Advice on vintage lens purchase

lilmii · 07-19-2018, 04:34 PM

New to this forum and new to manual lenses (other than when I was learning photography in school 15-20 years ago) and started buying some vintage lenses recently.

I just purchased a Super Takumar 50mm 1.4 for $40. The focus ring is smooth at the close end but starts to feel some resistance at 5ft and is really tight at the infinity end. Is it worth it to return it if I have to pay for return shipping? The optics seem okay from my limited testing, but I'm the opposite of an expert on this.

**TwoUptons** · 07-19-2018, 05:17 PM

Hi, and welcome.

That’s a hard question to answer. Those are not expensive lenses, generally.
I don’t know where you are, or what you paid for it, but I’ve had opportunities to buy them for not much more than it would cost for me to ship one back...

My copy, which was given to me, has a stiff spot. I suspect it was dropped at some point in its life. It slows me down a bit but doesn’t really bother me.

But if you paid a lot for something that was meant to be right, it may be worth it to try again...

-Eric

Not a Number · 07-19-2018, 05:47 PM - **2 Likes**

Often when the grease dries out on the focusing threads of a lens you'll have smooth and rough spots. Usually this is because what remains of the grease gets pushed to one or both ends of the threads. A good Cleaning, Lubrication and Adjustment (CLA) to replace the old grease will likely solve the problem. A CLA will probably cost at least as much as you spent on the lens. If you have the proper tools, skills and lubricants you could probably do it yourself.

Investing in a good and proper set of tools and lubricants will probably cost close to what you've spent on the lens.

**c.a.m** · 07-19-2018, 06:11 PM

I have several Takumar lenses in the 50-55mm focal length range. All of them have an exquisite, buttery-smooth, nicely damped focus action, which is characteristic of the Takumar lines, I think. I enjoy using them, in part because of their very nice handling. I'd be disappointed if any of my Takumars exhibited stiffness or irregularity in the focus or aperture control.

You may wish to consider returning your copy. Although you paid a reasonable price for it, they are not uncommon, so you could probably obtain a better one for a similar price.

You might wish to know that the Super-Takumar 50mm came in two basic variants -- a 'seven element' and an 'eight element'. The eight-element version is generally more desirable (and more expensive). More info here: Super-Takumar 50mm F1.4 (8-element variant) Reviews - M42 Screwmount Normal Primes - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database

and here: SMC/S-M-C/Super Takumar 50mm F1.4 Reviews - M42 Screwmount Normal Primes - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database

Welcome to Pentax Forums, and thanks for posing your question. You have good taste in vintage lenses!

- Craig

ddb · 07-19-2018, 06:19 PM

Unless you are a collector crunching resale value numbers, 40 $ is a fair price, if optically ok, I would talk to the seller and ask him to knock off 10 bucks and hope that lens will smoothen out somewhere down the road.

If you drop it once or twice the lens might fix itself, seriously

Nothing lasts forever.

Adam · 07-19-2018, 07:27 PM - **1 Like**

Sometimes these things smoothen out over time. I would try the lens out for a day, and if it doesn't get better I'd just return it. As others have pointed out, $40 isn't unusually low, so you should be able to find another one in better shape.

lilmii · 07-19-2018, 07:47 PM

Thanks everyone for the quick responses and advice. I'll try it out for a day and see if it loosens up. I'll also ask the seller if they will discount a bit, otherwise, I'll probably return it. I'm not confident enough to lubricate it myself and possibly ruin it even more.

**pentaxus** · 07-19-2018, 10:12 PM

It may be that something is bent at the front of the lens. The lens gets stiff near infinity because the bent outer part starts rubbing against the inside of the focusing ring. Just something to check.

dsmithhfx · 07-20-2018, 07:15 AM

Originally posted by lilmii

New to this forum and new to manual lenses (other than when I was learning photography in school 15-20 years ago) and started buying some vintage lenses recently.

I just purchased a Super Takumar 50mm 1.4 for $40. The focus ring is smooth at the close end but starts to feel some resistance at 5ft and is really tight at the infinity end. Is it worth it to return it if I have to pay for return shipping? The optics seem okay from my limited testing, but I'm the opposite of an expert on this.

