[jllaurado]

Hello everyone,

I´d appreciate some help with a problem of vertical pattern lines that show in my images even at base ISO. See example below.

I´m very new to Pentax, got a K-m a few months ago and was so happy with it that recently i bought a K-7 to keep experiencing with the brand in order to decide if i wanted to move completely to this system.
Of course it was a used model, and when i met the previous owner i tested the camera and everything seemed to go well. I didn´t use the camera for some days due to lack of time and a few days later i bought a grip for it and installed it right away, but not the original from Pentax.
I went out to test the camera for a whole day and i begun finding many problems that got me worried, very underexposed images, lots of incredible noise ruining the shot at base ISO in the middle of the day, and many other problems that were not constant, as some shots came out nice. Let me add that i did install the battery in the grip, not in the camera body (this might be important, though at that time i didn´t know).

I found some adjustments in the menus from the previous owner that i didn´t like so i decided to reset the camera to see if those might be the cause of the problems, and at the same time moved the battery from the grip to the body (still unaware if this might be important).

Last night i found some posts here (related to the K-10D) in relation to that old VPN problem saying that the grip might cause electric interferences and those might show in the image, but my camera is not a K-10D but a K-7. I´ve since tested the camera and the underexposed thing and crazy noise seems to be gone, but now i find those vertical lines showing up in many images, not really very visible unless you zoom in, but i guess those should not be there.

Now that i learnt on the possible grip problems I´ll try over the weekend by removing the grip and see if there´s some improvement, but in the meantime i´d appreciate some input on other possible causes of this, or if someone else has experienced this.

I´m still not sure if this problem is that banding shown in images with that VPN problem.
The camera has the original battery, still holding charge very well, and the lens used is the kit one, 18-55 WR, and i shoot RAW+ (PEF) and Manual mode always.


The cropped test image showing the problem, a shot of the sky so it´s easier to see:


Thanks

Attached Images

 

[slartibartfast01]

Hello everyone,

I´d appreciate some help with a problem of vertical pattern lines that show in my images even at base ISO. See example below.

I´m very new to Pentax, got a K-m a few months ago and was so happy with it that recently i bought a K-7 to keep experiencing with the brand in order to decide if i wanted to move completely to this system.
Of course it was a used model, and when i met the previous owner i tested the camera and everything seemed to go well. I didn´t use the camera for some days due to lack of time and a few days later i bought a grip for it and installed it right away, but not the original from Pentax.
I went out to test the camera for a whole day and i begun finding many problems that got me worried, very underexposed images, lots of incredible noise ruining the shot at base ISO in the middle of the day, and many other problems that were not constant, as some shots came out nice. Let me add that i did install the battery in the grip, not in the camera body (this might be important, though at that time i didn´t know).

I found some adjustments in the menus from the previous owner that i didn´t like so i decided to reset the camera to see if those might be the cause of the problems, and at the same time moved the battery from the grip to the body (still unaware if this might be important).

Last night i found some posts here (related to the K-10D) in relation to that old VPN problem saying that the grip might cause electric interferences and those might show in the image, but my camera is not a K-10D but a K-7. I´ve since tested the camera and the underexposed thing and crazy noise seems to be gone, but now i find those vertical lines showing up in many images, not really very visible unless you zoom in, but i guess those should not be there.

Now that i learnt on the possible grip problems I´ll try over the weekend by removing the grip and see if there´s some improvement, but in the meantime i´d appreciate some input on other possible causes of this, or if someone else has experienced this.

I´m still not sure if this problem is that banding shown in images with that VPN problem.
The camera has the original battery, still holding charge very well, and the lens used is the kit one, 18-55 WR, and i shoot RAW+ (PEF) and Manual mode always.


The cropped test image showing the problem, a shot of the sky so it´s easier to see:


Thanks

Looking at your image on my phone I can't see lines. Can you give a clue where to look?

[biz-engineer]

The K-7 was released in spring 2009, that's 12 years ago. Consumer electronics components are designed to last a maximum of 11 years, not really surprising to start having issues after a decade. How about to buy a new camera?

