Firmware upgrade changes AF fine adjustments and different testing method.

**BarryE** · 01-03-2022, 09:14 AM

Some will know this, but others may not.

I've just updated my two K-1 bodies from v1.40 to v1.55. As a consequence most AF fine adjustments were changed with this update ***. I've not seen a firmware update do this before. With two bodies and various lenses, this was a pain.

Anyway, it did give me a time to reflect on my AF testing. Some lenses have just become manual focus only, so no point in testing them. I have a couple of pairs SMC and HD versions. As the fine adjustment settings can only hold one adjustment setting for either the SMC or HD version, I had to choose what one was going to take priority and check the other to make sure it was not widely different - they weren't. So my testing combinations were reducing to more manageable numbers.

I then considered the testing setup. Why test in the usual way, when I don't use each lens the same way. ie my 77mm lenses are typically used for portrait at around 1 to 2m, whereas other lenses are mostly focussing at many metres. So I constructed the following. I also chose what part of a zoom range I preferred and weighted my testing accordingly.

I abandoned the try it three times at the same position method and moved the lens around on the tripod, focussing on the target at more representative distance. I took several shots at each AF setting at a wide aperture, with remote and mirror locked. It was quick and it felt much more like a real photo activity. The resulting files were revealing and more consistent than I've previously experienced calibrating with traditional setups. The firmware upgraded settings were different from my original settings and very close to my new ones, except *and this is key for me* for those lenses I predominately use for portraits and focus at 1 to 3 metres. These I had to adjust from the firmware reset figures by several 'units' (ie from +2 to -4). This set-up allowed my to move a much longer distance than previous calibration arrangements allowed and seeing my tests fall in line with the new firmware set figures was reassuring.

Time will tell whether this modified testing approach will be better. Spot testing with the 77 and 43, both of which I changed significantly negatively from the new firmware set numbers, seem to be working fine. Fingers crossed ...

*** The updated firmware adjusted from a range of 0 to +3. Some did not change, but some had jumped by 3 (all were increases). I wonder what would have happened if my camera/lens combinations had been nearer 10 ...?

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**UncleVanya** · 01-03-2022, 10:10 AM

So the number assigned in the camera was actually changed? I’ve heard of firmware updates changing what adjustment was needed but not the actual recorded number. Interesting.

**BarryE** · 01-03-2022, 10:30 AM

Originally posted by UncleVanya

So the number assigned in the camera was actually changed? I’ve heard of firmware updates changing what adjustment was needed but not the actual recorded number. Interesting.

Yes, many were changed.

DFA 24-70
FA 31
FA 50 macro
FA 77
FA 100 macro

biz-engineer · 01-03-2022, 11:06 AM

Strange, I haven't noticed any change to my AF fine adjustment values after updating to firmware 1.55

pschlute · 01-03-2022, 11:11 AM

Are you testing under consistent light ?

**BarryE** · 01-03-2022, 11:12 AM

Originally posted by biz-engineer

Strange, I haven't noticed any change to my AF fine adjustment values after updating to firmware 1.55

Out of interest, from what version did you update from? I went from v1.40.

---------- Post added 01-03-22 at 06:14 PM ----------

Originally posted by pschlute

Are you testing under consistent light ?

Yes consistent, Hampshire light of the last few weeks, ie heavy cloud :-(

biz-engineer · 01-03-2022, 11:17 AM

Originally posted by BarryE

Out of interest, from what version did you update from? I went from v1.40.

I don't remember what was the previous version. I have only a few lenses with correction, and I just verified that the AF fine adjustment values haven't changed with 1.55 . I had +2 for the 24-70, before 1.55 and it is still +2 now after firmware update. I haven't checked if adjust values are still working because last time I took > 40 measurements for each lens for selecting the best correction values, it's a lot of work.

**BarryE** · 01-03-2022, 11:46 AM

Originally posted by biz-engineer

I don't remember what was the previous version. I have only a few lenses with correction, and I just verified that the AF fine adjustment values haven't changed with 1.55 . I had +2 for the 24-70, before 1.55 and it is still +2 now after firmware update. I haven't checked if adjust values are still working because last time I took > 40 measurements for each lens for selecting the best correction values, it's a lot of work.

Thanks. Yes, it is a lot of work, however, my modified approach has reduced the burden greatly as my measurements are now more consistent. I concentrated on those few lenses that I needed for critical focussing, letting the more general usage and highly variable lenses (yes you, 24-70), assume more approx values.

After seeing a few of the settings had been changed during the update I was a little irritated, by this exercise has been beneficial overall, as I feel my new testing methodology reflects better how I want to use each lens. I always suspected that an AF adjustment made on a lens when it was close (ish) focussing would not necessarily be the same if that lens was tested at a much longer distance. This non-linearity concern seems to have been borne out.

The update changes were the severest on the 24-70 at +3 (on one K-1, +1 on the other).

