Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
03-09-2020, 10:39 AM   #1
New Member




Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 5
weird glitch noise on raw files - pentax k7 - smc pentax fa 50mm f1.4

hello i am new here, i have a pentax k7 with a weird glitch.

i bought the camera brand new in 2009 or 2010 with the kit zoom, and i wanted a fine pentax af prime to go with it, because i have bad eyes now and trouble to focus my manual lenses, and i found a good price on a used pentax f1.4 50mm fa.

the lens looks mint and i was very happy when i got it, but after using it i have a problem on my raw files : i have this huge noise glitch in the dark areas.

on the attached photos i made a comparison with my xr rikenon 50mm 1.4 in the same condition, and also another comparison with the jpg file which doesn't show this glitch.

it seems to happens at all speeds, all iso, on any apperture setting including A. the lens is properly detected as FA 50mm 1.4 by the camera when it is set to A.

i do all my digital work on linus with gimp using ufraw.

big question is why only with this lens ? never had a problem like this with any other lens before.

if you have any clue on this it would be very much appreciated, as i don't really understand how a lens can do that, and i'd really like to be able to use it fully.

thanks !

Attached Images
 
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX K-7  Photo 
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX K-7  Photo 
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX K-7  Photo 
03-09-2020, 11:18 AM   #2
Custom User Title
Loyal Site Supporter
FozzFoster's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Alberta
Photos: Albums
Posts: 4,856
how freaking bizarre! I personally never seen something like this.. maybe it's the camera's fault, not the lens(?)
Perhaps try turning off in-camera lens corrections. The Rikenon doesn't have in-camera corrections so maybe that's why you're not getting the glitch with this lens..
No clues really... best luck!
03-09-2020, 11:27 AM   #3
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
DaveSimo's Avatar

Join Date: May 2017
Location: London
Posts: 58
Could you upload the RAW file on here please so I may download it?

I will upload it to my debugger and see what I can find. It may be an issue with ufraw. Either way Iíll run it on my Debian machine and find out for you
03-09-2020, 11:36 AM - 1 Like   #4
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
BigMackCam's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: North-East of England
Posts: 15,099
Welcome to the forums

What happens if you develop the raw image to JPEG in-camera? And how about the embedded JPEG thumbnail in the raw file... does that look OK, or does it show the same problem.

As @DaveSimo suggests, I'm also thinking this may be an issue with UFRaw...

03-09-2020, 12:06 PM   #5
New Member




Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 5
Original Poster
thank you very much for the warm welcome and the quick replies.

here is a link to the faulty raw files from this test : WeTransfer
it's been a while since the last time i used a file transfer tool, please tell me if i should use another site, if the download is too slow or you get too many ads.

@FozzFoster : i don't have acces to lens correction in my k7 menu, it's grayed out.

@BigMackCam : if i develop the raw to jpg in the camera, the image is fine, no glitch. also if you ask about the thumbnail in my file browser it appears blank, i think xfce or thunar does not like .pef thumbnails.
03-09-2020, 12:31 PM - 1 Like   #6
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
BigMackCam's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: North-East of England
Posts: 15,099
QuoteOriginally posted by jopopo Quote
here is a link to the faulty raw files from this test : WeTransfer

...

@BigMackCam : if i develop the raw to jpg in the camera, the image is fine, no glitch. also if you ask about the thumbnail in my file browser it appears blank, i think xfce or thunar does not like .pef thumbnails.
OK, so UFRaw appears to be the problem. I just loaded both of those files into RawTherapee (running under Linux Mint 18.3) and they're both fine... See attached
Attached Images
   
03-09-2020, 01:00 PM   #7
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
DaveSimo's Avatar

Join Date: May 2017
Location: London
Posts: 58
QuoteOriginally posted by jopopo Quote
thank you very much for the warm welcome and the quick replies.

here is a link to the faulty raw files from this test : WeTransfer
it's been a while since the last time i used a file transfer tool, please tell me if i should use another site, if the download is too slow or you get too many ads.

@FozzFoster : i don't have acces to lens correction in my k7 menu, it's grayed out.

@BigMackCam : if i develop the raw to jpg in the camera, the image is fine, no glitch. also if you ask about the thumbnail in my file browser it appears blank, i think xfce or thunar does not like .pef thumbnails.
Hey, just as BigMackCam has done, I've run this through several packages: Darktable, GIMP, Affinity and Lightroom. No problems with any of them.

However when I tried to debug using UFRaw (on Debian) it shows me that there may be an issue with how the shadows are being interpreted. Though I'm a bit suspicious of my findings since it seems to be lens-dependent.

Could you do me a favour and take more photos but this time get the camera to save them as DNG files rather than PEF. Try those and see if you get the same result. DNG is far more widely supported as it is open source.

Thanks
03-09-2020, 01:45 PM   #8
New Member




Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 5
Original Poster
alright thank you guys ! at least i can install rawtherapee if it solves it. still no clue why it happens with this lens but i can live with a little bit of mstery in my life.

here is one last shot i just took saved as dng, no change in ufraw except for the better exposure, less glitch but still here : WeTransfer

this time thunar shows me a thumbnail and it's glitchy as well.

also maybe should i update the firmware ? got the camera brand new 10 years ago and never updated it, do you think it might be the cause of this issue ? i just thought about that.

