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08-16-2017, 05:07 PM   #1
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Noise Reductiion

Lately I have been receiving comments that my uploaded images are too dark around the edges. The reason for this is that I am experiencing trouble with excessive Noise.

I have used the Reduce Noise feature on FastStones Image Viewer and Free Noise Reduction Software. FastStones is the better of the two, however the Noise is still prevalent and ugly as sin. I know the saying, "You get what you pay for", but this problem is very recent and also troublesome. I got back into FastStones and got into a feature titled, "Adjust Lighting", and tried the Shadow slide adjuster, moved it to the left and noticed that it darkens the Noisy areas to the point that they are not visible. That is a fine and inexpensive way to treat the symptoms but what about the root cause? I have lowered the ISO to the minimum on all of my equipment and that helped a little, but not very much. I wonder if something is amiss with the sensor and the way it processes my images.

Many thanks for any assistance.

TT

08-16-2017, 06:42 PM   #2
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Can you post some examples?
08-16-2017, 07:00 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tonytee Quote
Lately I have been receiving comments that my uploaded images are too dark around the edges. The reason for this is that I am experiencing trouble with excessive Noise.

I have used the Reduce Noise feature on FastStones Image Viewer and Free Noise Reduction Software. FastStones is the better of the two, however the Noise is still prevalent and ugly as sin. I know the saying, "You get what you pay for", but this problem is very recent and also troublesome. I got back into FastStones and got into a feature titled, "Adjust Lighting", and tried the Shadow slide adjuster, moved it to the left and noticed that it darkens the Noisy areas to the point that they are not visible. That is a fine and inexpensive way to treat the symptoms but what about the root cause? I have lowered the ISO to the minimum on all of my equipment and that helped a little, but not very much. I wonder if something is amiss with the sensor and the way it processes my images.

Many thanks for any assistance.

TT
Have you seen this: Google Nik Collection ?
Quite a few people use the noise reduction from that "now free" software.
But I am not sure whether this is only available as a plug-in or perhaps a stand alone version as well ?

---------- Post added 08-16-17 at 10:02 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Michaelina2 Quote
Go to #10... works for me..... might work for you, too.

WOW!!!!! I didn't think high ISO would be THIS good!! - PentaxForums.com

Cheers... M
I wished this could actually take "only 10 seconds" to do !
08-16-2017, 09:00 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tonytee Quote
Lately I have been receiving comments that my uploaded images are too dark around the edges. The reason for this is that I am experiencing trouble with excessive Noise.

I have used the Reduce Noise feature on FastStones Image Viewer and Free Noise Reduction Software. FastStones is the better of the two, however the Noise is still prevalent and ugly as sin. I know the saying, "You get what you pay for", but this problem is very recent and also troublesome. I got back into FastStones and got into a feature titled, "Adjust Lighting", and tried the Shadow slide adjuster, moved it to the left and noticed that it darkens the Noisy areas to the point that they are not visible. That is a fine and inexpensive way to treat the symptoms but what about the root cause? I have lowered the ISO to the minimum on all of my equipment and that helped a little, but not very much. I wonder if something is amiss with the sensor and the way it processes my images.

Many thanks for any assistance.

TT
It sounds like you either have a broken camera or you have your exposure comp set to -4.

08-17-2017, 02:03 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Michaelina2 Quote
Go to #10... works for me..... might work for you, too.

WOW!!!!! I didn't think high ISO would be THIS good!! - PentaxForums.com

Cheers... M
I am not sure I understand what you mean by Go to #10. Will you please clarify? Many thanks,

Tony

---------- Post added 08-17-17 at 02:17 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by severalsnakes Quote
Can you post some examples?
Now this was taken on a windy day, so it may not be salvageable through sharpening. It needs sharpening so you can imagine the amount Noise it will have post sharpening.

Canon EOS Rebel t5 body with Canon EF-S 55~250mm lens, 1/320s, F/5.6, ISO 640.

Thanks a bunch,

TT

---------- Post added 08-17-17 at 02:18 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by severalsnakes Quote
Can you post some examples?
I posted a photo down below. Thanks.

