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03-29-2014, 08:26 AM   #16
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Hi everybody.
I didn't want to open a new thread since there are many which contain this problem. I read about dust between AA filter and sensor on K-5 and was wondering do I have this issue?

In this picture you can see few dusts (is it?). With dozen "dust removal" operation it didn't clean it. When I open sensor cleaning and the mirror comes up, I can't see anything on the sensor. I did shot with different lenses and the spots are still there.

I bought Giottos air-blower but, unfortunately, i will not see it within two weeks.

Does this new K-5 II models do have issues like the old ones with dust between AA filter and sensor?

Edit: New image. I don't wanna count anymore!

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Last edited by malenisjaj; 03-29-2014 at 09:48 AM. Reason: added picture more!
03-30-2014, 04:50 AM - 1 Like   #17
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Hi

Looking at you sample images I would almost be certain (in fact I tink I am certain) that the "schmutz" on your sensor is nothing else but dust. However, dust can be of a lot of different substances depending on the environment the camera is used in. Think of organic matter such as pollen or skin flakes (very common), chemical substances (they are all around us), mineral and metallic particles and clothing fluff. Some of the organic stuff has a habit of sticking nicely on smooth surfaces when the get a bit of humidity or moisture. If they stay on long enough they are usually a bit stubborn to remove as they literally weld themselves tight. Metals, whether ferrous or non-ferrous can oxidise and get stuck on the sensor easily.

Well, firstly forget about the blower. If the blower removes some bits you are lucky and if you do they fly around uncontrollably inside your mirror chamber to come back to bite you in the bum later. Sure, people report great success stories but really all they have done is to remove the offending crap temporarily. If I have a choice to spot the dirt on the sensor with a sensor loupe and pick off the dirt with a special static brush one by one I will take this option every time. I then know where the dust is - outside the camera.

So how do you tackle this problem. Well, if picking off dirt with a sensor brush like the Artic Butterfly Arctic Butterfly sensor brush. Sensor cleaning, remove dust. does not work you are in for a wet clean. However here you can still face some problems. (as has been reported many time.)

If you are confronted with crap on you sensor that is seemingly unwilling to be shifted with a wet cleaning procedure it may just simply be a case that the wrong cleaning agent (fluid) is used.

Consider this:

In simple chemistry terms the solubility of a substance is determent by its so-called polarity. Molecules with many polar bonds are soluble in polar solvents. Molecules with none or few polar bonds are soluble in non-polar solvent.

Polar substances for example are water, alcohol or ether. Methanol/Ethanol/Propanol (which are the most common sensor cleaning fluids) are none polar. (I hope I remember this correctly) This simply means that none polar substances can't be solved with polar fluids and vickie versa.

So, if you don't know the makeup of the crap on you sensor, you may have to try to solve the problem (pun not intended) by using or experimenting with different fluids.

If your attempt to remove the crap with none polar fluid was unsuccessful it means the crap could be of polar nature. Since water is polar I would get some distilled water, moisten a sensor swipe with it liberally (without dripping) target the crap, hold the swipe over it for a while to give it a chance to soften and then wipe it off with a gentle swipe. Distilled water will not harm your sensor! (As long as you don't drown it). You can do this several times until everything is clear (Use a new swipe every time) and the distilled water won't leave marks on the AA Filter. Distilled water will still have traces of Magnesium, Calium, Calcium, Chloride, Sulphate, Phosphate in it but they are of such minute level not to be of importance. I know from reports on this forum here that distilled water has worked well for a lot of people. Of course sensor cleaning vendors don't want you to know this because the can't sell you 10ml distilled water for $40.00.

For non-polar crap I use 98% pure Ethanol which I buy from the chemist for a Dollar. 100% pure Ethanol is not possible and the 2% is just water. In fact an open Ethanol bottle will absorb further water from the ambient air. No problems here as the extra "polar water" will help in removing polar crap from the sensor and it also makes it slower evaporating which further helps the cleaning process. In fact I add a wee drop of distilled water to the Ethanol for this purpose.

Good luck. (Actually you don't need luck, as sensor cleaning is a simple task only made important and dangerous sounding by vendors who want to sell you cheap stuff at 2000% inflated prices.)

Sorry for the long post.

Greetings
03-30-2014, 05:15 AM   #18
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Thanks Schraubstock for detailed post. As I can see, Arctic Butterfly is 107€ which is not that cheap. Is there any cheaper tool to clean sensor and that is still good enough?
03-30-2014, 05:41 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by malenisjaj Quote
Thanks Schraubstock for detailed post. As I can see, Arctic Butterfly is 130€ which is not that cheap. Is there any cheaper tool to clean sensor and that is still good enough?
Cleanskies Sensor Brush Cleaning SET FOR Digital SLR APS C AND Full Size Sensors | eBay

03-30-2014, 06:55 AM   #20
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Bought one. Thanks again!
04-01-2014, 02:44 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by KB1SFVE3 Quote
My hunch is that it's dust on your sensor.

