Low Light Photography

Iann Cannon · 10-21-2009, 04:21 PM

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Originally posted by newarts

I have a number of m42 lenses, each of which has a 3rd party no flange (~$15) adapter mounted.

This has worked quite well for me. I remove the adapter's spring & just leave the adapter on the lens. Some drill an indent into the lens base for the camera's locking pin to engage.

Dave in Iowa

Ahhh, so with the adapter permanently on the lens, this makes switching from a m42 lens to a normal k mount lens the same as if both were k mounts.. Hmm, only thing is I have to buy an adapter for each lens..

newarts · 10-21-2009, 06:12 PM

Originally posted by Iann Cannon

Ahhh, so with the adapter permanently on the lens, this makes switching from a m42 lens to a normal k mount lens the same as if both were k mounts.. Hmm, only thing is I have to buy an adapter for each lens..

They can be had for under $15 delivered last I looked.

In some ways the adapted m42 is better than a K lens. The K lens default is to have the aperture open at composition time, which means you've got to push a button to force the lens to stop down so metering can be done. (A trick to avoid this problem with a K lens is to not mount it completely - then the lever holding it open won't be activated... Some have drilled an extra indent in the lens base so the locking pin will secure the lens.)

With an M42, no such nonsense, as you can manually stop the lens down with the aperture ring. Combined with tricking the camera into thinking it is an A lens makes metering "automatic" in the sense that you just compose the photo & shoot.

Iann Cannon · 10-21-2009, 06:16 PM

Originally posted by newarts

They can be had for under $15 delivered last I looked.

In some ways the adapted m42 is better than a K lens. The K lens default is to have the aperture open at composition time, which means you've got to push a button to force the lens to stop down so metering can be done. (A trick to avoid this problem with a K lens is to not mount it completely - then the lever holding it open won't be activated... Some have drilled an extra indent in the lens base so the locking pin will secure the lens.)

With an M42, no such nonsense, as you can manually stop the lens down with the aperture ring. Combined with tricking the camera into thinking it is an A lens makes metering "automatic" in the sense that you just compose the photo & shoot.

How do you trick the camera into thinking it's an A lens? As for the $15 delivered adapters, are these the same that people complain about? The ones that mess with the focus or something because it's too thick.

Marc Sabatella · 10-21-2009, 07:44 PM

Originally posted by newarts

With an M42, no such nonsense, as you can manually stop the lens down with the aperture ring.

True, but the downside is that the viewfinder dims as a result. So if you want to shoot stopped down, you either live with much harder focusing, or else you manually turn the aperture ring every time you want to refocus. I don't see that as easier than hitting the Green button, particularly given that in many cases, light doesn't change all that often, so I can Green button once and make a lot of different shots on that same exposure. I tend to finesse the shutter speed as I move from light to shadow without bother to Green button again; really, the exact same produce I use with my DA lenses. I'd find the M42 procedure a *lot* more work.

newarts · 10-22-2009, 04:35 AM

Originally posted by Marc Sabatella

True, but the downside is that the viewfinder dims as a result. So if you want to shoot stopped down, you either live with much harder focusing, or else you manually turn the aperture ring every time you want to refocus. I don't see that as easier than hitting the Green button, particularly given that in many cases, light doesn't change all that often, so I can Green button once and make a lot of different shots on that same exposure. I tend to finesse the shutter speed as I move from light to shadow without bother to Green button again; really, the exact same produce I use with my DA lenses. I'd find the M42 procedure a *lot* more work.

You are arguably right on both counts...Button or preset is mostly a toss-up I think....neither is a *lot* more work...I probably push the preset method because I've got quite a few preset-only lenses (m42's, modified nikons, etc...)

Focusing with a stopped down lens is harder, especially when using a split prism.

The way split prism focusing (and phase detect focusing) works relies on off-axis rays, and when the lens is stopped down the off-axis rays go away (and half the prism goes black). That's why such focusing is f-stop limited more than it is brightness limited.

I think most of us don't pay enough attention to your technique of just setting the exposure and tweaking it as lighting varies. Lighting doesn't vary much in most venues - the wide swings in exposure we often see are due to our metering systems seeing a white shirt here, or maybe a black shirt there & overcompensating.

I recall you pointing out that the lighting at a basketball game doesn't change from minute to minute and one is best to shoot for the average lighting - that will result in consistent exposures.

Dave in Iowa

PS in addition to all the above, in practice I find that I only use the fast primes wide open (or close to it) so the method really doesn't matter much. If the scene only needs a modest f-stop, I'll typically use an auto lens.

newarts · 10-22-2009, 04:43 AM

Originally posted by Iann Cannon

How do you trick the camera into thinking it's an A lens? As for the $15 delivered adapters, are these the same that people complain about? The ones that mess with the focus or something because it's too thick.