Attached Images
 
03-09-2020, 02:30 PM - 1 Like   #9
Pentaxian




Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 639
QuoteOriginally posted by jopopo Quote
alright thank you guys ! at least i can install rawtherapee if it solves it. still no clue why it happens with this lens but i can live with a little bit of mstery in my life.

here is one last shot i just took saved as dng, no change in ufraw except for the better exposure, less glitch but still here : WeTransfer

this time thunar shows me a thumbnail and it's glitchy as well.

also maybe should i update the firmware ? got the camera brand new 10 years ago and never updated it, do you think it might be the cause of this issue ? i just thought about that.
This is very interesting. I have not used thunar for ages and do not know much about it. How does the preview work for raws with it? Does it use the embedded jpg or render a preview from the raw data? If it uses the embedded jpg, it is a rather strange behaviour.
Does it throw any exceptions or warnings in verbose mode?
Not quite sure yet, how the lens causes this.
03-09-2020, 03:02 PM   #10
New Member




Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 5
Original Poster
i think thunar did not make a preview until i open it in ufraw. then only the thumbnail appeared. linux and the little things. i also just noticed it sometimes previews pef files, glitched as well, seems random, some folders show thumbnails others not. i don't know how to use verbose mode, do you mean open from terminal ? when i open thunar in root from the terminal i get error messages when i open any raw files, glitched or not.

Code:
jopopo@jopopo-SVE1711X1EB ~ $ sudo thunar
[sudo] Mot de passe de jopopo*:

(gimp-2.8:4229): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: g_object_set_valist: object class 'GeglConfig' has no property named 'cache-size'

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAA440 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:dissolve-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAA910 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:behind-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAAF20 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:multiply-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAB2F0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:screen-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAB6E0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:overlay-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CABB10 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:difference-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CABED0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:addition-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAC310 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:subtract-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAC6D0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:darken-only-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CACB20 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:lighten-only-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CACF30 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:hue-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAD260 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:saturation-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CADAC0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:color-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CADF30 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:value-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAE2B0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:divide-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAE730 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:dodge-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAEAA0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:burn-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAEEF0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:hardlight-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAF290 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:softlight-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAF690 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:grain-extract-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAFAF0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:grain-merge-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CAFEA0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:color-erase-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CB0290 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:erase-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CB06B0 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:replace-mode"

(gimp-2.8:4229): GEGL-gegl-operation.c-WARNING **: Cannot change name of operation class 0x2CB0A80 from "gimp:point-layer-mode" to "gimp:anti-erase-mode"

(ufraw-gimp:4249): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_object_unref: assertion 'G_IS_OBJECT (object)' failed

(ufraw-gimp:4249): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_object_unref: assertion 'G_IS_OBJECT (object)' failed
03-09-2020, 03:45 PM   #11
Site Supporter
Site Supporter




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Prince George, BC
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,076
From the terminal output, it seems that GIMP is involved somehow. Possibly, raw files are piped through GIMP which uses Ufraw to open raw files? As well, I did not know Gimp v2.8 enabled GEGL by default so this is probably something that Ufraw is doing. Perhaps check to see if you can change the default viewer for raw files from GIMP to Ufraw itself. Then you would only have Ufraw to investigate rather than it and GIMP. Also, check if Ufraw is somehow using GEGL for the graphics. If so, try turning it off. Could be the higher bit depths of GEGL are not supported on your display.
03-09-2020, 04:29 PM   #12
New Member




Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 5
Original Poster
just realized ufraw is now integrated to gimp, i don't have it installed. going to bed now will keep an eye on this thread tomorrow and this week, will probably update the k7 just to be sure, and try install ufraw and see what it does, also will probably install raw therapee next but now i'm curious if we can solve this.

apparently gegl is an experimental tool on gimp, i looked into the help and that's what comes out.

before i leave, here is the log and config of ufraw on one of these bad raw files.

Code:
log

ufraw_open: w:4684 h:3122 curvesize:0
EXIF data read using exiv2, buflen 63404

Scaling with darkness 0, saturation 4095, and
multipliers 0,289902 0,277959 1,000000 0,277959
Loading Pentax K-7 image from /home/jopopo/Bureau/glitch dslr/pentaxforums/IMGP3237.PEF ...
Black: 0, Maximum: 4095
AHD interpolation...
Code:
config