[jllaurado]

The K-7 was released in spring 2009, that's 12 years ago. Consumer electronics components are designed to last a maximum of 11 years, not really surprising to start having issues after a decade. How about to buy a new camera?

I understand that, but i have much older Canon cameras that don´t even show a hint of this, even the K-m shows perfectly clear images (its CCD sensor), i´ll check removing the grip to see if that might be the cause

---------- Post added 02-12-21 at 03:42 AM ----------

Looking at your image on my phone I can't see lines. Can you give a clue where to look?

It´s a regularly spaced pattern going vertically all over the image, but i guess the phone won´t show them

[biz-engineer]

I understand that, but i have much older Canon cameras that don´t even show a hint of this, even the K-m shows perfectly clear images (its CCD sensor), i´ll check removing the grip to see if that might be the cause

Failure is statistical, doesn't happen to all devices same time same day. Probability of defect is according to bathtub curve (Bathtub curve - Wikipedia), early life defects, then very low probability of failure, then probability of failure goes significantly up again towards end of life. Life time also depends on how much the device is used and use conditions (temperature, humidity, supply voltage) and also if the device was submitted to stress, mechanical stress or electrical stress such as electrostatic discharges when entering a car and putting the camera on the passenger seat while the synthetic material of the seat is electrostatic charged.

[jllaurado]

Failure is statistical, doesn't happen to all devices same time same day. Probability of defect is according to bathtub curve (Bathtub curve - Wikipedia), early life defects, then very low probability of failure, then probability of failure goes significantly up again towards end of life. Life time also depends on how much the device is used and use conditions (temperature, humidity, supply voltage) and also if the device was submitted to stress, mechanical stress or electrical stress such as electrostatic discharges when entering a car and putting the camera on the passenger seat while the synthetic material of the seat is electrostatic charged.

Thanks, actually the camera had a very low use (9k photos in total) and was/is in mint condition, the previous owner did care well for it. I´ll keep on trying to find if it is actually what you say, age.

[slartibartfast01]

I understand that, but i have much older Canon cameras that don´t even show a hint of this, even the K-m shows perfectly clear images (its CCD sensor), i´ll check removing the grip to see if that might be the cause

---------- Post added 02-12-21 at 03:42 AM ----------


It´s a regularly spaced pattern going vertically all over the image, but i guess the phone won´t show them

I wonder if it is some kind of processing artifact. Does the K7 have image correction or does your processing software have it?

[jllaurado]

I wonder if it is some kind of processing artifact. Does the K7 have image correction or does your processing software have it?

While i´m learnning to use it i have mostly everyhing off, all the corrections and enhacements disabled, and still the pattern shows in both PEF and Jpegs before postprocessing

[TonyW]

I am certainly no expert on Pentax DSLR's so I can only throw out a few suggestions that may help with your search to cure the issue. No EXIF data with the image so assumptions made it was shot at or near base ISO?

I have taken the liberty of looking at your image in PS and TBH have never seen such a result just looking at the histogram to start with the large seperation of the RGB channels is very strange, as is the noise, particularly in the Red channel. The attached image shows the RGB histogram and the corrections I made to clarify accentuate the vertical lines. It could easily be any number of issues, hopefully not a camera breakdown - I have a couple of digital cameras nearly 20 years old and still functioning perfectly!

The problem could well be electrical interference and starting with the assumption that the camera is basically sound:

• Take the grip off and any other accessory you may have added shoot some images of plain subjects at base ISO and process as normal. Do they look OK?
• If the problem still persists. How are you making the image transfers to camera?
  • If you are using a USB cable to transfer try another cable or take SD card out of camera and use a card reader
  • If you are using a card reader confirm that it is reading other cards correctly
• Try swapping SD cards for a proven good one.

Good luck

[jllaurado]

I am certainly no expert on Pentax DSLR's so I can only throw out a few suggestions that may help with your search to cure the issue. No EXIF data with the image so assumptions made it was shot at or near base ISO?