I had a similar dilemma with a body that was shipped with inadequate cushioning. It appeared to be undamaged, but when I tried to load film, I discovered the rewind knob to be extremely stiff to lift, requiring a knife blade to leverage it up far enough to slip a film cannister in (the rewind knob otherwise functions perfectly normally). I liked the body so much anyway (it's the first SLR to have a copal square metal FP shutter, and is otherwise built like a tank), that I kept it too long to return while hoping to work out a solution*. Two years later, it's unfixed and I continue to use it. Pretty much all my film gear is long in the tooth, and has various age and hard-use -related flaws and defects. As long as I can get 'good' (to me) shots out of it, I'll keep using it.

*This put me off the particular dealer who I'd never had any problems with previously, but he went out of business anyway.

Eyewanders · 07-20-2018, 10:11 AM

Originally posted by lilmii

Thanks everyone for the quick responses and advice. I'll try it out for a day and see if it loosens up. I'll also ask the seller if they will discount a bit, otherwise, I'll probably return it. I'm not confident enough to lubricate it myself and possibly ruin it even more.

That's a good plan. As someone else mentioned, this is a Takumar and they have *legendary* focus action, all of them. $40 is fairly average for that lens, if a little cheap. If the seller isn't interested in a return it might be worth pursuing a discount (deep discount) so you've a lens you can play and learn with. But my advice is to simply find another from a different source. That lens is magic to use (I own 3 different Takumar 50s, including a version of that one) and again, the focus really is the main joy of handling it - you're being robbed of that currently.

If you do tear into it, I'd recommend trying to clean and relube the top and bottom of the helicoid only without completely disassembling the helicoid - they can be a genuine PITA to reassemble properly. You can gain access to one end and then the other when you've broken it down partially. There are quite a few tear-down write-ups on these... read/view them carefully before proceeding - it's not terribly difficult but there are particulars to pay attention to. Come back to the forum if you've questions.

Also, welcome.

lilmii · 07-20-2018, 10:41 AM

Originally posted by c.a.m

You might wish to know that the Super-Takumar 50mm came in two basic variants -- a 'seven element' and an 'eight element'. The eight-element version is generally more desirable (and more expensive). More info here: Super-Takumar 50mm F1.4 (8-element variant) Reviews - M42 Screwmount Normal Primes - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database

and here: SMC/S-M-C/Super Takumar 50mm F1.4 Reviews - M42 Screwmount Normal Primes - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database

How can I tell if it's the 7-element or the 8-element version?

dsmithhfx · 07-20-2018, 10:50 AM

Originally posted by lilmii

How can I tell if it's the 7-element or the 8-element version?

If the front element looks yellow (thorium), it's the 7 element. From what I've read, the difference in optical performance is negligible.

**c.a.m** · 07-20-2018, 11:06 AM

Originally posted by lilmii

How can I tell if it's the 7-element or the 8-element version?

Some information on the distinction is given at my link for the 8-element version - see just below the images of the lens.

lilmii · 07-20-2018, 02:35 PM

Originally posted by c.a.m

Some information on the distinction is given at my link for the 8-element version - see just below the images of the lens.

My lens has A and M, but the infrared marking is to the left of the 4.

It looks like the focusing has probably been tight for awhile because it looks like there are some "rubbed against" marks around the end of it.

---------- Post added 07-20-18 at 02:50 PM ----------

Originally posted by dsmithhfx

If the front element looks yellow (thorium), it's the 7 element. From what I've read, the difference in optical performance is negligible.

I think it does look yellow.

lilmii · 07-22-2018, 05:30 PM

Do these lenses all have a radio active rear element? If so, do I need to store it in a special way?

07-19-2018, 04:34 PM	#1
lilmii New Member Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 7	Advice on vintage lens purchase New to this forum and new to manual lenses (other than when I was learning photography in school 15-20 years ago) and started buying some vintage lenses recently. I just purchased a Super Takumar 50mm 1.4 for $40. The focus ring is smooth at the close end but starts to feel some resistance at 5ft and is really tight at the infinity end. Is it worth it to return it if I have to pay for return shipping? The optics seem okay from my limited testing, but I'm the opposite of an expert on this.

