Turn off Auto noise for 100-800 or leave on?

mhsp · 11-25-2015, 05:15 PM

Turn off Auto noise for 100-800 or leave on and do I use PEF or DNG when it comes to RAW file format? I know I have asked a lot but Pentax system is so new to me I need help, thanks.

stevebrot · 11-25-2015, 05:19 PM

Since you are shooting RAW, there is little to be accomplished by turning it off. As you accumulate experience with your camera and post-processing your images, you can experiment, but my experience with my K-3 is that tweaking that setting for RAW does almost nothing.

Steve

Kath · 11-25-2015, 05:24 PM

DNG for RAW is most commonly useful. I only use the noise reduction under certain circumstances and then, not until much higher ISO, like 3200.

You might benefit from the ebooks sold by a member here: Pentax eBook Samples - Columns | PentaxForums.com

**BigMackCam** · 11-25-2015, 05:28 PM

Originally posted by mhsp

Turn off Auto noise for 100-800 or leave on and do I use PEF or DNG when it comes to RAW file format? I know I have asked a lot but Pentax system is so new to me I need help, thanks.

Auto noise reduction won't apply to your RAW images, as far as I've been able to tell (I'm 99% certain it only applies to JPEGs, actually). I use DNG rather than PEF, as DNG is a non-manufacturer-specific standard from Adobe. Hence (in theory, at least), a DNG file from your Pentax camera is treated just the same as those from Canon, Nikon, Sony etc... As such, any post processing software capable of handling RAW images (and not tied to a specific manufacturer or camera) will be able to read your DNG files.

Oh, and never worry about asking for help - most folks here are glad to assist (I've had a *lot* of help!)

aleonx3 · 11-25-2015, 05:44 PM

I shoot only in DNG but I leave the high iso noise reduction in auto on mode. The information is recorded in the EXIF and Silkypix (full version) uses the information when I process the DNG file and clean the image nicely in the JPG conversion processing. IMHO, it works for me....

mhsp · 11-25-2015, 05:45 PM

Thank you so much guys, really appreciate it you have save me much time thanks

stevebrot · 11-25-2015, 05:45 PM

Originally posted by BigMackCam

Auto noise reduction won't apply to your RAW images, as far as I've been able to tell (I'm 99% certain it only applies to JPEGs, actually).

That is my experience as well. There is some NR applied to RAW by the image processor at high ISO that is visible, but not at the low end.

Originally posted by BigMackCam

Hence (in theory, at least), a DNG file from your Pentax camera is treated just the same as those from Canon, Nikon, Sony etc...

There are a lot of ways to build a valid DNG. My understanding is that a Pentax-generated DNG has more in common with a PEF (they are very similar) than with Canon-generated DNG or Adobe-generated DNG*. The general rule of thumb for processing software is that if the maker supports PEF, their DNG support will likely be good too. As always, YMMV.

Steve

* For example, Pentax cameras are unable to read Adobe-generated DNG even when the original source was a Pentax DNG/PEF. I believe the same is true for Pentax PDCU. The format is far from universal outside of Adobe product.

**BigMackCam** · 11-25-2015, 05:48 PM

Originally posted by aleonx3

I shoot only in DNG but I leave the high iso noise reduction in auto on mode. The information is recorded in the EXIF and Silkypix (full version) uses the information when I process the DNG file and clean the image nicely in the JPG conversion processing. IMHO, it works for me....

That's a very good point. I keep forgetting that the in-camera JPEG settings are held within the RAW file so, if you use Pentax's own post processing software, you can benefit from those settings. I don't use SilkyPix or Pentax DCU, so it doesn't help me. But still worth having the settings active in case you want to default to them when using Pentax-specific software...

stevebrot · 11-25-2015, 05:48 PM

Originally posted by aleonx3

The information is recorded in the EXIF and Silkypix (full version) uses the information when I process the DNG file and clean the image nicely in the JPG conversion processing. IMHO, it works for me....

How is your detail retention relative to cleaning up manually in PP? Just curious since Ed at Photouniverse made such a convincing case for detail loss with in-camera JPEG on the K-3.

Steve

mhsp · 11-25-2015, 05:49 PM

Oh, how about color space do I use sRGB or AdobeRGB

**BigMackCam** · 11-25-2015, 05:52 PM

Originally posted by stevebrot

My understanding is that a Pentax-generated DNG has more in common with a PEF (they are very similar) than with Canon-generated DNG or Adobe-generated DNG*.