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>
<UFRaw Version='7'>
<WB>Auto WB</WB>
<WBFineTuning>0</WBFineTuning>
<Temperature>2892</Temperature>
<Green>0.936</Green>
<ChannelMultipliers>1.0306 1.0000 3.9267 1.0000</ChannelMultipliers>
<Lensfun>
<LensModel>Pentax, smc PENTAX-FA 50mm f/1.4</LensModel>
<TCA Index='3rd order polynomial'>
<Model Label='3rd order polynomial'>
<vr>1.0002325</vr>
<vb>0.9997591</vb>
<cr>0.0000000</cr>
<cb>0.0000000</cb>
<br>0.0000000</br>
<bb>0.0000000</bb>
</Model>
</TCA>
<Distortion Index='3rd order polynomial'>
<Model Label='3rd order polynomial'>
<k1>-0.002030</k1>
</Model>
</Distortion>
<LensGeometry>Rectilinear</LensGeometry>
</Lensfun>
<BaseManualCurve Current='yes'>
<AnchorXY>0.000000 0.000000</AnchorXY>
<AnchorXY>0.392157 0.501961</AnchorXY>
<AnchorXY>1.000000 1.000000</AnchorXY>
</BaseManualCurve>
<ManualCurve Current='yes'>
</ManualCurve>
<MatrixInputProfile Current='yes'>Color matrix
</MatrixInputProfile>
<sRGBOutputProfile Current='yes'>sRGB
</sRGBOutputProfile>
<SystemDisplayProfile Current='yes'>System default
</SystemDisplayProfile>
<Make>Pentax</Make>
<Model>K-7</Model>
</UFRaw>
and here on one of the good raws

Code:
log

ufraw_open: w:4684 h:3122 curvesize:0
EXIF data read using exiv2, buflen 37078
Warning: Exif tag Exif.Photo.MakerNote not encoded
Warning: Exif tag Exif.Pentax.0x0404 not encoded
Warning: Exif tag Exif.Pentax.0x0405 not encoded
Warning: Exif tag Exif.Pentax.0x0406 not encoded

Scaling with darkness 0, saturation 4095, and
multipliers 1,000000 0,533333 0,635417 0,533333
Loading Pentax K-7 image from /home/jopopo/Bureau/photo 23.02.20/IMGP2906.PEF ...
Black: 0, Maximum: 4095
Code:
config

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>
<UFRaw Version='7'>
<WB>Auto WB</WB>
<WBFineTuning>0</WBFineTuning>
<Temperature>4706</Temperature>
<Green>1.072</Green>
<ChannelMultipliers>1.5520 1.0000 1.4259 1.0000</ChannelMultipliers>
<Lensfun>
<LensModel>Pentax, SMC Pentax DA 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6</LensModel>
<Distortion Index='PanoTools lens model'>
<Model Label='PanoTools lens model'>
<a>0.000000</a>
<b>0.001207</b>
<c>0.000000</c>
</Model>
</Distortion>
<LensGeometry>Rectilinear</LensGeometry>
</Lensfun>
<BaseManualCurve Current='yes'>
<AnchorXY>0.000000 0.000000</AnchorXY>
<AnchorXY>0.392157 0.501961</AnchorXY>
<AnchorXY>1.000000 1.000000</AnchorXY>
</BaseManualCurve>
<ManualCurve Current='yes'>
</ManualCurve>
<MatrixInputProfile Current='yes'>Color matrix
</MatrixInputProfile>
<sRGBOutputProfile Current='yes'>sRGB
</sRGBOutputProfile>
<SystemDisplayProfile Current='yes'>System default
</SystemDisplayProfile>
<Make>Pentax</Make>
<Model>K-7</Model>
</UFRaw>
i think i should have digged that first, didn't think of it.
03-09-2020, 04:46 PM   #13
Site Supporter
Site Supporter




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Prince George, BC
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,076
Yes, it appears that the bad image results from ufraw identifying the camera as a K-1 rather than a K-7. Time to send a bug report to the ufraw and/or the lensfun author.
03-09-2020, 06:46 PM   #14
Pentaxian
Just1MoreDave's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Aurora, CO
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 5,718
QuoteOriginally posted by jopopo Quote
...also maybe should i update the firmware ? got the camera brand new 10 years ago and never updated it, do you think it might be the cause of this issue ? i just thought about that.
It's not mentioned in the list of firmware improvements but it's not a bad idea.

Latest K-7 Firmware Update : Software Downloads | RICOH IMAGING
03-09-2020, 07:02 PM   #15
Pentaxian




Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 639
QuoteOriginally posted by jbinpg Quote
Yes, it appears that the bad image results from ufraw identifying the camera as a K-1 rather than a K-7. Time to send a bug report to the ufraw and/or the lensfun author.
The negative correction value with
the "k1" mark will cause this. The value causes the unsigned int to drop "below" 0 and causes very high values on the channel. So dark shadows are suddenly red.
Clearly a bug in ufraw.
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
50mm, camera, fa, files pentax k7, glitch, k7 smc pentax, lens, pentax, pentax fa 50mm, pentax help, pentax k7 smc, photography, smc pentax fa, troubleshooting
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Weird Videography Glitch, K-1 and the new 50mm f/1.4 K David Pentax K-1 14 05-14-2019 07:51 AM
[Asking]SMC Pentax K 50mm f1/4 VS Pentax-M 50mm f1.4 VS Pentax-M 50mm f1.7 ? liemjerry Pentax SLR Lens Discussion 29 07-08-2015 04:23 PM
DPI of raw files vs jpg files MADDSNIPER Troubleshooting and Beginner Help 2 09-14-2013 11:37 AM
Weird and scary glitch on monitor during Live View on K5 IIs wafflehaus Pentax K-5 14 03-15-2013 08:19 AM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:13 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top