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03-03-2020, 03:09 PM   #16
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I have a stand alone copy of Photoshop/Bridge CS6 that runs well on my 2008 Mac Pro. It does a great job fulfilling my needs. You could likely find a windows version.

QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
The only thing that will get you out of your software nightmare is better software. This means paying for software.
Check out the Adobe products. They've been writing imaging software for 30 years now. They have a pretty good handle on what they are doing.


03-03-2020, 03:18 PM - 3 Likes   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Oldbayrunner Quote
I'm glad they have a monthly fee. Prior to that every time there was a major upgrade it was $600 -$900 which cost me in the long run over $3000.00. At $9.99 you get every major update included both Lightroom and Photoshop so it would take a lot of years to equal their older cost module and both programs are significantly better.
That's just flabbergasting. $3000 for Adobe software? That's as much or more than I've spent on photo equipment, ever.

I went Linux, Rawtherapee, GIMP, Rapid Photo Downloader a couple years ago. More functionality than I even understand how to exercise, better results than I got out of Lightroom, and it costs me $0.00.

---------- Post added 03-03-20 at 05:19 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
The only thing that will get you out of your software nightmare is better software. This means paying for software.
Check out the Adobe products. They've been writing imaging software for 30 years now. They have a pretty good handle on what they are doing.
They have an excellent handle on monetizing a photographic workflow. Especially now that they've gone to the subscription model.
03-03-2020, 03:50 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tonytee Quote
I have been having a very difficult time working with both Windows Photo Editor 10 and FastStonesImaging
There is a mighty big river to cross going from Photo Editor 10 and/or FastStone Image Viewer to Photoshop (or any other bitmap editor with layers). Unless someone is serious about doing things like removing ex-husbands from family photos or commercial graphic design, the time investment required to learn how to use the program isn't worth it. I tried some "consumer-grade" programs like PaintShop Pro, Aftershot and Photoshop Elements for processing my digital photos, but I don't want to spend that much time on individual photos, I want to scan a bunch of photos, make some tweaks to a few of them, export the results to email or Flickr or here and carry on without making permanent changes. I also want to be able to download only new photos and have them saved to folders with meaningful names without have to open up a bunch of dialog boxes or babysit my computer while this is going on. That's why I settled on Lightroom, back when you could buy a permanent license for $150 CDN and upgrades for $70.

I'm stuck on version 5.7, so I've started to look for Lightroom alternatives, but I haven't found anything worth switching to yet. In my opinion, Microsoft Photo Editor is a terrible piece of software, whether you want to process 1 photo or 100, so it wouldn't take much for another program to be an upgrade. You could look at relatively inexpensive options like ACDSee, Corel AfterShot, PaintShop Pro or Photoshop Elements, but they don't stack up to Lightroom for cataloguing and ease of use. On the other hand if what you want most is to adjust contrast, remove dust spots and so on, you can get pretty close to Lightroom's toolset (and a couple of things that Lightroom can't do) with these programs. There are also a couple of free programs with just as big of toolsets as Lightroom, Darktable and RawTherapee, but from what I can tell, using those tools (and getting the program to run on Windows) is more work than the paid programs.
03-03-2020, 04:05 PM   #19
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Okay, I see now where I went wrong in describing my software problems. First, Windows Photo Editor 10 was a real joy to work with initially. Now with so many goofy automatic functions, it has become not much more than a constant irritant. While working on editing images, the software arbitrarily decides to stop everything and save all of my work. While saving all of my work, there is no
way to stop it other than to X out and other than that it will continue through infinity, never finishing the save process. What work I had accomplished up to that point, is lost and I must start all over again. When I am finished editing in FastStones, I have to return to the image in Photo Editor 10, and then cause the image to rotate in order for the changes to take effect. The problem here is that FastStones does not always come forward and change the image that I was working on. When it does come forward to the image in Photo Editor 10, the software continues to rotate without any input from me. Once it is done rotating, I have to make a change in Photo Editor 10 and then save it. Here is where the real problem is and that is that the only way I can upload
photos into this forum is by Photo Editor 10. That is why I am thinking of going around Photo Editor 10 by using another computer, tablet, laptop or whatever else works. I have contacted Microsoft numerous times and they seem to pretend to not understand my problem. I have seen many complaints from numerous customers regarding the same issues that I have brought forward here, and nothing is ever done about it. Microsoft doesn't even acknowledge the thousands of complaints that are lodged on a daily basis. I agree, that it is a software issue as far as I am concerned, but I have no way of getting around Windows Photo Editor 10.