Tony
08-17-2017, 02:20 AM   #6
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I think you need to post a sample RAW file, Tony!
08-17-2017, 03:13 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
I think you need to post a sample RAW file, Tony!
I will do that. What do you think of the Noise in the Photo?

tt
08-17-2017, 03:19 AM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tonytee Quote
I have lowered the ISO to the minimum on all of my equipment and that helped a little
Yet your bee was shot at ISO 640 which for a mid-afternoon shot seems rather high?
Soft result might be a quality of that budget Canon EF-S 55~250mm lens and camera settings.
I don't know much about Canons, the T5 is a low-end entry model. so I'd not expect too much IQ from this camera and lens combo..
At the end of the day, some digital grain is not a photo killer. Better to get the shot than to worry about a little noise. Most all film results have grain, I know my old film shots are all way grainier than any of my digital shots.

Do you shoot RAW?

---------- Post added 08-17-17 at 08:22 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Tonytee Quote
What do you think of the Noise in the Photo?
Not anything to worry about at all imho.

08-17-2017, 04:42 AM   #9
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Thanks for posting the example. I looked through a few of the other images in your PF Gallery, too, and I don't see what you're talking about when you say folks are commenting that the photos are "too dark around the edges". A lot of the images I saw had dark backgrounds and/or high contrast - maybe there's something lost in translation of the critique and comments are trying to speak to that (and not the noise). I really didn't see anything in the images I examined that looked particularly noisy. The image posted above missed focus (as you say, it was a breezy day!), and sharpening versus noise reduction takes you in two very different directions as far as crisping up the focus in any given image... but again, I don't know how that can illicit the comment that the image is "too dark around the edges". As a relation to noise reduction (rather than lighting or contrast), I'm just not seeing it?
08-17-2017, 09:04 AM   #10
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I have seen a lot of nice shots that you have posted Tony. If you wanted to essentially keep the ISO/noise down, an option could be to utilize a tripod when your shooting environment/conditions permit. Then you could utilize a longer shutter speed, that will enable you to use an f stop that will yield enough detail, while using a low ISO to avoid unnecessary noise (for example 100 ISO).

Just a suggestion. I know it may not be applicable in all conditions you may encounter due to for example space or weather.
08-17-2017, 05:45 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by severalsnakes Quote
Thanks for posting the example. I looked through a few of the other images in your PF Gallery, too, and I don't see what you're talking about when you say folks are commenting that the photos are "too dark around the edges". A lot of the images I saw had dark backgrounds and/or high contrast - maybe there's something lost in translation of the critique and comments are trying to speak to that (and not the noise). I really didn't see anything in the images I examined that looked particularly noisy. The image posted above missed focus (as you say, it was a breezy day!), and sharpening versus noise reduction takes you in two very different directions as far as crisping up the focus in any given image... but again, I don't know how that can illicit the comment that the image is "too dark around the edges". As a relation to noise reduction (rather than lighting or contrast), I'm just not seeing it?
Greetings, had I known you would research the issue I would have mentioned that at a time of frustration, I deleted those images. Apologize, my bad.

Tony

---------- Post added 08-17-17 at 05:54 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
I think you need to post a sample RAW file, Tony!
Okay, I need your assistance here. I took several shots out back in RAW. They look fantastic and without any Noise. My problem is I uploaded into my computer, and I can downsize, however I am not able to Rotate the image over to Photo Editor 10. I can create a copy, but that will convert the image to JPEG. I can upload a RAW File into PYP, however, it will have some high numbers for resolution size. That may be okay as long as I am sure to delete the image after we have completed our discussion.

Your thoughts, please sir.

Tony

---------- Post added 08-17-17 at 06:09 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Steve.Ledger Quote
Yet your bee was shot at ISO 640 which for a mid-afternoon shot seems rather high?
Soft result might be a quality of that budget Canon EF-S 55~250mm lens and camera settings.
I don't know much about Canons, the T5 is a low-end entry model. so I'd not expect too much IQ from this camera and lens combo..
At the end of the day, some digital grain is not a photo killer. Better to get the shot than to worry about a little noise. Most all film results have grain, I know my old film shots are all way grainier than any of my digital shots.

