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11-01-2007, 02:14 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by m8o Quote
I will completely agree with what JamesD said. I will also state the Tamron 28-75 f/2.8 is probably the best deal out there for IQ vs. cost. I have it, and many people on this board have it, and there's very little negative criticism ever uttered about it. It was my 1st lens, and I bought it instead of the kit lens.

Can it be used indoors without a flash ?

11-01-2007, 02:25 PM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by pcarfan Quote
Can it be used indoors without a flash ?
You're asking about the Tamron 28-75 f/2.8, right? I'm not sure I understand the question. Any lens can be used indoors without flash. Are you asking if it produces good results indoors without flash? Answer is, it depends on how much light there is. Not trying to be difficult here, just trying to understand your question.

If you're asking, is the Tamron 28-75 f/2.8 a good lens for indoor shooting in moderately low light, the answer is a qualified yes. More light is always better. But I've used it to shoot indoor sports in badly lit gyms. IN this respect, however, it's not sigificantly better than any other f/2.8 lens. My Sigma 18-50 f/2.8 macro and my Pentax 50-135 f/2.8 get similar (and similarly good results). I used to own the Sigma 28-70 f/2.8 -- counterpart to the Tamron lens we're discussing -- and I thought it did a very creditable job, as well. Not sure why everybody thinks the Tamron is so much better. That extra 5mm seems to have made it more attractive.

The key thing for all the lenses I just mentioned is that the max aperture is fixed throughout the range. So if I'm shooting volleyball in a gym at open up to f/2.8 at 28mm, then decide to zoom to 50 or 75mm, the aperture stays at f/2.8, rather than stopping down the way it might if I were using, say, the Pentax 18-55 kit lens. This fixed aperture throughout the range matters because it allows you to work well in manual mode (or TAv mode on the K10D). I can set my shutter and aperture and know that they'll produce a good exposure not matter what the focal length.

Will
11-01-2007, 03:11 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by NaClH2O Quote
My advice would be to get the K10D with the kit lens. Believe me I have lots of lenses and still use my kit lens. It's IQ is very good, and it has excellent color rendition. I think it's the best bang for the buck lens in my bag. And along with the K100, K100super or K10D it's ridiculously inexpensive.

The reasons for the K10D are several:
--It's a bit more sophisitcated than the K100, a camera you can grow into
--Supports the newer lenses with in the lens focusing motor, I think this is the future as far as lenses go.
--Weatherproofed which the K100 is not
--Brighter viewfinder
--$100 rebate as a kit.
In addition you could get the DA 50-200mm (which also has a rebate). Those two lenses will be able to handle most of what you would want to shoot. After you've been shooting a while you will be able to make a better determination on the focal lengths you most like to shoot at and can upgrade to a faster zoom or some primes.

NaCl(don't knock the 18-55, it's an excellent lens for the money)H2O

I agree. I have the k100d for a year now, and now I'm wishing I would have went with the K10d. I'm wanting to sell my k100d with a few manual lenses and upgrade to the k10.
11-01-2007, 04:15 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by WMBP Quote
You're asking about the Tamron 28-75 f/2.8, right? I'm not sure I understand the question. Any lens can be used indoors without flash. Are you asking if it produces good results indoors without flash? Answer is, it depends on how much light there is. Not trying to be difficult here, just trying to understand your question.

If you're asking, is the Tamron 28-75 f/2.8 a good lens for indoor shooting in moderately low light, the answer is a qualified yes. More light is always better. But I've used it to shoot indoor sports in badly lit gyms. IN this respect, however, it's not sigificantly better than any other f/2.8 lens. My Sigma 18-50 f/2.8 macro and my Pentax 50-135 f/2.8 get similar (and similarly good results). I used to own the Sigma 28-70 f/2.8 -- counterpart to the Tamron lens we're discussing -- and I thought it did a very creditable job, as well. Not sure why everybody thinks the Tamron is so much better. That extra 5mm seems to have made it more attractive.

The key thing for all the lenses I just mentioned is that the max aperture is fixed throughout the range. So if I'm shooting volleyball in a gym at open up to f/2.8 at 28mm, then decide to zoom to 50 or 75mm, the aperture stays at f/2.8, rather than stopping down the way it might if I were using, say, the Pentax 18-55 kit lens. This fixed aperture throughout the range matters because it allows you to work well in manual mode (or TAv mode on the K10D). I can set my shutter and aperture and know that they'll produce a good exposure not matter what the focal length.

Will
As always you've been very helpful Will. you've definitely answered the question. Thanks.

11-01-2007, 07:29 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by pcarfan Quote
Can it be used indoors without a flash ?
Yes, very good detail provided. Probably the most concise description of what a fixed focal length through the zoom range buys you that I've ever read there from Will. You're probably ok by now... but for closure [if even just mine ], picture's replacing a 1000 words from me: ...all taken without flash. (well, maybe one or two in the 1st link, you can tell which, but that's it)

My 1st few hours with both the camera and lens: Testing - Pentax K10D - Tamron SP AF28-75mm F2.8 album | m8o | Fotki.com
I'm especially happy with this pic and the previous one. This is one of my 1st few shot ever, and it is ONE SECOND exposure handheld at 75mm (I guess ignorance is bliss, in that I didn't know I'm not supposed to be able to do that!), into extremely dim light of my littlest dog who went to hide behind the toilet bowl as I used the flash once, that that reminds her of lightning. The light was off in the bathroom. It was a very very dim room. But you'd never know from the shot. And that's @ f/4.5, not f/2.8. The only reason the dog is 'soft' is she moved during the shot.