Thanks for reading,

Tony

---------- Post added 03-03-20 at 04:35 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by RGlasel Quote
There is a mighty big river to cross going from Photo Editor 10 and/or FastStone Image Viewer to Photoshop (or any other bitmap editor with layers). Unless someone is serious about doing things like removing ex-husbands from family photos or commercial graphic design, the time investment required to learn how to use the program isn't worth it. I tried some "consumer-grade" programs like PaintShop Pro, Aftershot and Photoshop Elements for processing my digital photos, but I don't want to spend that much time on individual photos, I want to scan a bunch of photos, make some tweaks to a few of them, export the results to email or Flickr or here and carry on without making permanent changes. I also want to be able to download only new photos and have them saved to folders with meaningful names without have to open up a bunch of dialog boxes or babysit my computer while this is going on. That's why I settled on Lightroom, back when you could buy a permanent license for $150 CDN and upgrades for $70.

I'm stuck on version 5.7, so I've started to look for Lightroom alternatives, but I haven't found anything worth switching to yet. In my opinion, Microsoft Photo Editor is a terrible piece of software, whether you want to process 1 photo or 100, so it wouldn't take much for another program to be an upgrade. You could look at relatively inexpensive options like ACDSee, Corel AfterShot, PaintShop Pro or Photoshop Elements, but they don't stack up to Lightroom for cataloguing and ease of use. On the other hand if what you want most is to adjust contrast, remove dust spots and so on, you can get pretty close to Lightroom's toolset (and a couple of things that Lightroom can't do) with these programs. There are also a couple of free programs with just as big of toolsets as Lightroom, Darktable and RawTherapee, but from what I can tell, using those tools (and getting the program to run on Windows) is more work than the paid programs.


RGlasel, I totally agree with your perspective. I also do not wish to spend an inordinate amount of time by using Layering, Stitching, cross processing and whatever other happy stuff they load into the programs. I simply just do not have any interest in those areas. Now I have also purchased (on sale at half price) Affinity Photo which is supposed to be a clone of Photoshop. I have had the program for over a year and still cannot get it to work. I contacted their tech support and all I get are smart ass remarks and derogatory comments. So there was money gone down the drain. Even if Affinity Photo were the answer to all my prayers, I would still have to contend with Windows Photo Editor 10. Now, someone on this forum has advised me that it is possible to remove Windows Photo Editor 10, however I will be darned if I can figure out how. Windows has issues with folks trying to delete their software. I have also downloaded Gimp, which is so huge, it would take more time than I have left in this life to learn all of its complexities. Back to Affinity Photo. This is a software program that does not offer a feature that will allow the owner to delete an image. I could not believe it. How can you edit an image and not at some time need to delete it? Before I do any editing I always without fail, make a copy to work with. There are times when I have had to delete an image because it was ruined while using Noise Reduction and there was no way to resurrect it. Thanks for reading.

Tony

03-03-2020, 05:09 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by ThorSanchez Quote
That's just flabbergasting. $3000 for Adobe software? That's as much or more than I've spent on photo equipment, ever.

I went Linux, Rawtherapee, GIMP, Rapid Photo Downloader a couple years ago. More functionality than I even understand how to exercise, better results than I got out of Lightroom, and it costs me $0.00.

---------- Post added 03-03-20 at 05:19 PM ----------



They have an excellent handle on monetizing a photographic workflow. Especially now that they've gone to the subscription model.
I get that some people dislike the business model that pirating forced Adobe into. It's easy to hate a company when you suddenly have to pay for what you used to get for free, but that doesn't change the fact that they write the most comprehensive image editing software.

Photoshop Elements is available on amazon.ca for about Can$100.00. It is a very capable program for basic image editing.
I don't understand why anyone would bother looking elsewhere at that price.