Do you shoot RAW?

---------- Post added 08-17-17 at 08:22 PM ----------



Not anything to worry about at all imho.
Hi, that was my initial thought regarding the ISO 640 in the EXIF data. The ISO is set on Auto. With this camera, lens combo I do notice some unusual (to me) numbers in the EXIF data. I did discuss this issue with Canon and they were very nice in telling me that different companies use different type meters and different pixel quantity that can and will differ. They assured me there is nothing wrong with the camera. I hope they are right. You are correct in saying that combo is bottom shelf, but I have received some really excellent IQ with it. I especially am in love with that telephoto in that the Image Stabilization is awesome and I do not have to turn it off when on a tripod. Seems I just missed the boat when Canon released an updated one with STM feature. Other than that the optics and mechanics are identical. Okay, gotta go, and thanks very much for your input. Greatly appreciated.

Tony

---------- Post added 08-17-17 at 06:23 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by C_Jones Quote
I have seen a lot of nice shots that you have posted Tony. If you wanted to essentially keep the ISO/noise down, an option could be to utilize a tripod when your shooting environment/conditions permit. Then you could utilize a longer shutter speed, that will enable you to use an f stop that will yield enough detail, while using a low ISO to avoid unnecessary noise (for example 100 ISO).

Just a suggestion. I know it may not be applicable in all conditions you may encounter due to for example space or weather.

Thank you very much for your kind words. I must say, you have hit the nail right on the head. In this area where I shoot almost exclusively, there are three elements I must contend with. #1, The area has glass ceilings which harsh sunlight has unobstructed access. #2, Over head florescent lighting, which is the worst lighting for any useful purpose. #3, The area is open on three sides, so wind gusts and stiff breezes do present another problem all on its own. Typically I use a tripod approximately 95% of the time.

The other 5% is when I use the kit lens, which is light and has its own IS, Image Stabilization and I have no problem with holding it steady. Once again, many thanks for your excellent suggestions.

Tony

Last edited by Tonytee; 08-17-2017 at 06:25 PM. Reason: Grammar Error.
08-17-2017, 06:52 PM   #12
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Photo for Noise Issue Evaluation.

Same equipment. Canon EOS Rebel t5 body with Canon EF-S 55~250mm IS II Lens. Straight out of camera, totally.

1/125s, f/5.6, F/L 163mm, Manual Exp., Program, no flash and used Multi-Segment Metering.

Shot in RAW, had to convert it to JPEG in order to post here, so this is an exact copy.

Thanks for your assistance.

Tony

08-17-2017, 06:54 PM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tonytee Quote
I will do that. What do you think of the Noise in the Photo?

tt
I know that as a general rule Canons are inferior to Pentaxes for noise, Tony, that's just a consequence of Canon's sensor performance, but using the Nik Effects noise reduction plugin with Lightroom I was able to do this. Right tool for job, etc.

As much as I understand that this is an example of yours, not a keeper, I agree with others that some noise in the background shadows is not as problematic as the lack of focus, depth of field and low contrast.

Sometimes you just have to stake flowers that are subject to breezes and wait for the bee to come to them. Note that I've heard that bees change the electrostatic properties of the plant bits after they've visited, so that a bee is less likely to come to a flower that's already been 'done'.

If you use a flash and decide to turn the ambient exposure down to black (which would miss on the green leaves at the back), you get contrast back and the shutter speed effectively becomes around 1/10000s for freezing movement.
Attached Images
 

Last edited by clackers; 08-17-2017 at 09:45 PM.
08-18-2017, 02:05 AM   #14
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Well, I would like to say how delighted I am in making the right decision to offer this situation and the wonderful responses it generated. I will certainly shoot exclusively in RAW and not be concerned with a little inconvenience when converting to JPEG.

Again, many,many thanks.

Tony
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