 02:56 AM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by edgedemon Quote
You could say that

Camera will be a k-r as with the cashback offer, there isn't that much between the k-x/r in price

lenses will take a bit of time, Im going to go away and read up a bit, I think a decent macro lens is in order as every summer I go insect crazy

The maybe a fast manual, Im not sure yet, I want to play with the drip effect, but in particular the reflections showing on the liquid as the impact of the drip happens. I have so many ideas for this, and it might be my inexperience as some of them may not be possible and I don't know it yet, but this is why Im buying a camera, to experiment and to produce some slightly strange photo's, and have some fun at the same time...
Sounds like a good plan, and I can recommend the Tamron Macro 90 di as well. (I had use of a company one.)

And remember that these macros do more than just macro:



Many prefer the longer 90 to 100 lengths of macros so you're not right on top of your subject, while some people PREFER to be right on top. But for in-home/studio work, you'd rather be further back. Makes use of strobes or artificial continuous light easier.
11-18-2010, 04:14 AM   #43
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This might be my lucky day

Have just seen a used K20D with kit lens going for the same amount as a new K-x?
I have contacted the seller to see if it is still available...
How good is the K20D compared to say a K-r - I know the ISO performance is poor, but image quality and usability for a new dslr user?
WR doesn't really bother me, but if it is a good camera, I will go for it based on what you all think of the K20D

yay - it's still available - 350 for a K20D - should I?

Last edited by edgedemon; 11-18-2010 at 05:23 AM.
11-18-2010, 05:26 AM   #44
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Edgedemon

I own both the K20D and the K-x. To my mind the K20D is a better camera than the K-x. The K-x is better in low light, is smaller and lighter and has video (which I have only played with a couple of times...not my cup of tea) It is somewhat faster focusing in AF but not a lot.
The K20D has a top lcd screen, two e-dials instead of one, the ability to adjust micro focus on most all modern lenses, has an optional portrait mode battery grip, good weather sealing (even if you don't think you'll use the camera in the rain, it saves you from running for cover if you get caught in a shower).
On the subject of macro lenses, if you have decided you need a dedicated lens, I can also recommend the Tamron 90mm f2.8 macro. I own one and it is one of my favorite and versitile lenses, it does great macro of course but it is also a good portrait lens and an excellent short telephoto lens.

NaCl(between the K-x and the K20D, I'd take the K20D)H2O
11-18-2010, 06:22 AM   #45
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Thanks for that - I told the seller I was interested and would let him know tommorrow. Im going to spend tonight pouring over reviews for the k-x/r and the K20D and make my mind up for sure and let him know..

edit

If Im going to be filling a wide glass bowl with oil,water, paint and trying to drop things into it and photograph the resulting impact/splash, will the 1/4000 shutter speed be fast enough and 3fps enough?
Just checking as the k-x/r offers 1/6000 and 4.7-6fps, Im thinking of saying yes, just want to make sure that the camera can do what I want to try...

Last edited by edgedemon; 11-18-2010 at 06:44 AM.
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