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08-18-2009, 03:37 AM   #31
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I remember the frustration before digital of the "60 second" disappointment(Polaroid) or getting your prints from the photo shop and out of 36 maybe one was "reasonable". Now, with digital it doesn"t happen any more "cos I can do something about it !!!! Oh yes,,, Love my K20d and my Imac G4. Windows???? Never again...

08-18-2009, 05:04 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pentax pete Quote
No I am still here, no drive by!!
Glad to hear it.
08-18-2009, 06:33 AM   #33
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Pentax pete, you could use the Quote button when replying to posts, so readers would know who you are replying to.
08-18-2009, 06:36 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pentax pete Quote
how do you reduce the file size in order to upload??
You have to resize (and possible apply more JPEG comression) using some software. A free one called Irfanview (on Windows systems) is one worth having.

08-18-2009, 06:40 AM   #35
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that mac fight was weak. mono, what lab do you use?
08-18-2009, 08:20 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by seacapt Quote
I agree with Edward Weston that true creativity only happens the instant the shutter is released and everything else is simply mechanics.
I'd venture to surmise that he might not have felt the same way if he'd had today's software options available to him at the time.
08-18-2009, 12:02 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by seacapt Quote
I agree with Edward Weston that true creativity only happens the instant the shutter is released and everything else is simply mechanics.
So he put no thought into lighting or viewpoint or lens selection or film selection or any other other they myriad decisions you have to make before you get to the point of hitting the shutter button??? Somehow I think he gave serious thought to all of these questions, even if he considered them "mechanics."

Did he not then pay meticulous attention to the development of his negatives and the processing of his prints? Of course he did, again, even if he considered these aspects mere "mechanics."

The release of the shutter may be the central act and cusp of the photographer's creativity, but the rest of the factors are necessary to achieve "the photograph."

Mike
08-18-2009, 08:27 PM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by MRRiley Quote
The release of the shutter may be the central act and cusp of the photographer's creativity, but the rest of the factors are necessary to achieve "the photograph."

Mike
This was actually the point that I was trying to make with regards to to OP's statements. The best thing about Photoshop is that it puts control of the post processing "mechanics" back in the hands of the photographer , rather than the lab who processes and prints your film.
That being said, you have to admit that the truely great pictures don't need much if any post processing they are just "RIGHT" as they were shot.


Last edited by seacapt; 08-18-2009 at 09:01 PM.
08-18-2009, 08:33 PM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pentax pete Quote
Hi I'm new to the forum, and my question is:

What is it photography? Is it a lame attempt to get a shot and then try and fix it with photoshop, or get a good shot the first time and then not have the need to fix it.

I first started shooting film, back about 16 years ago, and strived to work hard at it. I was afraid to get into digital, because of not knowing what was real and what was not. It takes a real photographer to get the shot the first time and not have to photoshop it later down the line.
OK Pete here's my take on this for whatever it's worth. I agree with Edward Weston that true creativity only happens the instant the shutter is released and everything else is simply mechanics. The thing is ,we rely on those mechanics (Processes) to bring our creativity to the table. Back in the day I used to shoot sports in b/w and did my own darkroom work. Almost all of that work had at least some crop and was therefore post processed. The good part was that I as the photographer had the control in the lab. Now with a digital SLR and Photshop or other software I once again have control of the post processing of my work.
Photo Shop is just a tool it can't make a lousey photographer an artist or a bad picture a masterpiece but it does allow each of us the abillity to bring our work to the table "our way"

Last edited by seacapt; 08-18-2009 at 08:41 PM.
06-08-2010, 09:19 PM   #40
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photography is small world

small because, the world is seen thru a lens......
06-08-2010, 10:16 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pentax pete Quote
What is it photography? Is it a lame attempt to get a shot and then try and fix it with photoshop, or get a good shot the first time and then not have the need to fix it.
That's a false dichotomy.

Capturing an image and processing that image are not mutually exclusive.

They are both intrinsically part of the same process - creating a final image.

The only question is the relative importance the photographer puts on one or the other - a matter of subjective choice. In other words, what is the final purpose the photographer has in mind for the image?

There is no right or wrong only choices.