And it looks like a rather large "hairy" piece of dust at that!

I also know a lot of folks here have recommended using a "Rocket Blower" to remove dust. However, I've found that approach simply moves the dust around inside the camera...and it may even blow dust into other places where it will be even MORE of an irritant...such as between a pentaprism and a focusing screen.

Over the years, I've tried many different so-called "solutions" for sensor dust removal and I think I have finally found one that works simply, quickly and effectively.

These days, I regularly remove dust from the sensors on all of my DSLRs using a thing called an Arctic Butterfly. Indeed, I've learned that, compared to the cost (and hassle) of having a camera shop do it, along with my penchant for swapping lenses all the time...the thing paid for itself the very first time I used it.

Unfortunately, as the rubber seals, gaskets and pieces of foam in these cameras age over time (along with the continual movement of air in and out of the camera with the use of zoom lenses) one can't help but have such stuff sucked into (or around) inside your camera, some of which eventually winds up on the sensor. I have also learned that this can happen even if you don't swap lenses all the time. For example, some dust showed up on the sensor of my brand new K-20 a while back even though up to that point I had never swapped lenses on it!

The bottom line here is that dust WILL get onto your camera's sensor sooner or later....regardless of how careful you are to keep it out.

I've also learned that the "sensor shake" feature on K-20D-era (and earlier) Pentax cameras may have been a great Madison Avenue selling point at the time, but is nigh on useless in practice. It simply doesn't work.

However, I now understand the newer Pentax cameras have an "ultrasonic" feature that shakes the dust off the sensor....and into a "catcher" of some sort. Call me a purist, but, just with the use of Rocket Blowers, this feature still only moves the dust around inside the camera rather than getting it out completely!

The Butterfly thingie works by spinning the inserted brush (which gives it a static charge) outside the camera. Then, once you've removed the lens and activated your "mirror up" feature on the camera, as you pass the brush (gently) over the sensor and the dust is sucked up onto the brush because it's statically charged. You then spin the brush again (outside the camera). This gets rid of the collected dust off the brush as well as re-charging it. You can then repeat the process if you like. Usually, one or two spins and passes over the sensor are enough to get rid of the pesky stuff.

And, if you have any concerns about scratching your sensor with the brush...relax. The Arctic Butterfly brush is specifically manufactured for sensor cleaning and contains some VERY fine bristles, so there should be no worries about scratching your sensor with it.

The Arctic Butterfly is marketed by an outfit out in Canmore, Alberta, but is available in the USA via Amazon and most of the big US camera dealers such as B&H as well as Adorama. The outfit's name is Visible Dust. I also own their lighted Sensor Loupe that lights up the sensor to show you exactly where the dust is on the sensor before you clean it (and to show you when it's gone!).

Visible Dust also markets a line of liquid cleaners specifically manufactured to get rid of such things as oil smears and other more stubborn "goop" from sensors. But, as I said, most the time, it's simply a dust issue and it usually takes less than a minute or two (with a few swipes of my Arctic Butterfly) to get rid of it.

Here's a link to a You Tube Video that shows you how the Arctic Butterfly works: How The Arctic Butterfly Works.

Now if this all sounds like a paid advertisement for Visible Dust...it isn't. I'm simply a very satisfied user of their products. And while their products may appear a bit pricey, the Arctic Butterfly is a really great product that is simple to use, VERY effective and a whole lot less costly over time than having a camera shop continually remove the dust for you.

Needless to say, my Arctic Butterfly and Sensor Loupe now occupy a special place in my camera bag and go with me everywhere I go.
I like that Arctic Butterfly; however, it's a wee bit expensive.
04-06-2014, 08:35 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by Michael Piziak Quote
I like that Arctic Butterfly; however, it's a wee bit expensive.
Agreed.

However, look around on E-Bay....they can often be had for a fraction of the cost of new.

But, regardless of what you end up paying, they are worth every penny.

Best!
04-13-2014, 07:30 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by malenisjaj Quote
Thanks Schraubstock for detailed post. As I can see, Arctic Butterfly is 107€ which is not that cheap. Is there any cheaper tool to clean sensor and that is still good enough?
You can take your DSLR to someone who professionally cleans the sensors.

04-13-2014, 08:10 AM   #24
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This gel stick product looks good and is probably affordable

04-18-2014, 02:44 AM   #25
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Update:
I got a Giottos blower and CleanSkies Brushes and I followed the instructions. Since there wasn't so much dust (but still enaugh to make me troubled), I concluded (The Pixel Sweeper) that the best thing is to blow the dust couple of times with Giottos Blower .
Finally, I shoot a picture (today is cloudy) and @ f40 all I could see was one tiny dust-spot on the top left corner. I don't mind about that.
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Last edited by malenisjaj; 04-18-2014 at 02:51 AM.
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