how to lock mirror up when taking a shot?

redridinghood · 10-02-2015, 10:20 AM

I have pentax k50. I was reading in one of Scott Kelby's books that you can lock the mirror up for extra sharp shots -- does this functionality exist on k50? I know you can do that as part of the sensor cleaning exercise, but i thought there might be a more menu friendly way of doing this. Any ideas? Thanks

stevebrot · 10-02-2015, 10:30 AM

Mirror lock-up is not an option on the K-50, though you can get many of the benefits by using the self-timer (either 2s ~~of 20s~~ or 12s).

Steve

cali92rs · 10-02-2015, 10:40 AM

Originally posted by stevebrot

Mirror lock-up is not an option on the K-50, though you can get many of the benefits by using the self-timer (either 2s of 20s).

Steve

Also, when using live view, the mirror is locked up

**Spodeworld** · 10-02-2015, 10:41 AM

To build on stevebrot's comments. I believe that the mirror effectively locks up when you select the self-timer.

**UncleVanya** · 10-02-2015, 10:44 AM

I'm working on an article that will give you some workaround options for this. It should be ready to publish soon.
Essentially Steve is correct that there is no direct mirror lock up setting. However if you either use the IR Remote with the 3 sec delay or the self-timer (2 sec or 12 sec) these will flip the mirror up at the start of the count and allow time for the excess vibrations to die out. Live View contrary to what you may think does not help. The way the K50 works with Live View the mirror goes up when you enter that mode, but right before the shutter fires it drops and then goes back up immediately.

**Just1MoreDave** · 10-02-2015, 10:49 AM

SR is also automatically turned off when you switch to either 2sec or 12sec. self-timers. Since you are probably using a tripod, that is useful because Pentax recommends disabling SR when using a tripod. In the self-timer drive modes, the mirror flips up first, then there's a delay, then the shutter opens. The mirror flipping can still cause vibrations in extreme cases. For example, I have an SMC Pentax 300mm f4 lens which has no tripod mount. On a cheap tripod, the mirror makes it vibrate for several seconds.

I live close to a busy airport, so my test for vibrations is planes at night. I set a long exposure time and start the exposure when the plane just enters the frame. If the camera vibrates, the trail of the plane vibrates up and down in the shot. Stable setups make a smooth trail.

Na Horuk · 10-02-2015, 10:58 AM

Yeah, 2 sec timer includes MLU and automatically disables SR. The 20 sec timer does not include MLU, I think.

Originally posted by redridinghood

Scott Kelby's books that you can lock the mirror up for extra sharp shots

For perfect sharpness you need tripod, trigger, 2 sec timer, lights, and good lens, set at its optimal aperture. Camera's ISO should be low as you can tolerate.

Originally posted by cali92rs

Also, when using live view, the mirror is locked up

True, but I think when you press the shutter for a photo, the camera will still cycle the mirror down and up again. I may be wrong, but I think that is how it used to work Not too difficult to check - just take a shot in Tv mode with a slow shutter and listen for the individual clicks

DeadJohn · 10-02-2015, 11:38 AM

+1 that the 2-second timer is a good way to accomplish mirror lock up.

cali92rs · 10-02-2015, 12:00 PM

Originally posted by UncleVanya

Live View contrary to what you may think does not help. The way the K50 works with Live View the mirror goes up when you enter that mode, but right before the shutter fires it drops and then goes back up immediately.

Did not know that, I stand corrected.
I wonder why they would implement it like that

stevebrot · 10-02-2015, 12:22 PM

Originally posted by cali92rs

I wonder why they would implement it like that

The mirror and shutter sequence are tightly coupled in hardware on the K-30/K-50...one of the benefits of paying less for the camera, I would expect. The sequence is decoupled on the K-3. I don't know about the other models that support live view.

Steve

Na Horuk · 10-02-2015, 01:48 PM

Btw, which lens are you using? MLU helps with sharpness in many situations. I would only use MLU with a tripod or some sort of stable base, anyway. But if you use only the kit lens, there is only so much it can do at all.
Also, proper stance and holding technique can help. Keeping hands steady, pressing shutter gently, taking care not to tilt camera helps a lot. This is why a good tripod is so important - it takes all of these problems away.
This article might be helpful: Shooting Long Exposures Hand-Held - Articles and Tips | PentaxForums.com

**UncleVanya** · 10-02-2015, 02:41 PM

Originally posted by Na Horuk

Yeah, 2 sec timer includes MLU and automatically disables SR. The 20 sec timer does not include MLU, I think.