Last edited by wildman; 06-08-2010 at 10:22 PM.
06-09-2010, 06:42 AM   #42
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Say what you like, I won't slam you either way, but my personal preference is to do as little post processing possible. Same as I did with 35mm. Usually I do some cropping and if possible that's it. with my P&S Samsung I often had to push the contrast and color saturation because it consistently turned out shots that were washed out, even though otherwise they looked great as far as composition, lighting/shadows etc. Those that were average or mediocre shots just got passed by. Ditto now with the K-x I just got, I get a small few really good shots, most are average and some out of focus but I don't have to tinker with contrast and saturation, it usually comes out pretty good. If you look at the photos I've posted so far, cropping is the only PP used.

That's simply a matter of personal preference and I suppose a certain amount of pride in my work. I'm not trying to make an average shot great, I'm looking for the ones that come out great rigth out of the camers, same as with 35mm.

With 35mm I usually had my developing done at Wally World or similar, and one good thing was consistency. It was done by machine, same way every time, no extra time in the chemicals or retouching. pretty much WYSIWYG...I had one excellent shot cropped for a vertical 8x10 and a small scratch on the negative (dropped it looking for the right frame, scratched it in the process) so I had that touched up. that's teh only touchup I ever had done. Either it was a good shot right out of the cannister or it was not. I don't deride anyone who likes post processing, that's their business. After all, art before the camera could be accomplished by oil paints, watercolor, charcoal, pencil, pen and ink, wood cutting...and I'm sure some oil painters thought wood cutters were not actually "artists".

Say what you will, minimal processing is my preference, my way of doing things. I use Irfan View, it's small, fast and has limited editing capability but usually it has all I need. I also have Gimp and a couple of other editing programs on Windows and Linux, but 99% of the time it's Irfan View that my mouse heads for. Simplicity...

Same as my guitar playing. I spent 20 years practicing and developing my technique, learning to play as fast as I can. Onstage, I almost never play fast, I go for simple and melodic. I can play fast if I need to, but usually don't. The ability to play fast just means my fingers can more easily hit the notes I want, smooth and precise, without having to hunt for the next note. Why play 87 notes in 6 seconds, if none of them actually makes a statement, when 6 or 8 notes will purvey just the feel I want for the song. BB King can say more with 3 notes than most guitar players can in 10 minutes...

That's what I go for, and I see photography the same way. Get a good shot to begin with and post processing is minimal. If you see it differently, fine, go fot it. Sometimes Rembrant painted 3 or 4 layers or more before he got what he was looking for. I guess he was post processing too...
06-09-2010, 02:24 PM   #43
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What is photography? Literally, "writing/drawing with light". Some would replace 'light' with any energy that can be represented visually. (We've chewed over this in the past, here.) The definition does not require film, lens, camera, anything -- render an image, that's it. If I aim a laser pointer at a sheet of photo paper in a blackout room and sketch a pattern, then develop the paper, I have produced a photograph.

What is photography, to any individual? That depends on the individual. I about grew up in my (semi-pro) dad's darkroom. As a bike messenger in San Francisco, I couriered film and slides and prints between studios, agencies, labs, printers, etc. In the US Army, I worked as a photographer. Since then, I've shot for my own pleasure.

And what I learned, formally and informally, is: Do whatever it takes to produce the image. "Whatever it takes" may be limited by guidelines imposed externally or internally. Advertisers, journalists, surveillors, scientists, decorators, contestants, all have quite different rules re: equipment, resolution, process, etc. My basic guideline is: avoid being hurt or killed. Anything else goes.

Yes, I often attempt to compose and capture perfect pictures. I also just throw a camera into the air and see what it snaps randomly. Sometimes I'll shoot under crappy conditions, and spend a lot of time in PP. That's how it goes. The image I produce might be a good representation of what was shot, or it might be a rad distortion -- but I've produced it, it's better than the perfect picture that I didn't get. If the process involves xeroxing, collaging, slicing-and-dicing, so be it. I don't enter don't-shoop contests; I'm not doing photogrammetry; I can be as precise or as sloppy as I want. And it's all photography.
06-09-2010, 03:44 PM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pentax pete Quote
Okay, go and find them!!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/pentaxpete/


That was easy...

woof!
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