**UncleVanya** · 01-03-2022, 12:33 PM

Know I’m confused again. Were the values in the camera changed merely by updating firmware (this is what I thought you were indicating) or was the test performed after firmware was applied and you got new different results? If the latter was the same method ever used with the old firmware?

**BarryE** · 01-03-2022, 01:10 PM

Originally posted by UncleVanya

Know I’m confused again. Were the values in the camera changed merely by updating firmware (this is what I thought you were indicating) or was the test performed after firmware was applied and you got new different results? If the latter was the same method ever used with the old firmware?

Yes the updating of the firmware changed the values stored in the camera. I then retested and found my results were different from my early measurements. Sorry if I couldn't make this clear.

**UncleVanya** · 01-03-2022, 01:29 PM

Originally posted by BarryE

Yes the updating of the firmware changed the values stored in the camera. I then retested and found my results were different from my early measurements. Sorry if I couldn't make this clear.

Honestly I thought that’s what you were saying. It’s the first time I have ever heard that. Very interesting.

**BarryE** · 01-03-2022, 02:11 PM

Originally posted by UncleVanya

Honestly I thought that’s what you were saying. It’s the first time I have ever heard that. Very interesting.

I've just updated the firmware on a K-3, nervously. No changes to camera's stored settings. I've updated firmware numerous times and never experienced the camera's settings changed.

Guess if others surface with similar observations then maybe there's been, at some stage, a small tweak to the focussing algorithms, that may have required a change to the camera's saved settings. Or maybe I've had a major aberration or three. I've been using this database for years so it's unlikely, but I suppose not impossible, I made a mistake.

(As background: all my settings for both K-1s were originally between 0 and +2 before I updated the firmware. They were all, after the update and the changes to the camera's settings, (before I retested) between 0 and 3 - some went up, some went down, a little. After I retested, using the new method, they now range from -2 to 3.)

**UncleVanya** · 01-03-2022, 02:15 PM

Originally posted by BarryE

I've just updated the firmware on a K-3, nervously. No changes to camera's stored settings. I've updated firmware numerous times and never experienced the camera's settings changed.

Guess if others surface with similar observations then maybe there's been, at some stage, a small tweak to the focussing algorithms, that may have required a change to the camera's saved settings. Or maybe I've had a major aberration or three. I've been using this database for years so it's unlikely, but I suppose not impossible, I made a mistake.

(As background: all my settings for both K-1s were originally between 0 and +2 before I updated the firmware. They were all, after the update and the changes to the camera's settings, (before I retested) between 0 and 3 - some went up, some went down, a little. After I retested, using the new method, they now range from -2 to 3.)

A few firmware updates mentioned focusing and even specifically the fa limited lenses. I imagine those updates might have this impact? It’s all very interesting.

biz-engineer · 01-03-2022, 02:31 PM

Sometimes we change somethings and we forget, that happens to me once in a while , especially as I'm getting older

**BarryE** · 01-03-2022, 02:44 PM

Originally posted by biz-engineer

Sometimes we change somethings and we forget, that happens to me once in a while , especially as I'm getting older

Yes, but there were several changes. Still not beyond the bounds of possibilities, I suppose.

All of my FA Limiteds had their camera settings altered (I didn't include the 43 in my initial list). So what UncleVanya posted about the FA focussing changes in the firmware, may be relevant. (Also, the 50 went up 1 and the 100 down 1)

01-03-2022, 10:30 AM	#3
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,653 Original Poster	Originally posted by UncleVanya So the number assigned in the camera was actually changed? I’ve heard of firmware updates changing what adjustment was needed but not the actual recorded number. Interesting. Yes, many were changed. DFA 24-70 FA 31 FA 50 macro FA 77 FA 100 macro Last edited by BarryE; 01-03-2022 at 10:37 AM.

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01-03-2022, 10:10 AM	#2
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,401	So the number assigned in the camera was actually changed? I’ve heard of firmware updates changing what adjustment was needed but not the actual recorded number. Interesting.

01-03-2022, 11:06 AM	#4
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,231	Strange, I haven't noticed any change to my AF fine adjustment values after updating to firmware 1.55

01-03-2022, 11:11 AM	#5
pschlute Moderator Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Surrey, UK Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,198	Are you testing under consistent light ?

01-03-2022, 11:12 AM	#6
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,653 Original Poster	Originally posted by biz-engineer Strange, I haven't noticed any change to my AF fine adjustment values after updating to firmware 1.55 Out of interest, from what version did you update from? I went from v1.40. ---------- Post added 01-03-22 at 06:14 PM ---------- Originally posted by pschlute Are you testing under consistent light ? Yes consistent, Hampshire light of the last few weeks, ie heavy cloud :-(

01-03-2022, 11:17 AM	#7
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,231	Originally posted by BarryE Out of interest, from what version did you update from? I went from v1.40. I don't remember what was the previous version. I have only a few lenses with correction, and I just verified that the AF fine adjustment values haven't changed with 1.55 . I had +2 for the 24-70, before 1.55 and it is still +2 now after firmware update. I haven't checked if adjust values are still working because last time I took > 40 measurements for each lens for selecting the best correction values, it's a lot of work.