Short out the A pin on the camera and the camera thinks all lenses are A type (see my earlier post.)

The $15 adapters come in both "flange-type" - no infinity focus, and "flangeless" - no problem.

Third party flangeless adapters are essentially identical to genuine Pentax adapters (the major difference I've seen involves the sharpness of the fillets on the adapter's "ears" - easy to adjust if desired - I don't bother usually.)

Dave in Iowa

Here's a $10 delivered version on eBay that's probably ok.
http://cgi.ebay.com/M42-Lens-to-Pentax-PK-K100D-K200D-K10D-K20D-Adapter_W0QQ...item1c0d2f588c

chedoy · 10-22-2009, 10:06 AM

Originally posted by newarts

Third party flangeless adapters are essentially identical to genuine Pentax adapters (the major difference I've seen involves the sharpness of the fillets on the adapter's "ears" - easy to adjust if desired - I don't bother usually.)

I have two third party adapters. One would get horribly stuck on my K100D. Grinding off the high spots with a Dremel tool (on the adapter of course) made it better. I ground the second one too.

If the Pentax adapters go in and come out like butter, it would be worth the money. Never had one. The inexpensive ones come with a removal tool and you have to understand the simple trick on how to use it, which involves compressing the retainer spring/clip to allow the adapter to turn.

bdery · 10-22-2009, 11:51 AM

Originally posted by Blue

bdery,

I'll bet you the f1.2 is better at f1.2 or f1.4 than the f1.7 is.

It probably is, but based on my humble experience, I never felt comfortable using the F1,4 wide open. So I never used it. I fact, I never used the f1,4 wider than f2... and never used the f2 wider than f2,8.

I feel 100% confortable using the f1,7 wide open. So for me it's the perfect balance...

(the f1,2s out there are also a tad more expensive than the other 50s...)

10-22-2009, 04:43 AM	#36
newarts Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Ames, Iowa, USA Photos: Albums Posts: 2,965	Originally posted by Iann Cannon How do you trick the camera into thinking it's an A lens? As for the $15 delivered adapters, are these the same that people complain about? The ones that mess with the focus or something because it's too thick. Short out the A pin on the camera and the camera thinks all lenses are A type (see my earlier post.) The $15 adapters come in both "flange-type" - no infinity focus, and "flangeless" - no problem. Third party flangeless adapters are essentially identical to genuine Pentax adapters (the major difference I've seen involves the sharpness of the fillets on the adapter's "ears" - easy to adjust if desired - I don't bother usually.) Dave in Iowa Here's a $10 delivered version on eBay that's probably ok. http://cgi.ebay.com/M42-Lens-to-Pentax-PK-K100D-K200D-K10D-K20D-Adapter_W0QQ...item1c0d2f588c Last edited by newarts; 10-22-2009 at 04:49 AM.

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10-21-2009, 04:21 PM	#31
Iann Cannon New Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Bronx, NY Posts: 11 Original Poster	Staff note: This post may contain affiliate links, which means Pentax Forums may earn a small commission if a visitor clicks through and makes a purchase. If you would like to support the forum directly, you may also make a donation here. Originally posted by newarts I have a number of m42 lenses, each of which has a 3rd party no flange (~$15) adapter mounted. This has worked quite well for me. I remove the adapter's spring & just leave the adapter on the lens. Some drill an indent into the lens base for the camera's locking pin to engage. Dave in Iowa Ahhh, so with the adapter permanently on the lens, this makes switching from a m42 lens to a normal k mount lens the same as if both were k mounts.. Hmm, only thing is I have to buy an adapter for each lens..

10-21-2009, 06:12 PM	#32
newarts Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Ames, Iowa, USA Photos: Albums Posts: 2,965	Originally posted by Iann Cannon Ahhh, so with the adapter permanently on the lens, this makes switching from a m42 lens to a normal k mount lens the same as if both were k mounts.. Hmm, only thing is I have to buy an adapter for each lens.. They can be had for under $15 delivered last I looked. In some ways the adapted m42 is better than a K lens. The K lens default is to have the aperture open at composition time, which means you've got to push a button to force the lens to stop down so metering can be done. (A trick to avoid this problem with a K lens is to not mount it completely - then the lever holding it open won't be activated... Some have drilled an extra indent in the lens base so the locking pin will secure the lens.) With an M42, no such nonsense, as you can manually stop the lens down with the aperture ring. Combined with tricking the camera into thinking it is an A lens makes metering "automatic" in the sense that you just compose the photo & shoot.