07-19-2018, 07:27 PM - 1 Like	#6
Adam Administrator Site Webmaster Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 51,595	Sometimes these things smoothen out over time. I would try the lens out for a day, and if it doesn't get better I'd just return it. As others have pointed out, $40 isn't unusually low, so you should be able to find another one in better shape. Adam PentaxForums.com Webmaster (Site Usage Guide \| Site Help \| My Photography) PentaxForums.com server and development costs are user-supported. You can help cover these costs by donating or purchasing one of our Pentax eBooks. Or, buy your photo gear from our affiliates, Adorama, B&H Photo, KEH, or Topaz Labs, and get FREE Marketplace access - click here to see how! Trusted Pentax retailers:

07-20-2018, 10:11 AM	#10
Eyewanders Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Land of the Salish Sea Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,343	Originally posted by lilmii Thanks everyone for the quick responses and advice. I'll try it out for a day and see if it loosens up. I'll also ask the seller if they will discount a bit, otherwise, I'll probably return it. I'm not confident enough to lubricate it myself and possibly ruin it even more. That's a good plan. As someone else mentioned, this is a Takumar and they have legendary focus action, all of them. $40 is fairly average for that lens, if a little cheap. If the seller isn't interested in a return it might be worth pursuing a discount (deep discount) so you've a lens you can play and learn with. But my advice is to simply find another from a different source. That lens is magic to use (I own 3 different Takumar 50s, including a version of that one) and again, the focus really is the main joy of handling it - you're being robbed of that currently. If you do tear into it, I'd recommend trying to clean and relube the top and bottom of the helicoid only without completely disassembling the helicoid - they can be a genuine PITA to reassemble properly. You can gain access to one end and then the other when you've broken it down partially. There are quite a few tear-down write-ups on these... read/view them carefully before proceeding - it's not terribly difficult but there are particulars to pay attention to. Come back to the forum if you've questions. Also, welcome. Last edited by Eyewanders; 07-20-2018 at 10:19 AM.

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07-19-2018, 05:17 PM	#2
TwoUptons Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 4,214	Hi, and welcome. That’s a hard question to answer. Those are not expensive lenses, generally. I don’t know where you are, or what you paid for it, but I’ve had opportunities to buy them for not much more than it would cost for me to ship one back... My copy, which was given to me, has a stiff spot. I suspect it was dropped at some point in its life. It slows me down a bit but doesn’t really bother me. But if you paid a lot for something that was meant to be right, it may be worth it to try again... -Eric

07-19-2018, 05:47 PM - 2 Likes	#3
Not a Number Moderator Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Venice, CA Posts: 10,526	Often when the grease dries out on the focusing threads of a lens you'll have smooth and rough spots. Usually this is because what remains of the grease gets pushed to one or both ends of the threads. A good Cleaning, Lubrication and Adjustment (CLA) to replace the old grease will likely solve the problem. A CLA will probably cost at least as much as you spent on the lens. If you have the proper tools, skills and lubricants you could probably do it yourself. Investing in a good and proper set of tools and lubricants will probably cost close to what you've spent on the lens.

07-19-2018, 06:11 PM	#4
c.a.m Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Ottawa, Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,189	I have several Takumar lenses in the 50-55mm focal length range. All of them have an exquisite, buttery-smooth, nicely damped focus action, which is characteristic of the Takumar lines, I think. I enjoy using them, in part because of their very nice handling. I'd be disappointed if any of my Takumars exhibited stiffness or irregularity in the focus or aperture control. You may wish to consider returning your copy. Although you paid a reasonable price for it, they are not uncommon, so you could probably obtain a better one for a similar price. You might wish to know that the Super-Takumar 50mm came in two basic variants -- a 'seven element' and an 'eight element'. The eight-element version is generally more desirable (and more expensive). More info here: Super-Takumar 50mm F1.4 (8-element variant) Reviews - M42 Screwmount Normal Primes - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database and here: SMC/S-M-C/Super Takumar 50mm F1.4 Reviews - M42 Screwmount Normal Primes - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database Welcome to Pentax Forums, and thanks for posing your question. You have good taste in vintage lenses! - Craig

07-19-2018, 06:19 PM	#5
ddb Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: LA Photos: Albums Posts: 35	Unless you are a collector crunching resale value numbers, 40 $ is a fair price, if optically ok, I would talk to the seller and ask him to knock off 10 bucks and hope that lens will smoothen out somewhere down the road. If you drop it once or twice the lens might fix itself, seriously Nothing lasts forever.