I have taken the liberty of looking at your image in PS and TBH have never seen such a result just looking at the histogram to start with the large seperation of the RGB channels is very strange, as is the noise, particularly in the Red channel. The attached image shows the RGB histogram and the corrections I made to clarify accentuate the vertical lines. It could easily be any number of issues, hopefully not a camera breakdown - I have a couple of digital cameras nearly 20 years old and still functioning perfectly!

The problem could well be electrical interference and starting with the assumption that the camera is basically sound:

• Take the grip off and any other accessory you may have added shoot some images of plain subjects at base ISO and process as normal. Do they look OK?
• If the problem still persists. How are you making the image transfers to camera?
  • If you are using a USB cable to transfer try another cable or take SD card out of camera and use a card reader
  • If you are using a card reader confirm that it is reading other cards correctly
• Try swapping SD cards for a proven good one.

Good luck

Thanks, i´ll try all of that.

I always use an external SD card reader to move the images to my PC.

[biz-engineer]

Thanks, actually the camera had a very low use (9k photos in total) and was/is in mint condition, the previous owner did care well for it. I´ll keep on trying to find if it is actually what you say, age.

Have you tried a dark exposure, like 30 s. exposure with lens cap on the lens, to see if you can remove the lines from a dark frame?
Run sensor check after factory reset. Does K7 have that feature?

[jllaurado]

By the way, these are the EXIF details from the Jpeg:

Filename - IMGP3592.JPG
Make - PENTAX
Model - PENTAX K-7
Orientation - Top left
XResolution - 300
YResolution - 300
ResolutionUnit - Inch
Software - K-7 Ver 1.11
DateTime - 2021:02:10 15:20:03
Artist -
YCbCrPositioning - Co-Sited
Copyright -
ExifOffset - 694
ExposureTime - 1/320 seconds
FNumber - 8.00
ExposureProgram - Manual control
ISOSpeedRatings - 100
ExifVersion - 0221
DateTimeOriginal - 2021:02:10 15:20:03
DateTimeDigitized - 2021:02:10 15:20:03
ComponentsConfiguration - YCbCr
ExposureBiasValue - 0.00
MeteringMode - Center weighted average
Flash - Flash not fired, compulsory flash mode
FocalLength - 55.00 mm
FlashPixVersion - 0100
ColorSpace - sRGB
ExifImageWidth - 4672
ExifImageHeight - 3104
InteroperabilityOffset - 54456
SensingMethod - One-chip color area sensor
FileSource - Other
SceneType - Other
CustomRendered - Normal process
ExposureMode - Manual
White Balance - Auto
FocalLengthIn35mmFilm - 82 mm
SceneCaptureType - Standard
Contrast - Normal
Saturation - Normal
Sharpness - Soft
SubjectDistanceRange - Distant view

Maker Note (Vendor): -
Mode - Auto
Date - 2021:02:10
Time - 15:20:03
Quality - Best
Focus Mode - AF-S (focus priority)
ISO - 100
White Balance - Auto
Effective LightValue - 14.4
Lens Type - smc PENTAX-DA 3.5-5.6 18-55mm AL WR

Thumbnail: -
Compression - 6 (JPG)
XResolution - 300
YResolution - 300
ResolutionUnit - Inch
JpegIFOffset - 54580
JpegIFByteCount - 7473

---------- Post added 02-12-21 at 04:17 AM ----------



---------- Post added 02-12-21 at 04:18 AM ----------

Have you tried a dark exposure, like 30 s. exposure with lens cap on the lens, to see if you can remove the lines from a dark frame?
Run sensor check after factory reset. Does K7 have that feature?

Will try that as well. Thanks

[chrism888]

The latest firmware available on the K7 is V1.13, not suggesting it'll cure your issue, but probably worth updating when you can

[Not a Number]

I would do a reset to factory defaults as well.

[35mmfilmfan]

Instead of PEF, have you thought of using DNG ? May be a conflict with your PP software.