possible enloop warning?

slow2focus · 12-26-2009, 08:53 AM

Hi all,

Just relate my experience with usage of enloop/rechargeable in general. I had my loops for almost 2+ years now. It is from costco with AA/AAA/C/D shell charger combo pack. It was a good deal and I read many good things about it for a long while. I wasn't doing many high voltage stuff other than occasional P&S camera usage. the loops mostly went to remote controls wireless keyboard/mouse type of stuff.

Well, in getting the k-x, I ran around the house to gather up my loops. I got my first 4 and I was happy. Did the charge thing with la crosse bc9009, everything checks out.

This past week, I did some cleaning and found another set of loops in my remote controller that hasn't been used for a long time. The remote still works too. I took them out and did a refresh with the la crosse. One cell won't charge! It is below the .5v cut off of the charger.

I had a dumb charger which I used to bring the "dead" loop back to above .5v and use la crosse to charge it. It will only hold 800 mah. I did a refresh and took 3 days to come to 1700 mah.

my point is... this is not the first time I had this happen to me. I have always just chuck up to my buying "cheap" rechargeable. Loops are not considered cheap. But, I know devices varies in current draw. I always save batteries from higher volt device for remotes since they work with out fail for a long time. Remotes and such are very very low current draw in my present experience, can kill your rechargeable with out your knowing the battery is way below where it likes to be.

I am not sure if the loops is savable or not. Since I don't have devices that takes a single AA, I may have to waste the other as a pair for stuff around the house.

YMMV

your experience welcome

Peter Zack · 12-26-2009, 09:03 AM

IMO the warning is not the battery but the use of them. They need use, maybe not on a regular basis but they need use. Eneloops are well known for holding a charge for a long time but any battery needs to have drain/charge cycles to stay "fresh" the cells will degrade over time without it. Plus rechargables have a finite lifespan. Also unlike the old NiCad's, they do not like to be completely (100%) discharged. It's hard on the cells.

I've got no idea how long these were in the remote but it's possible a few things could have happened. Self discharge beyound the point they were designed. Or the remote could have had some buttons depressed where it was stored and the LED or circuit discharged the battery's too low etc.

So the point is, use them until the device says the batteries are drained and then cycle them to a full charge. Leaving them unused for very long periods will damage the cells over time.

wlachan · 12-26-2009, 11:38 AM

If I remember correctly, AA/AAA NiMH is considered empty at 0.9v and should not discharge futher. Draining them too much then they are beyond rechargable.

slow2focus · 12-26-2009, 12:18 PM

You miss understood me. While I understand your point regarding that the battery has to be "used" on a regular basis, my point is, that when using rechargables on low draw device, it will (in my case) go below the .9v threshold. The remotes and such will happily draw till when it consider the battery is dead not the other way around. When I say the remote still works, I ment, prior to removing the batteries, the remote still function with the loops in them. The loops should last according to literture 1000 cycles. Given I havn't charge them for more than what... onces? This is not the first time it has happen to me. Like I said, I have never put 2 n 2 together.

I will not use them in low draw devices anymore. Not that they won't work. Just takes brain power to remember to charge them before they are dead.

Thanks for reading.

Igilligan · 12-26-2009, 01:14 PM

I have two young kids with uncountable toys - 3 cameras - three flashes - 6 remotes -- and a bucket full of flashlights that all use AA batteries or AA bats with the C & D adaptors... (Christmas just brought three more high draw games and toys)

I long ago decided to label my eneeloops when I buy them, in sets with date and an initial of what I am putting them in. C - F - T - R - M for misc

I do my best to keep them in the sets and or pairs in the devices. It is the only way to maintain some sort of control that will keep a wounded battery out of my camera or flash!!!

So when I hear people going on and on about only wanting a camera with AA batts I just laugh!

It is so much easier / cheaper / brainless to have a dedicated batt like my K20 does. Two cheap $7 dollar back ups and I am set.

Having a real high draw camera like the Kx shooting video or live view and risking getting a 'wounded' cell... is just too big of a risk.