---------- Post added Mar 3rd, 2020 at 06:17 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Tonytee Quote
Okay, I see now where I went wrong in describing my software problems. First, Windows Photo Editor 10 was a real joy to work with initially. Now with so many goofy automatic functions, it has become not much more than a constant irritant. While working on editing images, the software arbitrarily decides to stop everything and save all of my work. While saving all of my work, there is no
way to stop it other than to X out and other than that it will continue through infinity, never finishing the save process. What work I had accomplished up to that point, is lost and I must start all over again. When I am finished editing in FastStones, I have to return to the image in Photo Editor 10, and then cause the image to rotate in order for the changes to take effect. The problem here is that FastStones does not always come forward and change the image that I was working on. When it does come forward to the image in Photo Editor 10, the software continues to rotate without any input from me. Once it is done rotating, I have to make a change in Photo Editor 10 and then save it. Here is where the real problem is and that is that the only way I can upload
photos into this forum is by Photo Editor 10. That is why I am thinking of going around Photo Editor 10 by using another computer, tablet, laptop or whatever else works. I have contacted Microsoft numerous times and they seem to pretend to not understand my problem. I have seen many complaints from numerous customers regarding the same issues that I have brought forward here, and nothing is ever done about it. Microsoft doesn't even acknowledge the thousands of complaints that are lodged on a daily basis. I agree, that it is a software issue as far as I am concerned, but I have no way of getting around Windows Photo Editor 10.

Thanks for reading,

Tony

---------- Post added 03-03-20 at 04:35 PM ----------





RGlasel, I totally agree with your perspective. I also do not wish to spend an inordinate amount of time by using Layering, Stitching, cross processing and whatever other happy stuff they load into the programs. I simply just do not have any interest in those areas. Now I have also purchased (on sale at half price) Affinity Photo which is supposed to be a clone of Photoshop. I have had the program for over a year and still cannot get it to work. I contacted their tech support and all I get are smart ass remarks and derogatory comments. So there was money gone down the drain. Even if Affinity Photo were the answer to all my prayers, I would still have to contend with Windows Photo Editor 10. Now, someone on this forum has advised me that it is possible to remove Windows Photo Editor 10, however I will be darned if I can figure out how. Windows has issues with folks trying to delete their software. I have also downloaded Gimp, which is so huge, it would take more time than I have left in this life to learn all of its complexities. Back to Affinity Photo. This is a software program that does not offer a feature that will allow the owner to delete an image. I could not believe it. How can you edit an image and not at some time need to delete it? Before I do any editing I always without fail, make a copy to work with. There are times when I have had to delete an image because it was ruined while using Noise Reduction and there was no way to resurrect it. Thanks for reading.

Tony
This is what happens when you use inferior software. You get bugs and you get frustration.
I get that the full version of Photoshop is too much for most people, that is why they wrote Elements, a program that strips the upper level functions off of Photoshop but leaves the core usability.
03-03-2020, 06:07 PM   #21
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I have Affinity Photo and it does work - but I am not all that much of a fan of pixel level editors. The App Microsoft Photo is more of a viewer rather than a editor and yes, they have dummied it down so 9 year old's can add "filters".

What version of Affinity Photo do you have? They updated to v1.8 on 2020/02/27. You might be frustrated with using it as AP is billed as a replacement for Photoshop.

What type of computer are you using? Do you only shoot JPEG? What is your camera?
03-03-2020, 06:16 PM   #22
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Why do you think you are locked in to having to use Windows Photo Editor 10?

03-03-2020, 08:01 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
I get that some people dislike the business model that pirating forced Adobe into. It's easy to hate a company when you suddenly have to pay for what you used to get for free, but that doesn't change the fact that they write the most comprehensive image editing software.

Photoshop Elements is available on amazon.ca for about Can$100.00. It is a very capable program for basic image editing.
I don't understand why anyone would bother looking elsewhere at that price.

---------- Post added Mar 3rd, 2020 at 06:17 PM ----------



This is what happens when you use inferior software. You get bugs and you get frustration.
I get that the full version of Photoshop is too much for most people, that is why they wrote Elements, a program that strips the upper level functions off of Photoshop but leaves the core usability.


Well, Windows Photo Editor 10 came with my Dell Computer. In the beginning there were no problems at all. Everything went as smooth as silk. Then suddenly, some software engineer decided to keep his job a little longer by coming up with some ideas (inane at best) that end up not only useless, but continues to frustrate paying customers. To add insult to injury, they ignore customer requests to either stop the problem or offer ways to improve performance.

To answer your question regarding investing $100.00 in software, a lot of people just do not have the funds to spend. Second, there are a lot of people who do have the
funds, however their concept is: "Why spend the money when there are supposedly very competent software out there for free?" The key word here is: "Competent". And they are becoming fewer and fewer available. My only choices are now to either continue to tolerate the malfunctions of both FastStones and Windows Photo Editor 10 or just invest in some hardware with capable software. Thanks for all the helpful contributions.

