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06-29-2013, 10:25 AM   #1
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WG-3 Movies Not in MP4 Format

I had read that the WG-3 recorded movies in MP4 format. I just received a WG-3, have recorded some short movies, and they are all in .MOV format! I don't see a way to change this setting. Is the movie format a function of the card I'm recording to, or some setting on the camera?

Thanks.

cdun2

06-29-2013, 10:41 AM   #2
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The codec is MPEG-4, H.264 specifically, but the container file is QuickTime.

H.264/MPEG-4 AVC - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
QuickTime File Format - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

QuoteQuote:
Because both the QuickTime and MP4 container formats can use the same MPEG-4 formats, they are mostly interchangeable in a QuickTime-only environment. MP4, being an international standard, has more support. This is especially true on hardware devices, such as the Sony PSP and various DVD players; on the software side, most DirectShow and Video for Windows codec packs[7][8] include an MP4 parser, but not one for QTFF.

In QuickTime Pro's MPEG-4 Export dialog, an option called "Passthrough" allows a clean export to MP4 without affecting the audio or video streams. One recent discrepancy ushered in by QuickTime 7 is that the QuickTime file format now supports multichannel audio (used, for example, in the high-definition trailers on Apple's site[9]).
QuoteQuote:
The International Organization for Standardization approved the QuickTime file format as the basis of the MPEG-4 file format. The MPEG-4 file format specification was created on the basis of the QuickTime format specification published in 2001.[10] The MP4 (.mp4) file format was published in 2001 as the revision of the MPEG-4 Part 1: Systems specification published in 1999 (ISO/IEC 14496-1:2001).[11][12][13] In 2003, the first version of MP4 format was revised and replaced by MPEG-4 Part 14: MP4 file format (ISO/IEC 14496-14:2003).[14] The MP4 file format was generalized into the ISO Base Media File Format ISO/IEC 14496-12:2004, which defines a general structure for time-based media files. It in turn is used as the basis for other multimedia file formats (for example 3GP, Motion JPEG 2000).[15][16][17][18][19] A list of all registered extensions for ISO Base Media File Format is published on the official registration authority website The 'MP4' Registration Authority. This registration authority for code-points in "MP4 Family" files is Apple Inc. and it is named in Annex D (informative) in MPEG-4 Part 12.[18]
06-29-2013, 11:32 AM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by cdun2 Quote
I had read that the WG-3 recorded movies in MP4 format. I just received a WG-3, have recorded some short movies, and they are all in .MOV format! I don't see a way to change this setting. Is the movie format a function of the card I'm recording to, or some setting on the camera?

Thanks.

cdun2
The WG-3 outputs .mov files- this is normal and it can't be changed. Previous Pentax cameras made .AVI files, but those were a PITA to play back due to codec compatibility issues.

Adam
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06-29-2013, 11:39 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
The WG-3 outputs .mov files- this is normal and it can't be changed. Previous Pentax cameras made .AVI files, but those were a PITA to play back due to codec compatibility issues.
Well, that stinks. I was totally under the impression that the WG-3 was going to create .MP4. The short movies I have done so far are creating these huge .mov files.

I have a Samsung camera that creates .mp4. The files are much smaller, and the video seems to be better. I guess with this new camera, I'm back to having to convert video (if I keep the camera).

Can you recommend a .MOV to .MP4 converter?

Thank you for your help.

cdun2.

06-29-2013, 11:58 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by cdun2 Quote
Well, that stinks. I was totally under the impression that the WG-3 was going to create .MP4. The short movies I have done so far are creating these huge .mov files.

I have a Samsung camera that creates .mp4. The files are much smaller, and the video seems to be better. I guess with this new camera, I'm back to having to convert video (if I keep the camera).

Can you recommend a .MOV to .MP4 converter?

Thank you for your help.

cdun2.
The Samsung and the Pentax are using the same Codec, just different container files. Is the Samsung recording in 1080p or 720p? Try recording in 720p with the WG-3.

The best QuickTime converter is QuickTime Pro from Apple. It has a "passthrough" setting that coverts a .mov file to .mp4 without re-encoding, but the file size will be the same...
06-29-2013, 12:22 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
The Samsung and the Pentax are using the same Codec, just different container files. Is the Samsung recording in 1080p or 720p? Try recording in 720p with the WG-3.