01-03-2022, 11:46 AM	#8
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,653 Original Poster	Originally posted by biz-engineer I don't remember what was the previous version. I have only a few lenses with correction, and I just verified that the AF fine adjustment values haven't changed with 1.55 . I had +2 for the 24-70, before 1.55 and it is still +2 now after firmware update. I haven't checked if adjust values are still working because last time I took > 40 measurements for each lens for selecting the best correction values, it's a lot of work. Thanks. Yes, it is a lot of work, however, my modified approach has reduced the burden greatly as my measurements are now more consistent. I concentrated on those few lenses that I needed for critical focussing, letting the more general usage and highly variable lenses (yes you, 24-70), assume more approx values. After seeing a few of the settings had been changed during the update I was a little irritated, by this exercise has been beneficial overall, as I feel my new testing methodology reflects better how I want to use each lens. I always suspected that an AF adjustment made on a lens when it was close (ish) focussing would not necessarily be the same if that lens was tested at a much longer distance. This non-linearity concern seems to have been borne out. The update changes were the severest on the 24-70 at +3 (on one K-1, +1 on the other).

01-03-2022, 12:33 PM	#9
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,401	Know I’m confused again. Were the values in the camera changed merely by updating firmware (this is what I thought you were indicating) or was the test performed after firmware was applied and you got new different results? If the latter was the same method ever used with the old firmware?

01-03-2022, 01:10 PM	#10
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,653 Original Poster	Originally posted by UncleVanya Know I’m confused again. Were the values in the camera changed merely by updating firmware (this is what I thought you were indicating) or was the test performed after firmware was applied and you got new different results? If the latter was the same method ever used with the old firmware? Yes the updating of the firmware changed the values stored in the camera. I then retested and found my results were different from my early measurements. Sorry if I couldn't make this clear.

01-03-2022, 01:29 PM	#11
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,401	Originally posted by BarryE Yes the updating of the firmware changed the values stored in the camera. I then retested and found my results were different from my early measurements. Sorry if I couldn't make this clear. Honestly I thought that’s what you were saying. It’s the first time I have ever heard that. Very interesting.

01-03-2022, 02:11 PM	#12
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,653 Original Poster	Originally posted by UncleVanya Honestly I thought that’s what you were saying. It’s the first time I have ever heard that. Very interesting. I've just updated the firmware on a K-3, nervously. No changes to camera's stored settings. I've updated firmware numerous times and never experienced the camera's settings changed. Guess if others surface with similar observations then maybe there's been, at some stage, a small tweak to the focussing algorithms, that may have required a change to the camera's saved settings. Or maybe I've had a major aberration or three. I've been using this database for years so it's unlikely, but I suppose not impossible, I made a mistake. (As background: all my settings for both K-1s were originally between 0 and +2 before I updated the firmware. They were all, after the update and the changes to the camera's settings, (before I retested) between 0 and 3 - some went up, some went down, a little. After I retested, using the new method, they now range from -2 to 3.)

01-03-2022, 02:15 PM	#13
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,401	Originally posted by BarryE I've just updated the firmware on a K-3, nervously. No changes to camera's stored settings. I've updated firmware numerous times and never experienced the camera's settings changed. Guess if others surface with similar observations then maybe there's been, at some stage, a small tweak to the focussing algorithms, that may have required a change to the camera's saved settings. Or maybe I've had a major aberration or three. I've been using this database for years so it's unlikely, but I suppose not impossible, I made a mistake. (As background: all my settings for both K-1s were originally between 0 and +2 before I updated the firmware. They were all, after the update and the changes to the camera's settings, (before I retested) between 0 and 3 - some went up, some went down, a little. After I retested, using the new method, they now range from -2 to 3.) A few firmware updates mentioned focusing and even specifically the fa limited lenses. I imagine those updates might have this impact? It’s all very interesting.

01-03-2022, 02:31 PM	#14
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,231	Sometimes we change somethings and we forget, that happens to me once in a while , especially as I'm getting older

01-03-2022, 02:44 PM	#15
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,653 Original Poster	Originally posted by biz-engineer Sometimes we change somethings and we forget, that happens to me once in a while , especially as I'm getting older Yes, but there were several changes. Still not beyond the bounds of possibilities, I suppose. All of my FA Limiteds had their camera settings altered (I didn't include the 43 in my initial list). So what UncleVanya posted about the FA focussing changes in the firmware, may be relevant. (Also, the 50 went up 1 and the 100 down 1)