Tony

---------- Post added 03-03-20 at 08:12 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by PDL Quote
I have Affinity Photo and it does work - but I am not all that much of a fan of pixel level editors. The App Microsoft Photo is more of a viewer rather than a editor and yes, they have dummied it down so 9 year old's can add "filters".

What version of Affinity Photo do you have? They updated to v1.8 on 2020/02/27. You might be frustrated with using it as AP is billed as a replacement for Photoshop.

What type of computer are you using? Do you only shoot JPEG? What is your camera?

Hello PDL, my version of Affinity Photo is: 1.7.3.481. My computer is a Dell Inspiron with Intel Inside Core i3. I shoot primarily JPEG because Windows Photo Editor 10 will not allow adjustments to be made on RAW Images. With a RAW Image, I must make a copy in Photo Editor 10, and that converts from RAW to JPEG. So it pretty much defeats its own purpose. I can process RAW Images in FASTSTONES, however, before I can upload to a site, I then have to make a copy in Photo Editor 10 and will cause the image to lose all the changes I made in FASTSTONES. As you can see, I really have no choice than to shoot in JPEG. I have a Pentax k-7 and a Canon EOS 80D. The same situation exists with the Canon and with the Nikons I had. Thanks,

Tny
03-03-2020, 08:16 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tonytee Quote
that it is possible to remove Windows Photo Editor 10
From experience it will get reinstalled with the next features update even if you do remove it and eventually you have to install the Windows 10 updates or your computer won't work (the only way to make sure your computer never installs updates is to never turn it on). That doesn't mean you have to use Photo Editor to download and view photos from your camera, but from time to time you will have to change Windows' default settings so Photo Editor doesn't pop up when you connect your camera or plug in a memory card reader. I find that Photo Editor takes forever to load on my quad core computer and is not capable of doing what I want it to, so I work around it, but I've also been using computers on a daily basis since 1981. I understand your frustration.
03-03-2020, 08:19 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by blacklite Quote
Why do you think you are locked in to having to use Windows Photo Editor 10?

I feel that way because I have tried using other software programs to upload into various sites. The only program I can use for uploading is Windows Photo Editor 10.

No matter which Photo Editing Software I use, I can only upload images through Photo Editor 10. If you know of a way I can work around the Photo Editor 10 without having

unload a boatload of dough-ray-mee, I am all ears.

Thanks,

Tony
03-03-2020, 08:59 PM   #26
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Try the Windows version of Darktable. It's free/open source. Darktable does just about everything Lightroom does, and does some things better. It will take some time to learn -- but so does Lightroom.
03-03-2020, 09:26 PM - 1 Like   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tonytee Quote
I feel that way because I have tried using other software programs to upload into various sites. The only program I can use for uploading is Windows Photo Editor 10.

No matter which Photo Editing Software I use, I can only upload images through Photo Editor 10. If you know of a way I can work around the Photo Editor 10 without having

unload a boatload of dough-ray-mee, I am all ears.

Thanks,

Tony
What sites are you uploading to that force you to use Windows Photo Editor 10? That is bizarre, I have uploaded to multiple sites and I do not use Windows Photo Editor 10.
03-03-2020, 10:04 PM - 1 Like   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by PDL Quote
What sites are you uploading to that force you to use Windows Photo Editor 10? That is bizarre, I have uploaded to multiple sites and I do not use Windows Photo Editor 10.
I too upload to Flickr; Facebook; this site and many others. I never use Windows10 Photo app. In fact I never use any app to upload.
03-03-2020, 11:45 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tonytee Quote
Here is where the real problem is and that is that the only way I can upload photos into this forum is by Photo Editor 10
When posting shots to PentaxForums just go to posting mode, click on "Manage Attachments", chose file from a folder on your computer and click "Upload". You will not need a specific software on your computer, just a photo somewhere in a folder.
Like PDL and pschlute I have never used a software on my computer to post something anywhere.

The first thing you should do is forget about Windows 10 Photo "editor". Don't use more than one software to start with.
03-04-2020, 01:09 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by pschlute Quote
I too upload to Flickr; Facebook; this site and many others. I never use Windows10 Photo app. In fact I never use any app to upload.

Then how do you upload to a photography site? Thnx,

TT
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