12-26-2009, 08:53 AM	#1
slow2focus Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 82	possible enloop warning? Hi all, Just relate my experience with usage of enloop/rechargeable in general. I had my loops for almost 2+ years now. It is from costco with AA/AAA/C/D shell charger combo pack. It was a good deal and I read many good things about it for a long while. I wasn't doing many high voltage stuff other than occasional P&S camera usage. the loops mostly went to remote controls wireless keyboard/mouse type of stuff. Well, in getting the k-x, I ran around the house to gather up my loops. I got my first 4 and I was happy. Did the charge thing with la crosse bc9009, everything checks out. This past week, I did some cleaning and found another set of loops in my remote controller that hasn't been used for a long time. The remote still works too. I took them out and did a refresh with the la crosse. One cell won't charge! It is below the .5v cut off of the charger. I had a dumb charger which I used to bring the "dead" loop back to above .5v and use la crosse to charge it. It will only hold 800 mah. I did a refresh and took 3 days to come to 1700 mah. my point is... this is not the first time I had this happen to me. I have always just chuck up to my buying "cheap" rechargeable. Loops are not considered cheap. But, I know devices varies in current draw. I always save batteries from higher volt device for remotes since they work with out fail for a long time. Remotes and such are very very low current draw in my present experience, can kill your rechargeable with out your knowing the battery is way below where it likes to be. I am not sure if the loops is savable or not. Since I don't have devices that takes a single AA, I may have to waste the other as a pair for stuff around the house. YMMV your experience welcome

12-26-2009, 01:14 PM	#5
Igilligan Guest	Oh the recharable battery- my answer I have two young kids with uncountable toys - 3 cameras - three flashes - 6 remotes -- and a bucket full of flashlights that all use AA batteries or AA bats with the C & D adaptors... (Christmas just brought three more high draw games and toys) I long ago decided to label my eneeloops when I buy them, in sets with date and an initial of what I am putting them in. C - F - T - R - M for misc I do my best to keep them in the sets and or pairs in the devices. It is the only way to maintain some sort of control that will keep a wounded battery out of my camera or flash!!! So when I hear people going on and on about only wanting a camera with AA batts I just laugh! It is so much easier / cheaper / brainless to have a dedicated batt like my K20 does. Two cheap $7 dollar back ups and I am set. Having a real high draw camera like the Kx shooting video or live view and risking getting a 'wounded' cell... is just too big of a risk.

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12-26-2009, 09:03 AM	#2
Peter Zack Pentaxian Moderator Emeritus Join Date: May 2007 Location: Edmonton Alberta, Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 10,643	IMO the warning is not the battery but the use of them. They need use, maybe not on a regular basis but they need use. Eneloops are well known for holding a charge for a long time but any battery needs to have drain/charge cycles to stay "fresh" the cells will degrade over time without it. Plus rechargables have a finite lifespan. Also unlike the old NiCad's, they do not like to be completely (100%) discharged. It's hard on the cells. I've got no idea how long these were in the remote but it's possible a few things could have happened. Self discharge beyound the point they were designed. Or the remote could have had some buttons depressed where it was stored and the LED or circuit discharged the battery's too low etc. So the point is, use them until the device says the batteries are drained and then cycle them to a full charge. Leaving them unused for very long periods will damage the cells over time.

12-26-2009, 11:38 AM	#3
wlachan Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Canada Photos: Albums Posts: 2,625	If I remember correctly, AA/AAA NiMH is considered empty at 0.9v and should not discharge futher. Draining them too much then they are beyond rechargable.

12-26-2009, 12:18 PM	#4
slow2focus Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 82 Original Poster	You miss understood me. While I understand your point regarding that the battery has to be "used" on a regular basis, my point is, that when using rechargables on low draw device, it will (in my case) go below the .9v threshold. The remotes and such will happily draw till when it consider the battery is dead not the other way around. When I say the remote still works, I ment, prior to removing the batteries, the remote still function with the loops in them. The loops should last according to literture 1000 cycles. Given I havn't charge them for more than what... onces? This is not the first time it has happen to me. Like I said, I have never put 2 n 2 together. I will not use them in low draw devices anymore. Not that they won't work. Just takes brain power to remember to charge them before they are dead. Thanks for reading.