The best QuickTime converter is QuickTime Pro from Apple. It has a "passthrough" setting that coverts a .mov file to .mp4 without re-encoding, but the file size will be the same...
Thanks again for the feedback. I tried it on 720p and I got the same result. Does anyone know of waterproof point and shoot cameras that create .mp4 video files by default?
06-29-2013, 12:27 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by cdun2 Quote
Can you recommend a .MOV to .MP4 converter?
I use Handbrake:

HandBrake: Open Source Video Transcoder
06-29-2013, 03:47 PM   #8
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Try just renaming the file suffix from .mov to .mp4 .... I make no promises, but if it doesn't work you can simply rename the file back to .mov.

My rationale is there really isn't an .avi video file; .avi is nothing more than a container for a video file of one codec or another. The player is supposed to read the metadata in the file and determine the appropriate codec. And where the player stumbles you can often just rename the file to the embedded type. If the above post is true and .mov is also acting as just a container for a H.264 coded file, this simple renaming trick may work here just as well.

Let all of us know if this works.

06-29-2013, 09:09 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by JimJohnson Quote
Try just renaming the file suffix from .mov to .mp4 .... I make no promises, but if it doesn't work you can simply rename the file back to .mov.

My rationale is there really isn't an .avi video file; .avi is nothing more than a container for a video file of one codec or another. The player is supposed to read the metadata in the file and determine the appropriate codec. And where the player stumbles you can often just rename the file to the embedded type. If the above post is true and .mov is also acting as just a container for a H.264 coded file, this simple renaming trick may work here just as well.

Let all of us know if this works.
Yes, just changing the file extension from .MOV to .MP4 did not corrupt the file. However, the video I am working with is a little more than fifty seconds in length, and over 100mb in size. The Panasonic TS5 records in MP4, and I've been looking at 108030p MP4 files from that camera where the video is over two minutes long, and the file size is only 15MB.

The settings for the aforementioned WG-3 video are as follows:

recorded pixels 1280x30
movie sr on
wind suppression on
enable auto focus on
enable optical zoom off

video out NTSC
HDMI out 720P
06-29-2013, 09:39 PM   #10
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How the sound is encoded in the video can make significant differences in file size. According to the Pentax Imaging website WG-3 is using WAV (PCM), 32KHz, 16bit stereo, High Speed Movie】8KHz, 16bit, stereo. PCM is a non-compressed format. Samsung I believe uses AAC audio encoding which results in significantly smaller files.

If the sound quality isn't that important or you are recording mainly voices try using the 8KHz setting. Otherwise you need to re-encode the audio to get smaller file sizes.

If you are using a PC MediaInfo will tell you more than you want to know about how a media file is encoded include the size of the audio vs video information in the file.

MediaInfo
06-30-2013, 04:59 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by Not a Number Quote
How the sound is encoded in the video can make significant differences in file size. According to the Pentax Imaging website WG-3 is using WAV (PCM), 32KHz, 16bit stereo, High Speed Movie】8KHz, 16bit, stereo. PCM is a non-compressed format. Samsung I believe uses AAC audio encoding which results in significantly smaller files.

If the sound quality isn't that important or you are recording mainly voices try using the 8KHz setting. Otherwise you need to re-encode the audio to get smaller file sizes.

If you are using a PC MediaInfo will tell you more than you want to know about how a media file is encoded include the size of the audio vs video information in the file.

MediaInfo
Thanks again. It never occurred to me that the audio could be the issue (and I've dealt with WAV vs MP3). However, I can't find a setting to change the audio encoding. I've checked the user manual, and I've gone through the camera settings. How can I change the setting?
06-30-2013, 08:37 AM   #12
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Sorry, I can't help you there. I'm just going by the published specs on the website. It may be you can only change it along with the quality of the video. Otherwise I'm afraid you'll just have to re-encode the audio. HandBrake for the PC is nice but I don't think it does passthru video. There are so many software packages out there to convert/re-encode AV. I can't keep up with them. To do it manually you would demux the MP4 file (separate audio from video), re-encode the audio and remux them. It gets tricky as the sound sync can go out with variable rate files.

The videohelp.com and doom9.org sites and forums will point you in the right direction for either the PC or Mac.
06-30-2013, 10:09 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Not a Number Quote
Sorry, I can't help you there. I'm just going by the published specs on the website. It may be you can only change it along with the quality of the video. Otherwise I'm afraid you'll just have to re-encode the audio. HandBrake for the PC is nice but I don't think it does passthru video. There are so many software packages out there to convert/re-encode AV. I can't keep up with them. To do it manually you would demux the MP4 file (separate audio from video), re-encode the audio and remux them. It gets tricky as the sound sync can go out with variable rate files.

The videohelp.com and doom9.org sites and forums will point you in the right direction for either the PC or Mac.
Thanks for the assistance.
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