The next weekend @ my friends house Father's Day: Father's Day 2007 album | m8o | Fotki.com

Classic Cars in the July 4th Parade in the the Hamlet I live in. It was a very gray overcast day. That lens allowed for great pix tho... 2007 Eatons Neck July 4 Parade album | m8o | Fotki.com

And about my two favorite flower pix taken with it ever... Sometimes I Surprise Myself album | m8o | Fotki.com

If you want to pixel peep, the full rez images are available on each page.

Last edited by m8o; 11-01-2007 at 08:08 PM.
11-01-2007, 08:03 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by m8o Quote
Yes, very good detail provided. You're probably ok by now... but for closure [if even just mine ], picture's replacing a 1000 words from me: ...all taken without flash. (well, maybe one or two in the 1st link, you can tell which, but that's it)

My 1st few hours with both the camera and lens: Testing - Pentax K10D - Tamron SP AF28-75mm F2.8 album | m8o | Fotki.com
I'm especially happy with this pic and the previous one. This is one of my 1st few shot ever, and it is ONE SECOND exposure handheld at 75mm (I guess ignorance is bliss, in that I didn't know I'm not supposed to be able to do that!), into extremely dim light of my littlest dog who went to hide behind the toilet bowl as I used the flash once, that that reminds her of lightning. The light was off in the bathroom. It was a very very dim room. But you'd never know from the shot. And that's @ f/4.5, not f/2.8. The only reason the dog is 'soft' is she moved during the shot.

The next weekend @ my friends house Father's Day: Father's Day 2007 album | m8o | Fotki.com

Classic Cars in the July 4th Parade in the the Hamlet I live in. It was a very gray overcast day. That lens allowed for great pix tho... 2007 Eatons Neck July 4 Parade album | m8o | Fotki.com

And about my two favorite flower pix taken with it ever... Sometimes I Surprise Myself album | m8o | Fotki.com

If you want to pixel peep, the full rez images are available on each page.
Thanks for sharing, the first set with the indoor pictures was very informative. You've got some great shots there.
11-02-2007, 01:40 AM   #22
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I'll poke my nose in and do my standard mention of the fact that if $$$ is a consideration then the backwards compatibility of the Pentax cameras turns out to be their greatest selling point, since you can dip into the very large pool of vintage M42 (screwmount) lenses and assemble a very respectable collection of very good lenses for less than you'd pay for a single modern good quality lens.

Going the Takumar route does come with what many would consider limitations and drawbacks, fo course, but I just want to point out that the option is there. Click on the link in my signature and you can see photos the vast majority of which were taken with 30-40 year old lenses purchased for between $20 and $70 each.
11-02-2007, 02:40 AM   #23
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Out of all the suggestions here so far, I was probably most inclined to get the DA 16-45mm f/4. However, I think I'm even more inclined to get a prime lens instead of a zoom lens. In this regard, what consumer-market (or maybe even pro-sumer) prime lens would you recommend to pair with the K100D?

Thanks for all your help so far! Oh, and m8o, thanks for sharing!

EDIT: Someone posted this on another forum I'm on... Hopefully, aside from your own suggestions, you could comment on these Keep in mind that I'm looking for a prime lens with great IQ, which is in the consumer-prosumer market. Thanks!

QuoteQuote:
I. Normal Prime - FA 31mm f/1.8 Limited - Definitely the king of the current Pentax primes. Very expensive, but it is simply a beauty (understatement), optically and build-wise. An alternative is the FA 35mm f/2 - Sharp, fast, and compact. Very good reviews. Does not cost an arm and a leg.

II. Portrait Prime - FA 77mm f/1.8 Limited - The queen of the current Pentax primes. A bit cheaper than the 31mm Limited, but still cost a lot. I would like to get the FA 50mm f/1.4 too. Cheap and good. An alternative would be the DA 40mm f/2.8 Limited Pancake. I would normally opt for a FA lens, but this one is so cute.

III. Wide-angle Prime - DA 21mm f/3.2 Limited. No choice. I would want to get the FA 20mm, but the DA, I read, is better optically.

IV. Macro Prime - The current DFA macros have good results in the reviews, but nothing special. The old FA* 200mm macro is great, if one can be spotted. Good alternatives would be the third-party macro lenses from Tamron/Tokina.
EDIT AGAIN: Now, I have a more solid picture of what I want! This is what I'm most leaning to right now: K100D+pancake. What do you guys think?


Last edited by lastdodobird; 11-02-2007 at 04:37 AM.
11-02-2007, 05:21 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by lastdodobird Quote
EDIT AGAIN: Now, I have a more solid picture of what I want! This is what I'm most leaning to right now: K100D+pancake. What do you guys think?
That's exactly what I chose. I was pretty happy with it, but it didn't take me long to realize that I'd really wanted the K10D.

You won't regret the lens choice, though.
11-02-2007, 06:01 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by mattdm Quote
That's exactly what I chose. I was pretty happy with it, but it didn't take me long to realize that I'd really wanted the K10D.

You won't regret the lens choice, though.
I'm going canvassing tomorrow, and if could find the K100D body plus that pancake at a reasonable price, I think I'm gonna go for it! I doubt if I have the knowledge and skills to be able to maximize the K10D anyway, so I'm putting my money on the fact that I won't regret this purchase.

/excited

hehe.

If anyone has any other comments... alternate prime lens suggestions... please do opine All the responses thus far have been really helpful! Thanks!
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