Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
12-23-2014, 10:56 AM   #1
Senior Member
Danas_Anis's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2013
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 188
changed focusing screen, trouble with focus...

Hello,

I have changed the focusing screen on my K30 and have a little problem, thing is that to change it is a peace of cake, but the issue is that after I installed the new focusing screen which is exact same copy of the old one, the focus area is offset.
According to my eyes I am nearly in perfect focus, but the picture turns out completely not in focus, I check with the focus peaking, the focus is way offset. When I put my old focusing screen, things are normal.

The reason for changing the old fosuing screen is that while cleaning I accidentally dropped it and scratch it and touched with fingers and you probably suspect in what condition it is, now my crystal clear brand new focusing screen is showing me nonsense, any advice? Could it be a faulty focusing screen and I should get back to the store and try to get a replacement?

I would have thought I was doing something wrong, but when I put my old damaged focus screen, I perform focusing pretty well. With the new focusing screen it looks like I would be blind and focus anywhere but not to the right spot.

Thank you for your advice in advance.

12-23-2014, 11:11 AM   #2
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
Photos: Albums
Posts: 377
Did you experiment with the shims? That's the only thing I can think of, but I'm no expert. Hopefully someone else can help better.
12-23-2014, 11:29 AM   #3
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
AquaDome's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: New Carlisle, IN
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 1,475
Focusing screens have a tendency to get in there the wrong way, not quite sitting in the bracket correctly.
Carefully take it out and put it back in and see if it settles down in there correctly this time.
If it is a stock replacement for the original, the original spacer/shim should be used, as the new screen is the same size as the old one.
12-23-2014, 11:38 AM   #4
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
stevebrot's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Vancouver (USA)
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 27,672
QuoteOriginally posted by AquaDome Quote
Focusing screens have a tendency to get in there the wrong way, not quite sitting in the bracket correctly.
Carefully take it out and put it back in and see if it settles down in there correctly this time.
Yes! Make sure the screen is fully seated to the rear and centered side to side.


Steve

(...know from experience... ...)

12-23-2014, 11:46 AM   #5
Senior Member
Danas_Anis's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2013
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 188
Original Poster
discovered the issue, the new focusing screen is slightly smaller, and just noticed on the manual that the screen is for k20.
Did pentax change their viewfinder dimensions? Anyway looks like I will be headed back to the store and see what they can offer, I guess it should have came with extra spacer ( that thignie that holds the focusing screen) or something.

thank you so much for your help
12-23-2014, 12:36 PM   #6
Pentaxian
aleonx3's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Brampton, Ontario
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,903
Be careful if you change the focusing screen, it has to be "like-for-like", exactly as before replacement, or if it is a third-party screen, it has to be identified as compatible; and even if it is compatible, you may need add shims (if needed). I made a mistake of cleaning out the focusing screen before, and have to order the OEM screen to replace it when I had the k-7.
12-23-2014, 12:50 PM   #7
Senior Member
Danas_Anis's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2013
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 188
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by aleonx3 Quote
Be careful if you change the focusing screen, it has to be "like-for-like", exactly as before replacement, or if it is a third-party screen, it has to be identified as compatible; and even if it is compatible, you may need add shims (if needed). I made a mistake of cleaning out the focusing screen before, and have to order the OEM screen to replace it when I had the k-7.

Well I am afraid that my only hope now is for the store to get a replacement and hopefully they will have the exact version, cause the one they gave me is half milometer smaller and i suppose it sits there not properly, although to regular eye it seems very well there, but probably it is not able to align properly, the bad thing is that my old screen is really in bad condition and all my lenses are manual ones. Hopefully tomorrow the store will offer a solution, otherwise I feel like screwed big time.