The 12 second timer does not - I was misremembering. The 2 second does as you and I have indicated. It is too bad that the 12 second doesn't because for some combinations I'm not sure 2 seconds is enough time to quell the vibrations.

---------- Post added 10-02-15 at 05:47 PM ----------

Originally posted by cali92rs

Did not know that, I stand corrected.
I wonder why they would implement it like that

The guess - and it's only a guess - is that somehow the sequence for firing the shutter requires the mirror go up and the shutter is "armed" at the same time. I know that makes no sense mechanically but I wonder if they made a programming decision that resulted in this without really thinking it through. The K3 does not behave this way with LiveView. At first I thought it might be mechanical but I can't see that since the 2 second timer trick and the IR remote w/3 sec timer works.

---------- Post added 10-02-15 at 05:48 PM ----------

Originally posted by stevebrot

The mirror and shutter sequence are tightly coupled in hardware on the K-30/K-50...one of the benefits of paying less for the camera, I would expect. The sequence is decoupled on the K-3. I don't know about the other models that support live view.

Steve do you have any references to qualify that? I was of that opinion until I realized the timer works - so how is it decoupled by LiveView isn't?

DeadJohn · 10-02-2015, 02:54 PM

P.S. The K-5 also does stupid mirror moves with liveview or 12-second timer. 2-second timer properly lifts the mirror at the start of countdown. The K-5 also has a mirror lockup mode so I don't think there's a mechanical limitation, just sloppy programming.

redridinghood · 10-02-2015, 08:18 PM

THank you all for your responses. 2 sec timer it is, then.

tibbitts · 10-03-2015, 01:27 PM

Has anyone tested to validate that 2sec is sufficient for vibrations to dissipate? I don't feel my 2sec-delay photos have vibration issues (except when I accidentally bump the tripod), but I haven't tested except in comparison to other photos made with the same setup (where I'm testing different lenses for example.)

10-02-2015, 10:20 AM	#1
redridinghood Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2014 Posts: 39	how to lock mirror up when taking a shot? I have pentax k50. I was reading in one of Scott Kelby's books that you can lock the mirror up for extra sharp shots -- does this functionality exist on k50? I know you can do that as part of the sensor cleaning exercise, but i thought there might be a more menu friendly way of doing this. Any ideas? Thanks

10-02-2015, 10:30 AM	#2
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Mirror lock-up is not an option on the K-50, though you can get many of the benefits by using the self-timer (either 2s ~~of 20s~~ or 12s). Steve Last edited by stevebrot; 10-02-2015 at 12:22 PM.

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10-02-2015, 10:40 AM	#3
cali92rs Veteran Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Long Beach, CA Posts: 3,354	Originally posted by stevebrot Mirror lock-up is not an option on the K-50, though you can get many of the benefits by using the self-timer (either 2s of 20s). Steve Also, when using live view, the mirror is locked up

10-02-2015, 10:41 AM	#4
Spodeworld Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: New Joisey Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,370	To build on stevebrot's comments. I believe that the mirror effectively locks up when you select the self-timer.

10-02-2015, 10:44 AM	#5
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,468	I'm working on an article that will give you some workaround options for this. It should be ready to publish soon. Essentially Steve is correct that there is no direct mirror lock up setting. However if you either use the IR Remote with the 3 sec delay or the self-timer (2 sec or 12 sec) these will flip the mirror up at the start of the count and allow time for the excess vibrations to die out. Live View contrary to what you may think does not help. The way the K50 works with Live View the mirror goes up when you enter that mode, but right before the shutter fires it drops and then goes back up immediately.

10-02-2015, 10:49 AM	#6
Just1MoreDave Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Aurora, CO Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,340	SR is also automatically turned off when you switch to either 2sec or 12sec. self-timers. Since you are probably using a tripod, that is useful because Pentax recommends disabling SR when using a tripod. In the self-timer drive modes, the mirror flips up first, then there's a delay, then the shutter opens. The mirror flipping can still cause vibrations in extreme cases. For example, I have an SMC Pentax 300mm f4 lens which has no tripod mount. On a cheap tripod, the mirror makes it vibrate for several seconds. I live close to a busy airport, so my test for vibrations is planes at night. I set a long exposure time and start the exposure when the plane just enters the frame. If the camera vibrates, the trail of the plane vibrates up and down in the shot. Stable setups make a smooth trail.

