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06-29-2021, 11:45 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by DonV Quote
Since you have the K-x, and this endeavor is "kind of " an experiment ; I'd suggest that you buy a relatively cheap lens, use it with your K-x and see what you can do.
There will be a steep learning curve - and you may decide that a better body and different lens are what is needed.
I also think this approach for the beginning. At least you will learn what lens focal length range you need, and whether you need a fast lens (large aperture and AF), or smaller aperture with wider FL, and mostly zone focussing. In the latter case differences between K-x and more modern camera will not be significant. (I used K-x, K-5, and Nikon D-700, for theatre photography and in this scenario see no difference between them.)

On the other hand if you need AF a more recent camera will presumably be much better (although I only use the Nikon D700 for AF, so cannot comment on recent Pentaxes).

06-29-2021, 12:19 PM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by brewmaster15 Quote
I used a k3 mk 1 and tamron 70-200 2.8 snd tamron 28-75 2.8 for a few years as photographer for my sons Highschool fencing team (played on basketball court. They did a great job.These can all be found used at a fair price .

I would suggest going with a 2.8 Lens.. lighting can really be challenging and it helps stop action without flash.

I would not get the DFA 150-450 for a basketball game.
Al
I'm not an expert when it comes to taking pix of fast moving, indoor sports.

But.....

X 2. Get a 70-200 lens for range and for indoor sports get an F 2.8 if you can afford it. A rule of the thumb...sort of...is the newer the camera model, the better the performance at higher ISO...as long as the cameras bodies are relatively equal when it comes to their original level...ie; can't compare entry level with expensive near pro level camera bodies.. You may need 800-1600 ISO to get less blur indoors. Any photographers that have taken fast moving indoor sports, please join in and correct me if I'm wrong.
06-29-2021, 02:50 PM   #18
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Indoor sports and outdoors sports under poor lighting you want a 70-200 f2.8. indoors I have had the kp at 1/500 2.8 and the iso 6400-12800 depending on how poor the lighting is. I primarily shoot lacrosse and have the shutter in the 1/1000 range
06-29-2021, 04:22 PM   #19
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Back in 2011, instead of my top-flight camera, the K20D, I combined my secondary lightweight body- my 12mp K-r which was the successor to the K-x, with top-flight expensive lenses to photograph a friend's college graduation. At that time, both 12mp lightweights K-r and K-x were better with higher ISO for low light use than was the K20D. Since we were seated in an upper-level exec suite which was obtained via a special contact by the friend, the distance I was shooting from was considerable. I had along my DA* 50-135mm, my FA* 300mm f/4.5 and my DA* 200mm f/2.8 lenses, which turned out to be the most used of these. The exec suite also had an outside balcony with seats. I also had my DA 18-135mm lens for family shots afterwards.

As it turned out, I only needed the higher ISO to get shots of the graduates as they came into the huge sports complex where the event took place, and as he stood in line waiting to go up onto the stage. Then my f/2.8 was indeed a factor. On the stage itself, however, the lighting was so bright I did not need all that much ISO or aperture. But I was well-prepared for every different lighting situation. The little K-r performed very well, and the family was delighted with the fine shots I presented them.

This is to say, though a more current camera model would be better, the lens will be the most important factor for action shooting in artificial lighting. The K-x still does a very decent job for higher ISO shooting, but the K-70 or certainly a KP would, however, provide yet a couple of more stops (meaning up to 4x the shutter speed at the same aperture) compared to the K-x.

06-29-2021, 05:23 PM   #20
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Thanks everyone for all of these tips!!! It's a lot for me to process because obviously, I'm a beginner. I ended up purchasing the Pentax K-5 IIs (used) on Amazon because I on second thought, I just couldn't stomach the price. I forgot to mention, I have a Pentax 50-200 lens. Hopefully, between these two, I can get some good photos! One more question. Is there something I can screw on the end of the lens (some type of filter) that might also help?
06-29-2021, 05:37 PM   #21
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It's been so long since I did basketball in a dark gym... ah, memories...

I'd use a Super Program with a manual focus 50mm f1.4 and a Takumar (bayonet) 135mm f2.5... and TMax 3200 speed film pushed to 12,800 ISO... ok, don't really do that...

I think the combo of the Tamron 70-210 f2.8 and a modern APS-C body is the winner. The K70 would be decent, the KP better (if you can find one).

As has already been pointed out, you're going to be relying on high-ISO performance and a fast lens to stop action, otherwise it's a blurry mess.

If you can get close to the basket, something like a 16-50 (the current model is often cheap used, though be aware of the common autofocus failure and how to fix it) is also a good idea.