07-19-2018, 07:47 PM	#7
lilmii New Member Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 7 Original Poster	Thanks everyone for the quick responses and advice. I'll try it out for a day and see if it loosens up. I'll also ask the seller if they will discount a bit, otherwise, I'll probably return it. I'm not confident enough to lubricate it myself and possibly ruin it even more.

07-19-2018, 10:12 PM	#8
pentaxus Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Central Coast, CA Posts: 1,313	It may be that something is bent at the front of the lens. The lens gets stiff near infinity because the bent outer part starts rubbing against the inside of the focusing ring. Just something to check.

07-20-2018, 07:15 AM	#9
dsmithhfx Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Toronto Posts: 5,146	Originally posted by lilmii New to this forum and new to manual lenses (other than when I was learning photography in school 15-20 years ago) and started buying some vintage lenses recently. I just purchased a Super Takumar 50mm 1.4 for $40. The focus ring is smooth at the close end but starts to feel some resistance at 5ft and is really tight at the infinity end. Is it worth it to return it if I have to pay for return shipping? The optics seem okay from my limited testing, but I'm the opposite of an expert on this. I had a similar dilemma with a body that was shipped with inadequate cushioning. It appeared to be undamaged, but when I tried to load film, I discovered the rewind knob to be extremely stiff to lift, requiring a knife blade to leverage it up far enough to slip a film cannister in (the rewind knob otherwise functions perfectly normally). I liked the body so much anyway (it's the first SLR to have a copal square metal FP shutter, and is otherwise built like a tank), that I kept it too long to return while hoping to work out a solution. Two years later, it's unfixed and I continue to use it. Pretty much all my film gear is long in the tooth, and has various age and hard-use -related flaws and defects. As long as I can get 'good' (to me) shots out of it, I'll keep using it. This put me off the particular dealer who I'd never had any problems with previously, but he went out of business anyway.

07-20-2018, 10:41 AM	#11
lilmii New Member Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 7 Original Poster	Originally posted by c.a.m You might wish to know that the Super-Takumar 50mm came in two basic variants -- a 'seven element' and an 'eight element'. The eight-element version is generally more desirable (and more expensive). More info here: Super-Takumar 50mm F1.4 (8-element variant) Reviews - M42 Screwmount Normal Primes - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database and here: SMC/S-M-C/Super Takumar 50mm F1.4 Reviews - M42 Screwmount Normal Primes - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database How can I tell if it's the 7-element or the 8-element version?

07-20-2018, 10:50 AM	#12
dsmithhfx Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Toronto Posts: 5,146	Originally posted by lilmii How can I tell if it's the 7-element or the 8-element version? If the front element looks yellow (thorium), it's the 7 element. From what I've read, the difference in optical performance is negligible.

07-20-2018, 11:06 AM	#13
c.a.m Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Ottawa, Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,189	Originally posted by lilmii How can I tell if it's the 7-element or the 8-element version? Some information on the distinction is given at my link for the 8-element version - see just below the images of the lens.

07-20-2018, 02:35 PM	#14
lilmii New Member Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 7 Original Poster	Originally posted by c.a.m Some information on the distinction is given at my link for the 8-element version - see just below the images of the lens. My lens has A and M, but the infrared marking is to the left of the 4. It looks like the focusing has probably been tight for awhile because it looks like there are some "rubbed against" marks around the end of it. ---------- Post added 07-20-18 at 02:50 PM ---------- Originally posted by dsmithhfx If the front element looks yellow (thorium), it's the 7 element. From what I've read, the difference in optical performance is negligible. I think it does look yellow.

07-22-2018, 05:30 PM	#15
lilmii New Member Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 7 Original Poster	Do these lenses all have a radio active rear element? If so, do I need to store it in a special way?