Oh, I didn't know that, Steve. Interesting - I'd always been under the impression that a DNG is a DNG is a DNG... So, not all DNGs are made equal, then? Or is it the case that, so long as a particular DNG file conforms to the standards outlined by Adobe, the file *will* unequivocally process correctly through DNG-capable software (assuming the software concerned embraces the entire DNG standard... if one exists LOL)?

aleonx3 · 11-25-2015, 05:58 PM

Originally posted by BigMackCam

That's a very good point. I keep forgetting that the in-camera JPEG settings are held within the RAW file so, if you use Pentax's own post processing software, you can benefit from those settings. I don't use SilkyPix or Pentax DCU, so it doesn't help me. But still worth having the settings active in case you want to default to them when using Pentax-specific software...

In my case, I purchased the Silkypix standard version 6 (which I find to be immensely useful, not the DCU version). In the noise reduction section, the default various between shots (depending on the image) unless I change it (of course not), when I process the image (convert to JPG), it applies the suggested NR levels. This save me lots of time during processing as I don't need to worry about what ISO I use, which of course, IMHO, is a great tool to have.

Note, I also have Lightroom, but I don't know how to use LR to get a default noise reduction to be applied for that image showing on the development panel.

---------- Post added 11-25-2015 at 08:13 PM ----------

Originally posted by mhsp

Oh, how about color space do I use sRGB or AdobeRGB

I used AdobeRGB (uses a wider gamut than sRGB) before, but I don't see a point of using it since I don't do large prints, mostly on-line. So, for me, just sRGB for now.

jkomp316 · 11-25-2015, 06:19 PM

i turn off as much as possible. not that it changes much in raw. post processing gives more control and software like topaz denoise may offer better results.

kheir · 11-25-2015, 06:46 PM

I personally found the recommended settings in the detailed review to be very helpful, Pentax K-3 Review - Recommended Settings | PentaxForums.com Reviews

MikeD · 11-25-2015, 06:57 PM

Originally posted by mhsp

Oh, how about color space do I use sRGB or AdobeRGB

use RBG as it is a much larger color gamut than sRGB, most printers use sRBG so you would have to convert which is easy. But some like White Wall will print RGB also if you are printing at home you can use the full RGB.

11-25-2015, 05:15 PM	#1
mhsp Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 58	Turn off Auto noise for 100-800 or leave on? Turn off Auto noise for 100-800 or leave on and do I use PEF or DNG when it comes to RAW file format? I know I have asked a lot but Pentax system is so new to me I need help, thanks.

11-25-2015, 05:58 PM	#12
aleonx3 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Brampton, Ontario Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,996	Originally posted by BigMackCam That's a very good point. I keep forgetting that the in-camera JPEG settings are held within the RAW file so, if you use Pentax's own post processing software, you can benefit from those settings. I don't use SilkyPix or Pentax DCU, so it doesn't help me. But still worth having the settings active in case you want to default to them when using Pentax-specific software... In my case, I purchased the Silkypix standard version 6 (which I find to be immensely useful, not the DCU version). In the noise reduction section, the default various between shots (depending on the image) unless I change it (of course not), when I process the image (convert to JPG), it applies the suggested NR levels. This save me lots of time during processing as I don't need to worry about what ISO I use, which of course, IMHO, is a great tool to have. Note, I also have Lightroom, but I don't know how to use LR to get a default noise reduction to be applied for that image showing on the development panel. ---------- Post added 11-25-2015 at 08:13 PM ---------- Originally posted by mhsp Oh, how about color space do I use sRGB or AdobeRGB I used AdobeRGB (uses a wider gamut than sRGB) before, but I don't see a point of using it since I don't do large prints, mostly on-line. So, for me, just sRGB for now. Last edited by aleonx3; 11-25-2015 at 06:14 PM.

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11-25-2015, 05:19 PM	#2
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Since you are shooting RAW, there is little to be accomplished by turning it off. As you accumulate experience with your camera and post-processing your images, you can experiment, but my experience with my K-3 is that tweaking that setting for RAW does almost nothing. Steve

11-25-2015, 05:24 PM	#3
Kath Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Portland, OR Photos: Gallery Posts: 737	DNG for RAW is most commonly useful. I only use the noise reduction under certain circumstances and then, not until much higher ISO, like 3200. You might benefit from the ebooks sold by a member here: Pentax eBook Samples - Columns \| PentaxForums.com

11-25-2015, 05:28 PM	#4
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,661	Originally posted by mhsp Turn off Auto noise for 100-800 or leave on and do I use PEF or DNG when it comes to RAW file format? I know I have asked a lot but Pentax system is so new to me I need help, thanks. Auto noise reduction won't apply to your RAW images, as far as I've been able to tell (I'm 99% certain it only applies to JPEGs, actually). I use DNG rather than PEF, as DNG is a non-manufacturer-specific standard from Adobe. Hence (in theory, at least), a DNG file from your Pentax camera is treated just the same as those from Canon, Nikon, Sony etc... As such, any post processing software capable of handling RAW images (and not tied to a specific manufacturer or camera) will be able to read your DNG files. Oh, and never worry about asking for help - most folks here are glad to assist (I've had a lot of help!)