Though the real pros put strobes in the ceiling and use radio triggers... then what you've got now would be fine

-Eric
06-29-2021, 06:05 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by ramseybuckeye Quote
buy a K-70 and DA55-300 PLM lens
+2 for this recommendation.

---------- Post added 06-29-21 at 08:13 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by katina.marathe Quote
Cheap camera/expensive lens??
This somewhat made sense in the film era because the constant across all cameras was that the film was basically the same. In the digital age there is a wide range of differences in the images captured among cameras with the different sensors and processing.

06-29-2021, 07:36 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by katina.marathe Quote
Thanks everyone for all of these tips!!! It's a lot for me to process because obviously, I'm a beginner. I ended up purchasing the Pentax K-5 IIs (used) on Amazon because I on second thought, I just couldn't stomach the price. I forgot to mention, I have a Pentax 50-200 lens. Hopefully, between these two, I can get some good photos! One more question. Is there something I can screw on the end of the lens (some type of filter) that might also help?
A very reasonable decision, great camera body - and a good place to start .

You can always "spend more $$" later. !

If one reads these posts too seriously, you would think that it was impossible to get a photo back in the "old days".
My first "good" camera was a fixed lens twin lens reflex, 75mm and F3.5, max shutter to 1/300 and 400 asa Tri-X film- somehow I managed to get action shots inside a gym.
One really had to be patient, pick/anticipate the action and its usual pause at some point then snap! Of course there were a very high % of poor photos- but somehow we managed.

With today's dslr and fast lenses and really super iso numbers- it is much easier to get an acceptable picture.

As to "finding" a KP, there are many for sale on line right now- finding is not a problem- price is not low and not likely to change much for a while either.
I like the KP a lot and compared with the price of the K3iii it is a bargain performer, JMHO. I've about talked myself into buying a spare KP body.
06-29-2021, 10:30 PM   #24
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As has been said, 1/500 shutter is necessary which means an f/2.8 lens is best. My guess is that the 50-135 would work great unless you are sitting on the top of the bleachers which would make the 70-200 better.
06-30-2021, 09:46 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by katina.marathe Quote
Thanks everyone for all of these tips!!! It's a lot for me to process because obviously, I'm a beginner. I ended up purchasing the Pentax K-5 IIs (used) on Amazon because I on second thought, I just couldn't stomach the price. I forgot to mention, I have a Pentax 50-200 lens. Hopefully, between these two, I can get some good photos! One more question. Is there something I can screw on the end of the lens (some type of filter) that might also help?
Well, the K5IIs is one of my favourite Pentax bodies.

It won't be able to drive the new KAF4 lenses such as the DA55-300PLM which is a shame (they could have solved it with a firmware update).

The SMCPentax 50-200 is not the best lens in that area, you probably got it with your K-x.
There is one lens which is very fast in both terms: f2,8 + very fast autofocus:
The legendary SMC Pentax F 2,8/135:
SMC Pentax-F 135mm F2.8 [IF] Reviews - F Prime Lenses - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database
and the FA-version:
SMC Pentax-FA 135mm F2.8 [IF] Reviews - FA Prime Lenses - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database

Both are also quite small and light for what they can!
Sometimes they show up on ebay from Japan for a reasonable price.

BigMacCam recommended the Tamron 70-200/2,8:
Tamron 70-200mm F2.8 Di LD Macro Lens Reviews - Tamron Lenses - Pentax Lens Review Database

It is for sure a fantastic lens but quite heavy. I had it for years but gave it away for the DA55-300PLM (which you can't use, as it is KAF4).


I often found that just with the F135/2,8 I travelled light and using my feet I was almost at 200mm.


A good fast tele is just expensive.

Good luck
07-02-2021, 12:54 PM   #26
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Since you already have the Kx, I suggest you carefully review the comments suggesting what will work with the Kx and go with the lens you feel will give you the best results and perhaps read some of the reviews available on this forum in the lens review section. Don't spend all you have for another camera and lens, save some that may be needed if you decide to upgrade to a different camera body. I have two Kx bodies and have found the 55-300 works fairly well with it. The 50-300 is a bit heavy and when extended rather long. I am not a sports shooter, but my Kx bodies have performed well and provided me with adequate and clear photos over several years when I have used the 18-55 kit lens and the 50-300.

Of course, the final decision is yours and I wish you the best in making that decision.
07-02-2021, 01:07 PM - 1 Like   #27
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I think people recommending the Pentax 55-300mm f/4.5-6.3 PLM have not shot action in a basketball court. That lens is too slow - maybe it would do ok with the K-3III and perhaps with the KP, but I'm not even sure of those.