In general the view from the viewfinder is so nice, it just doesn;t show the correct focus. Not really my day today....

what are the shims exactly? English is not my native language and I am not sure if my suspicion is correct about them.
12-23-2014, 01:01 PM   #8
Pentaxian
aleonx3's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Brampton, Ontario
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,903
QuoteOriginally posted by Danas_Anis Quote
Well I am afraid that my only hope now is for the store to get a replacement and hopefully they will have the exact version, cause the one they gave me is half milometer smaller and i suppose it sits there not properly, although to regular eye it seems very well there, but probably it is not able to align properly, the bad thing is that my old screen is really in bad condition and all my lenses are manual ones. Hopefully tomorrow the store will offer a solution, otherwise I feel like screwed big time.


In general the view from the viewfinder is so nice, it just doesn;t show the correct focus. Not really my day today....

what are the shims exactly? English is not my native language and I am not sure if my suspicion is correct about them.
Shims are the metal 'spacers' that usually comes with third party focusing screens; it is to be used to correct the distance from the mirror. Before you do anything else, you want to make sure that it is not focusing screen problem. When you say the focus seems to lock on when you look through the viewfinder, but the actually picture turns out to be blurry. When you say lock-on, do you see the green hexagon comes up in the viewfinder? The green hexagon comes up means the camera's PDAF system is seeing the focus to be correct. If the green hexagon does not come up, it does not mean it is in focus by the camera system. I just want to make sure that you don't get mixed up with the diopter on the camera.

12-23-2014, 01:22 PM   #9
Senior Member
Danas_Anis's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2013
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 188
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by aleonx3 Quote
Shims are the metal 'spacers' that usually comes with third party focusing screens; it is to be used to correct the distance from the mirror. Before you do anything else, you want to make sure that it is not focusing screen problem. When you say the focus seems to lock on when you look through the viewfinder, but the actually picture turns out to be blurry. When you say lock-on, do you see the green hexagon comes up in the viewfinder? The green hexagon comes up means the camera's PDAF system is seeing the focus to be correct. If the green hexagon does not come up, it does not mean it is in focus by the camera system. I just want to make sure that you don't get mixed up with the diopter on the camera.

I am pretty sure it is not the camera, I have 3 ways to check it, one is that when I place my old focusing screen back and attempt to focus, I manage to get in focus shots, even with the dirty, spotty and scratched focusing screen.

Then I checked it with focus peaking via live view and the picture is razor sharp. Except that the new focusing screen shows the picture completely out of focus while live view and focus peaking shows perfect focus of the object.

then there are the red squares that indicates focus point. it is centered and I believe with manual lenses only centered focus works to indicate whether it is in focus. again, if I trust my eyes and new focusing screen, picture is out of focus when it shows perfect focus, then if I play around and hit the spot when the red square lights up and take a shot, it is in perfect focus, but what i see via view finder is not in focus at all.

The focusing screen I bought is Pentax manufactured. Apart few Sigma lenses, there are no other third party products for pentax in my country, we have only few specialized shops that sell anything Pentax. ( I dind;t take into count filters for lenses)

I guess there is no other DSLR brand with which the one could get such rich learning experience about DSLRs in general.
12-23-2014, 02:46 PM   #10
Pentaxian




Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Southern California
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,181
QuoteOriginally posted by Danas_Anis Quote
I guess there is no other DSLR brand with which the one could get such rich learning experience about DSLRs in general.
I really think this is true. Even if you end up using a different brand someday, you will have learned more and have a better understanding because you owned Pentax.
12-23-2014, 05:51 PM   #11
Forum Member




Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 98
Check the thickness is the same for the old and new screen, the third party screen "catseye" is thinner thus is supplied with shims which are neoprene/soft plastic thin rectangles which make up the difference between the screen thicknesses, normally original screens don't use shims. The K20 I think had 98% field view of the image whereas the K3 has 100% so the screens are not interchangeable. You need the right screen!
12-24-2014, 03:03 AM   #12
Senior Member
Danas_Anis's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2013
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 188
Original Poster
Hello,

I went to the store today and got a refund. Returned the screen an ordered another one that should be specifically designed for k30 and other models with the same viewfinder.
Hopefully they will ship the right one this time And hopefully my Odyssey with view finders will end with a good ending.

