Lines like blinds???

Jefe · 01-22-2023, 04:36 PM - **1 Like**

I'm getting alternating light and dark lines (resembling horizontal blinds) in my B&W photos. Using a K-1 and problem occurs with multiple lenses. Anyone know what is causing this?

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photoptimist · 01-22-2023, 04:51 PM - **3 Likes**

It can be caused by using the electronic shutter with many kinds of artificial lighting.

**Digitalis** · 01-22-2023, 05:15 PM - **6 Likes**

Solid state LED lighting strikes again. Typically you need to use a longer shutter speeds (1/60th or slower) to diminish the flutter from PWM driven lights.

**luftfluss** · 01-22-2023, 05:24 PM - **1 Like**

The manual of my most recent (non-Pentax) camera purchase warns of this effect when using the electronic shutter.

**AstroDave** · 01-22-2023, 06:25 PM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by photoptimist

It can be caused by using the electronic shutter with many kinds of artificial lighting.

That's almost surely it.

Originally posted by Digitalis

Solid state LED lighting strikes again. Typically you need to use a longer shutter speeds (1/60th or slower) to diminish the flutter from PWM driven lights.

For proper exposure yes. You show 1/250 sec - if this was mechanical shutter, you would be lucky to get anything - the LED lights may turn almost completely off and on at 60 or 50 Hz, depending on where you live. At such speeds, you have about a 50-50 chance of shooting when the lights are "on'!

I'd go even slower - 1/30 sec or less. Why ISO 2000? If you are trying to stop action (doesn't look particularly relevant here), you are in trouble either way - ES is no good (people move during the exposure), and as noted, the lights are going on and off.

Wheatfield · 01-22-2023, 06:32 PM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by AstroDave

That's almost surely it.

For proper exposure yes. You show 1/250 sec - if this was mechanical shutter, you would be lucky to get anything - the LED lights may turn almost completely off and on at 60 or 50 Hz, depending on where you live. At such speeds, you have about a 50-50 chance of shooting when the lights are "on'!

I'd go even slower - 1/30 sec or less. Why ISO 2000? If you are trying to stop action (doesn't look particularly relevant here), you are in trouble either way - ES is no good (people move during the exposure), and as noted, the lights are going on and off.

It happens with the mechanical shutter or electronic shutter if the speed is set too fast. Both LED and florescent lighting will manifest thusly if the shutter speed is above the flicker rate.

**Digitalis** · 01-22-2023, 06:43 PM - **3 Likes**

Originally posted by luftfluss

The manual of my most recent (non-Pentax) camera purchase warns of this effect when using the electronic shutter.

Using electronic shutters with any LED light* sources is generally ill advised. Unfortunately some cameras only have an electronic first curtains, so those people are going to have a fun time mitigating this effect. Some sensors with electronic shutters have slower readout speeds and this can again cause issues with image quality. Mechanical shutters are the way to go for good IQ under mixed lighting.

* Then again a dodgy ballast on a HMI light can cause issues too.

Last edited by Digitalis; 01-22-2023 at 06:49 PM.

Jefe · 01-23-2023, 06:39 PM

Thanks to all for helping me out here!

01-22-2023, 05:15 PM - 6 Likes	#3
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	Solid state LED lighting strikes again. Typically you need to use a longer shutter speeds (1/60th or slower) to diminish the flutter from PWM driven lights. Last edited by Digitalis; 01-22-2023 at 05:46 PM.

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01-22-2023, 04:51 PM - 3 Likes	#2
photoptimist Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2016 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,122	It can be caused by using the electronic shutter with many kinds of artificial lighting.

01-22-2023, 05:24 PM - 1 Like	#4
luftfluss Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: NJ Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,619	The manual of my most recent (non-Pentax) camera purchase warns of this effect when using the electronic shutter.

01-22-2023, 06:25 PM - 2 Likes	#5
AstroDave Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: May 2007 Location: Flagstaff, Arizona Posts: 1,637	Originally posted by photoptimist It can be caused by using the electronic shutter with many kinds of artificial lighting. That's almost surely it. Originally posted by Digitalis Solid state LED lighting strikes again. Typically you need to use a longer shutter speeds (1/60th or slower) to diminish the flutter from PWM driven lights. For proper exposure yes. You show 1/250 sec - if this was mechanical shutter, you would be lucky to get anything - the LED lights may turn almost completely off and on at 60 or 50 Hz, depending on where you live. At such speeds, you have about a 50-50 chance of shooting when the lights are "on'! I'd go even slower - 1/30 sec or less. Why ISO 2000? If you are trying to stop action (doesn't look particularly relevant here), you are in trouble either way - ES is no good (people move during the exposure), and as noted, the lights are going on and off.

01-22-2023, 06:32 PM - 2 Likes	#6
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Originally posted by AstroDave That's almost surely it. For proper exposure yes. You show 1/250 sec - if this was mechanical shutter, you would be lucky to get anything - the LED lights may turn almost completely off and on at 60 or 50 Hz, depending on where you live. At such speeds, you have about a 50-50 chance of shooting when the lights are "on'! I'd go even slower - 1/30 sec or less. Why ISO 2000? If you are trying to stop action (doesn't look particularly relevant here), you are in trouble either way - ES is no good (people move during the exposure), and as noted, the lights are going on and off. It happens with the mechanical shutter or electronic shutter if the speed is set too fast. Both LED and florescent lighting will manifest thusly if the shutter speed is above the flicker rate.

01-22-2023, 06:43 PM - 3 Likes	#7
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	Originally posted by luftfluss The manual of my most recent (non-Pentax) camera purchase warns of this effect when using the electronic shutter. Using electronic shutters with any LED light* sources is generally ill advised. Unfortunately some cameras only have an electronic first curtains, so those people are going to have a fun time mitigating this effect. Some sensors with electronic shutters have slower readout speeds and this can again cause issues with image quality. Mechanical shutters are the way to go for good IQ under mixed lighting. * Then again a dodgy ballast on a HMI light can cause issues too. Last edited by Digitalis; 01-22-2023 at 06:49 PM.

01-23-2023, 06:39 PM	#8
Jefe New Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Ohio Posts: 6 Original Poster	Thanks to all for helping me out here!

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