10-21-2009, 06:16 PM	#33
Iann Cannon New Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Bronx, NY Posts: 11 Original Poster	Originally posted by newarts They can be had for under $15 delivered last I looked. In some ways the adapted m42 is better than a K lens. The K lens default is to have the aperture open at composition time, which means you've got to push a button to force the lens to stop down so metering can be done. (A trick to avoid this problem with a K lens is to not mount it completely - then the lever holding it open won't be activated... Some have drilled an extra indent in the lens base so the locking pin will secure the lens.) With an M42, no such nonsense, as you can manually stop the lens down with the aperture ring. Combined with tricking the camera into thinking it is an A lens makes metering "automatic" in the sense that you just compose the photo & shoot. How do you trick the camera into thinking it's an A lens? As for the $15 delivered adapters, are these the same that people complain about? The ones that mess with the focus or something because it's too thick.

10-21-2009, 07:44 PM	#34
Marc Sabatella Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Denver, CO Photos: Gallery Posts: 10,685	Originally posted by newarts With an M42, no such nonsense, as you can manually stop the lens down with the aperture ring. True, but the downside is that the viewfinder dims as a result. So if you want to shoot stopped down, you either live with much harder focusing, or else you manually turn the aperture ring every time you want to refocus. I don't see that as easier than hitting the Green button, particularly given that in many cases, light doesn't change all that often, so I can Green button once and make a lot of different shots on that same exposure. I tend to finesse the shutter speed as I move from light to shadow without bother to Green button again; really, the exact same produce I use with my DA lenses. I'd find the M42 procedure a lot more work.

10-22-2009, 04:35 AM	#35
newarts Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Ames, Iowa, USA Photos: Albums Posts: 2,965	Originally posted by Marc Sabatella True, but the downside is that the viewfinder dims as a result. So if you want to shoot stopped down, you either live with much harder focusing, or else you manually turn the aperture ring every time you want to refocus. I don't see that as easier than hitting the Green button, particularly given that in many cases, light doesn't change all that often, so I can Green button once and make a lot of different shots on that same exposure. I tend to finesse the shutter speed as I move from light to shadow without bother to Green button again; really, the exact same produce I use with my DA lenses. I'd find the M42 procedure a lot more work. You are arguably right on both counts...Button or preset is mostly a toss-up I think....neither is a lot more work...I probably push the preset method because I've got quite a few preset-only lenses (m42's, modified nikons, etc...) Focusing with a stopped down lens is harder, especially when using a split prism. The way split prism focusing (and phase detect focusing) works relies on off-axis rays, and when the lens is stopped down the off-axis rays go away (and half the prism goes black). That's why such focusing is f-stop limited more than it is brightness limited. I think most of us don't pay enough attention to your technique of just setting the exposure and tweaking it as lighting varies. Lighting doesn't vary much in most venues - the wide swings in exposure we often see are due to our metering systems seeing a white shirt here, or maybe a black shirt there & overcompensating. I recall you pointing out that the lighting at a basketball game doesn't change from minute to minute and one is best to shoot for the average lighting - that will result in consistent exposures. Dave in Iowa PS in addition to all the above, in practice I find that I only use the fast primes wide open (or close to it) so the method really doesn't matter much. If the scene only needs a modest f-stop, I'll typically use an auto lens.

10-22-2009, 10:06 AM	#37
chedoy Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 143	Originally posted by newarts Third party flangeless adapters are essentially identical to genuine Pentax adapters (the major difference I've seen involves the sharpness of the fillets on the adapter's "ears" - easy to adjust if desired - I don't bother usually.) I have two third party adapters. One would get horribly stuck on my K100D. Grinding off the high spots with a Dremel tool (on the adapter of course) made it better. I ground the second one too. If the Pentax adapters go in and come out like butter, it would be worth the money. Never had one. The inexpensive ones come with a removal tool and you have to understand the simple trick on how to use it, which involves compressing the retainer spring/clip to allow the adapter to turn.

10-22-2009, 11:51 AM	#38
bdery Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Quebec city, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,357	Originally posted by Blue bdery, I'll bet you the f1.2 is better at f1.2 or f1.4 than the f1.7 is. It probably is, but based on my humble experience, I never felt comfortable using the F1,4 wide open. So I never used it. I fact, I never used the f1,4 wider than f2... and never used the f2 wider than f2,8. I feel 100% confortable using the f1,7 wide open. So for me it's the perfect balance... (the f1,2s out there are also a tad more expensive than the other 50s...)