11-25-2015, 05:44 PM	#5
aleonx3 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Brampton, Ontario Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,996	I shoot only in DNG but I leave the high iso noise reduction in auto on mode. The information is recorded in the EXIF and Silkypix (full version) uses the information when I process the DNG file and clean the image nicely in the JPG conversion processing. IMHO, it works for me....

11-25-2015, 05:45 PM	#6
mhsp Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 58 Original Poster	Thank you so much guys, really appreciate it you have save me much time thanks

11-25-2015, 05:45 PM	#7
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by BigMackCam Auto noise reduction won't apply to your RAW images, as far as I've been able to tell (I'm 99% certain it only applies to JPEGs, actually). That is my experience as well. There is some NR applied to RAW by the image processor at high ISO that is visible, but not at the low end. Originally posted by BigMackCam Hence (in theory, at least), a DNG file from your Pentax camera is treated just the same as those from Canon, Nikon, Sony etc... There are a lot of ways to build a valid DNG. My understanding is that a Pentax-generated DNG has more in common with a PEF (they are very similar) than with Canon-generated DNG or Adobe-generated DNG. The general rule of thumb for processing software is that if the maker supports PEF, their DNG support will likely be good too. As always, YMMV. Steve For example, Pentax cameras are unable to read Adobe-generated DNG even when the original source was a Pentax DNG/PEF. I believe the same is true for Pentax PDCU. The format is far from universal outside of Adobe product.

11-25-2015, 05:48 PM	#8
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,661	Originally posted by aleonx3 I shoot only in DNG but I leave the high iso noise reduction in auto on mode. The information is recorded in the EXIF and Silkypix (full version) uses the information when I process the DNG file and clean the image nicely in the JPG conversion processing. IMHO, it works for me.... That's a very good point. I keep forgetting that the in-camera JPEG settings are held within the RAW file so, if you use Pentax's own post processing software, you can benefit from those settings. I don't use SilkyPix or Pentax DCU, so it doesn't help me. But still worth having the settings active in case you want to default to them when using Pentax-specific software...

11-25-2015, 05:48 PM	#9
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by aleonx3 The information is recorded in the EXIF and Silkypix (full version) uses the information when I process the DNG file and clean the image nicely in the JPG conversion processing. IMHO, it works for me.... How is your detail retention relative to cleaning up manually in PP? Just curious since Ed at Photouniverse made such a convincing case for detail loss with in-camera JPEG on the K-3. Steve

11-25-2015, 05:49 PM	#10
mhsp Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 58 Original Poster	Oh, how about color space do I use sRGB or AdobeRGB

11-25-2015, 05:52 PM	#11
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,661	Originally posted by stevebrot My understanding is that a Pentax-generated DNG has more in common with a PEF (they are very similar) than with Canon-generated DNG or Adobe-generated DNG. Oh, I didn't know that, Steve. Interesting - I'd always been under the impression that a DNG is a DNG is a DNG... So, not all DNGs are made equal, then? Or is it the case that, so long as a particular DNG file conforms to the standards outlined by Adobe, the file will* unequivocally process correctly through DNG-capable software (assuming the software concerned embraces the entire DNG standard... if one exists LOL)?

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11-25-2015, 06:19 PM	#13
jkomp316 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 227	i turn off as much as possible. not that it changes much in raw. post processing gives more control and software like topaz denoise may offer better results.

11-25-2015, 06:46 PM	#14
kheir New Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 1	I personally found the recommended settings in the detailed review to be very helpful, Pentax K-3 Review - Recommended Settings \| PentaxForums.com Reviews

11-25-2015, 06:57 PM	#15
MikeD Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: traverse city MI Posts: 346	Originally posted by mhsp Oh, how about color space do I use sRGB or AdobeRGB use RBG as it is a much larger color gamut than sRGB, most printers use sRBG so you would have to convert which is easy. But some like White Wall will print RGB also if you are printing at home you can use the full RGB.