With my K-50, K-3 and K-S1 (about the same high ISO performance in these 3 bodies) even my SMC-A 70-210mm f/4 struggles - I can't get high enough shutter speeds at ISO 3200 which is what I try to keep as my maximum. I find that I can get great results by bringing in primes with me: DA 35 2.8 Limited, a fast 50mm lens like the F 50 1.7, the DA 70 2.4 Limited and the SMC-M 100 2.8. I find that I never need anything longer than the 100mm to take pictures of my kids basketball games but I always get to take pictures from the court side or from the lower rolls. 100mm is close enough and all those lenses can be used wide open with great results. So I think a 70-200mm f2.8 zoom from Sigma or Tamron would be perfect for you.
07-02-2021, 03:04 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by katina.marathe Quote
Is there something I can screw on the end of the lens (some type of filter) that might also help?
Cannot think of a reason for a filter, and it may increase flare. Basically for digital useful filters can be polarizing, neutral density and graduated neutral density, none of which apply to your situation. (And clear or UV if want to protect lens from salt spray, for example; but for physically protecting lens front most of us would prefer a hood, which will also help with flare.)
07-02-2021, 07:07 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChristianRock Quote
I think people recommending the Pentax 55-300mm f/4.5-6.3 PLM have not shot action in a basketball court. That lens is too slow - maybe it would do ok with the K-3III and perhaps with the KP, but I'm not even sure of those.
You've got that right! A lens capable of f/2.8 or wider will be the best ticket to the shutter speed needed. My older non-PLM DA HD 55-300mm WR f/4-5.8 can keep to f/4-4.5 out to 200mm, so I might be able to squeak by at ISO 6400 or more with my KP (as could the K-70) to shoot indoor action without flash. And yes, a DA 50mm f/1.8 would be the least expensive option by far to get a lens with a really fast aperture, unless a good used F or FA 50mm f/1.7 can be found for less. It can provide at least twice the shutter speed of f/2.8 lenses, and at least 4 times the shutter speed of the DA 50-200mm lens when set at the same ISO under the same lighting.

---------- Post added 07-02-21 at 07:18 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by photogem Quote
Well, the K5IIs is one of my favourite Pentax bodies.
Me too. I mostly now shoot with my KP and love it, but I still love my K-5 IIs. I hope the used one already bought is one well cared for and in great shape with moderate use. It is indeed a very fine camera. And somewhat better than the K-x for higher ISO use. But the build quality and system of controls, well this camera is in a different league, even far better than the current K-70, not to mention its still fine image quality.

I agree that for now, by using your DA 50-200mm lens during a game or so, you can keep track of what settings between 50 and 200mm you use most often from your typical distance to get the shots you need. That way, you will get a good handle on the range you will need in selecting a better lens, and the type of lenses that can fulfill those needs. A setting of ISO 3200 with the K-5 IIs is pushing things a bit in terms of getting obvious noise in the shadowy areas of your shots. However, there are some post-process de-noise software available, even effective for JPEG images out of the camera, that are exceptionally good at reducing the noise while not greatly compromising the clarity your K-5 IIs is capable of delivering. But at least you'll get a feel for what you really need.

Someone mentioned the DA* 50-135mm f/2.8 which is a great lens- for many uses. And it is compact, relatively lightweight, and easy-handling for the fast-aperture, pro-style tele zoom lens it is. I've had mine for over 10 years, and it was one of those I used for the graduation shots, where I was shooting from quite a distance. Perhaps, if it turns out its range of 50-135mm is satisfactory for your needs, you could find a used one in great shape, maybe even one already converted to the standard screw-driven operation instead of its SDM motor, which has been susceptible to failure.

Last edited by mikesbike; 07-02-2021 at 07:53 PM.
07-05-2021, 05:07 PM   #30
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As many others have mentioned, the 150-450 is probably too long of a lens to be useful. If your team needs pictures of many on the court as well as individual and one-on-one shots, you'll want a modest wide-angle to medium telephoto. IMHO, a good combination would be the DA 16-85 F3.5-5.6 coupled with a KP body. The KP has an extended ISO range and is surprisingly clean until way up there, so you can manage with the slower lens. The good news is that both the lens and the body would be almost $400 less than the lens you're considering. Another nice feature on the KP is the TAV mode, where you can set both the aperture and shutter speed, and the camera varies the ISO to set the exposure. That mode would work well for basketball. If you find you need something longer, the DA* 50-135 or 60-250 would work well, or just get a used prime like a 100 2.8 macro or 135 2.8. I recommend borrowing a camera or lens with a wide-angle to telephoto zoom to see what focal lengths you'll need before you buy, as you're looking at a good chunk of $$. I have the KP, the 16-85, and the 60-250 and love them. Both lenses are razor sharp with great Bokeh.

Good luck, keep us posted.
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