Thank you so much to everyone who responded and marry Christmas to everyone!
12-24-2014, 05:44 AM   #13
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
stevebrot's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Vancouver (USA)
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 27,672
QuoteOriginally posted by Danas_Anis Quote
Did pentax change their viewfinder dimensions?
Yes, the viewfinder screens are not always compatible between the various Pentax models. The K20D takes a different screen and if oriented the same as your stock screen in the frame will be flipped upside-down from how it should be. That would explain why your view is blurry.

As for all the discussion regarding shims. If you are replacing like with like you should not require any shims. Replace the stock MF-60 screen that came with your camera with the same model number from Pentax and you should be good to go.


Steve

Last edited by stevebrot; 12-24-2014 at 06:09 AM.
12-24-2014, 05:57 AM   #14
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
stevebrot's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Vancouver (USA)
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 27,672
QuoteOriginally posted by Dave's clichés Quote
Check the thickness is the same for the old and new screen, the third party screen "catseye" is thinner thus is supplied with shims which are neoprene/soft plastic thin rectangles which make up the difference between the screen thicknesses, normally original screens don't use shims.
There are a couple of things here that require some additional discussion.
  • According to Rachael Katz (owner), KatzEye screens are made to the same thickness as the screens they replace
  • KatzEye screens do not ship with replacement shims, though genuine metal Pentax shims are available for sale from KatzEye should they be needed. Screens from focusingscreen.com, other the other hand, may or may not be the same thickness as the original and do ship with a small assortment of plastic shims that are a pain to use (flimsy), but do work. The various eBay screens do not ship with shims.
  • Pentax cameras generally ship with a shim installed. There is a default thickness that is spec'ed (I have the thickness somewhere in my records), but the actual shim installed may vary from the spec according to the factory calibration. The rare camera may actually have no shim, but usually when a user reports such, it is because they don't know where to look for it. The shim is retained by a second tab and does not come out with the screen. (At least it should not!)
I would suggest that users not remove the shim unless absolutely necessary.

Steve

(...current owner of both KatzEye and focusingscreen.com screens and veteran of the shimming process...)

Last edited by stevebrot; 12-24-2014 at 06:07 AM.
12-29-2014, 02:40 AM   #15
Pentaxian




Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Southern California
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,181
QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
There are a couple of things here that require some additional discussion.
  • According to Rachael Katz (owner), KatzEye screens are made to the same thickness as the screens they replace
  • KatzEye screens do not ship with replacement shims, though genuine metal Pentax shims are available for sale from KatzEye should they be needed. Screens from focusingscreen.com, other the other hand, may or may not be the same thickness as the original and do ship with a small assortment of plastic shims that are a pain to use (flimsy), but do work. The various eBay screens do not ship with shims.
  • Pentax cameras generally ship with a shim installed. There is a default thickness that is spec'ed (I have the thickness somewhere in my records), but the actual shim installed may vary from the spec according to the factory calibration. The rare camera may actually have no shim, but usually when a user reports such, it is because they don't know where to look for it. The shim is retained by a second tab and does not come out with the screen. (At least it should not!)
I would suggest that users not remove the shim unless absolutely necessary.

Steve

(...current owner of both KatzEye and focusingscreen.com screens and veteran of the shimming process...)
Very helpful - I didn't know this. I'll make sure to get a KatzEye screen next time!
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
advice, camera, edge, focus, glue, mine, offset, pentax help, photography, screen, troubleshooting
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
For Sale - Sold: (price reduced) K-20D with KatzEye focusing screen and screw-drive only focus bkpix Sold Items 4 11-07-2013 05:28 PM
Focusing trouble with pentax DA 60-250 xenocide72 Troubleshooting and Beginner Help 10 05-16-2013 03:57 AM
Wide Angle Zooms and Focus Peaking: trouble focusing? cristigj Pentax K-01 4 01-16-2013 07:00 AM
Focusing manual lens with OEM focusing screen, is a split screen really needed? skid2964 Pentax Camera and Field Accessories 16 09-17-2010 02:54 PM
Trouble changing K-7 focusing screen Kirivon Pentax DSLR Discussion 2 07-10-2010 10:49 AM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:15 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top