10-02-2015, 10:58 AM	#7
Na Horuk Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Slovenia, probably Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,186	Yeah, 2 sec timer includes MLU and automatically disables SR. The 20 sec timer does not include MLU, I think. Originally posted by redridinghood Scott Kelby's books that you can lock the mirror up for extra sharp shots For perfect sharpness you need tripod, trigger, 2 sec timer, lights, and good lens, set at its optimal aperture. Camera's ISO should be low as you can tolerate. Originally posted by cali92rs Also, when using live view, the mirror is locked up True, but I think when you press the shutter for a photo, the camera will still cycle the mirror down and up again. I may be wrong, but I think that is how it used to work Not too difficult to check - just take a shot in Tv mode with a slow shutter and listen for the individual clicks

10-02-2015, 11:38 AM	#8
DeadJohn Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: New York Posts: 4,834	+1 that the 2-second timer is a good way to accomplish mirror lock up.

10-02-2015, 12:00 PM	#9
cali92rs Veteran Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Long Beach, CA Posts: 3,354	Originally posted by UncleVanya Live View contrary to what you may think does not help. The way the K50 works with Live View the mirror goes up when you enter that mode, but right before the shutter fires it drops and then goes back up immediately. Did not know that, I stand corrected. I wonder why they would implement it like that

10-02-2015, 12:22 PM	#10
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by cali92rs I wonder why they would implement it like that The mirror and shutter sequence are tightly coupled in hardware on the K-30/K-50...one of the benefits of paying less for the camera, I would expect. The sequence is decoupled on the K-3. I don't know about the other models that support live view. Steve

10-02-2015, 01:48 PM	#11
Na Horuk Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Slovenia, probably Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,186	Btw, which lens are you using? MLU helps with sharpness in many situations. I would only use MLU with a tripod or some sort of stable base, anyway. But if you use only the kit lens, there is only so much it can do at all. Also, proper stance and holding technique can help. Keeping hands steady, pressing shutter gently, taking care not to tilt camera helps a lot. This is why a good tripod is so important - it takes all of these problems away. This article might be helpful: Shooting Long Exposures Hand-Held - Articles and Tips \| PentaxForums.com

10-02-2015, 02:41 PM	#12
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,468	Originally posted by Na Horuk Yeah, 2 sec timer includes MLU and automatically disables SR. The 20 sec timer does not include MLU, I think. The 12 second timer does not - I was misremembering. The 2 second does as you and I have indicated. It is too bad that the 12 second doesn't because for some combinations I'm not sure 2 seconds is enough time to quell the vibrations. ---------- Post added 10-02-15 at 05:47 PM ---------- Originally posted by cali92rs Did not know that, I stand corrected. I wonder why they would implement it like that The guess - and it's only a guess - is that somehow the sequence for firing the shutter requires the mirror go up and the shutter is "armed" at the same time. I know that makes no sense mechanically but I wonder if they made a programming decision that resulted in this without really thinking it through. The K3 does not behave this way with LiveView. At first I thought it might be mechanical but I can't see that since the 2 second timer trick and the IR remote w/3 sec timer works. ---------- Post added 10-02-15 at 05:48 PM ---------- Originally posted by stevebrot The mirror and shutter sequence are tightly coupled in hardware on the K-30/K-50...one of the benefits of paying less for the camera, I would expect. The sequence is decoupled on the K-3. I don't know about the other models that support live view. Steve do you have any references to qualify that? I was of that opinion until I realized the timer works - so how is it decoupled by LiveView isn't?

10-02-2015, 02:54 PM	#13
DeadJohn Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: New York Posts: 4,834	P.S. The K-5 also does stupid mirror moves with liveview or 12-second timer. 2-second timer properly lifts the mirror at the start of countdown. The K-5 also has a mirror lockup mode so I don't think there's a mechanical limitation, just sloppy programming.

10-02-2015, 08:18 PM	#14
redridinghood Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2014 Posts: 39 Original Poster	THank you all for your responses. 2 sec timer it is, then.

10-03-2015, 01:27 PM	#15
tibbitts Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Oklahoma USA Posts: 2,196	Has anyone tested to validate that 2sec is sufficient for vibrations to dissipate? I don't feel my 2sec-delay photos have vibration issues (except when I accidentally bump the tripod), but I haven't tested except in comparison to other photos made with the same setup (where I'm testing different lenses for example.)