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05-16-2015, 05:19 PM   #1
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Help with Monochrome

I took my K-5 IIs out today and took several shot in monochrome. They were black and white in live view when I took them and when I view them in camera they are in black and white. I shoot in Raw, DNG file format. When I copy the files from the memory card and view them in Adobe Bridge CC they are in full color. What am I missing?

05-16-2015, 05:27 PM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by dakight Quote
I took my K-5 IIs out today and took several shot in monochrome. They were black and white in live view when I took them and when I view them in camera they are in black and white. I shoot in Raw, DNG file format. When I copy the files from the memory card and view them in Adobe Bridge CC they are in full color. What am I missing?
B&W is only in JPEG...
05-16-2015, 05:50 PM   #3
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OK... so why do they display in black and white in the camera and if the B&W is in jpeg, where are the files? I'm confused.
05-16-2015, 06:00 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by dakight Quote
OK... so why do they display in black and white in the camera and if the B&W is in jpeg, where are the files? I'm confused.
The camera is showing you the jpeg thumbnail. This thumbnail is rendered according to the settings you made in the camera, in this case B&W. This is embedded in the DNG but most software will render the DNG locally rather than use the jpeg which is very lo-res. The only way to shoot B&W in camera is to shoot jpeg or RAW+ (which will give you both). But in any case if you are working with the RAW, it is just that, the RAW, so all information is included. You cannot take a B&W and save it as a RAW, it has to be developed, either by the in-camera jpeg engine or by your computer software.

05-16-2015, 06:00 PM   #5
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If you shoot RAW+ WYSIWYG.
05-16-2015, 06:18 PM   #6
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I used to shoot Raw+ but I never used the jpeg so I figured it was just wasted space. Now I see what's happening. I'll just convert them in POST. I have to say, the user manual is very vague and even misleading in this area.
05-16-2015, 06:48 PM   #7
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It's because when you shoot monochrome on the K5IIs, the information picked up by the sensor is still in color, since the sensor is a color sensor and not black and white. So this color information is still stored in the RAW file even if you picked B&W. Just use software to change them i guess.
05-16-2015, 07:29 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by dakight Quote
I used to shoot Raw+ but I never used the jpeg so I figured it was just wasted space. Now I see what's happening. I'll just convert them in POST. I have to say, the user manual is very vague and even misleading in this area.
This sort of thing is a frequent source of confusion. Most (all?) of the in-camera custom image features and filters are limited to JPEG. The reason being is that RAW is, well, RAW and RAW means a dump of the sensor data plus low level processing only. There is no RAW image per se. That does not mean that custom image settings will never be applied by your out-of-camera RAW processor. What is does mean is that the RAW processor must be capable of reading and acting on whatever directives might be present as clues.

Most RAW converters will glean the white balance setting and apply it along with an import profile to generate the image for display and editing. The manufacturer's RAW converter may also be capable of detecting and applying proprietary custom image and digital filter effects if the data are present and the software supports the clues. It is my understanding that the PDCU software that ships with the camera has this capability, but whether it extends to monochrome rendering, I cannot say. I have never used it . So, if the manual is misleading, it is in not providing a stronger statement regarding in-camera vs. out-of-camera RAW processing and the role of PDCU. There are many places in the manuals where hints are given, but no point-by-point discussion of the benefits/limits of each file type.

BTW...true in-camera monochrome RAW is rare and a wonderful thing. To the best of my knowledge only the dedicated B&W Leica M "monochrom" supports this feature.


Steve


Last edited by stevebrot; 05-16-2015 at 10:24 PM.
05-16-2015, 09:11 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
The camera is showing you the jpeg thumbnail. This thumbnail is rendered according to the settings you made in the camera, in this case B&W. This is embedded in the DNG but most software will render the DNG locally rather than use the jpeg which is very lo-res. The only way to shoot B&W in camera is to shoot jpeg or RAW+ (which will give you both). But in any case if you are working with the RAW, it is just that, the RAW, so all information is included. You cannot take a B&W and save it as a RAW, it has to be developed, either by the in-camera jpeg engine or by your computer software.
Pretty much what Jatrax said. I have an Olympus E-500 (which is 10 years old now btw) does the same thing. In-camera it shows B&W, but in LR/PS it's in color. The only Digital camera that's out right now that is 100% B&W straight out the camera is the Leica M Monochrome. Unless you shoot B&W film, but that's a different discussion right there.
05-17-2015, 07:31 AM   #10
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I figured out how to apply the digital filter to the raw image and save as jpeg. It's an extra procedure that must be done with the K-5 IIs but not on the K-50. The K-50 automatically applies the selected filter and generates the jpeg; you then have the option to save the raw file if you choose. It's quicker and simpler, but the advantage with the k-5 method is that you can apply multiple digital filters to the same image.
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