K-x image similar to Point&Shoot

noel · 05-22-2010, 05:16 AM

Recently shot some photos in bright daylight, outdoors, and at closer look, the 100% crop is quite smudgy and lost most of the details. Yes it was shot in JPG 3stars but i don't think it should be that bad. Does anyone else have the same prob?

Setup:
K-x, 18-55mm L, ISO 200, f/7.1, 1/250

I've shot K100D, K10D, K20D but this is quite bad compared to them.

Actual Photo:

100% Crop: Notice the dark colours (noise??) , the subjects' hair is all smudgy.

matam · 05-22-2010, 05:38 AM

wich was the FL of the picture?
If it was @55mm then my 18-55 bheaves in a similar way, the long end isn't sharp when pixel peeping for my taste at every aperture and i try to avoid it.
Also you're looking at the border of the image, and the kit lens isn't a stellar performer in that regard (at least my copy).

noel · 05-22-2010, 05:46 AM

Hi Matam, thanks for responding.
Yes FL was 55mm. But this happened to all the photos even at the centers. I didn't post the centres coz they were family shots.

I'm actually more concerned abt the rendering of the darks , see the dark-coloured shirts of the subjects. Very very noisy. I didn't really expect that from the acclaimed sensor.

amoringello · 05-22-2010, 05:56 AM

Havent had a chance to use my 18-55 much yet, but other alternative possibilities...

Lets say the ship was about 200ft away and your lens was at 50mm. (sort of looks that way from the photo), the near focus limit would be around 45ft. Part of the blurriness may simply be due to your focus point being in the distance.

I'd be more interested to see what the railings on the ship look like since that is more in line with where the camera may have been focusing. (unless you specifically focused on the people before recomposing... in which case ignore what I just said, and the photo is pretty bad).

Did you have any noise reduction on? Dunno how that works at higher shutter speeds and low ISO (does the Kx turn it off?), but it looks like noise reduction artifacts as well.

Since you're shooting jpg, you might want to check the contrast and sharpness settings. If they got turned way down, maybe an issue?? Although this really doesn't look like its caused by those settings.

noel · 05-22-2010, 06:10 AM

Here's 2 more crops from different sections of the photo.

Below: Notice the loss of details especially on the collar of the man facing us.

JohnBee · 05-22-2010, 06:17 AM

Something definitately not right with those...

matam · 05-22-2010, 06:34 AM

sorry was my monitor setting and i couldn't see a single trace of noise in the shirt, to me was almost all black.
Now i've retuned my display and i must say that's not right at all and there's a lot of chroma noise too, i see purple and green noise on those central crop.
Do you have shadow correction eneabled?

noel · 05-22-2010, 06:38 AM

Everything off

No correction, plain vanilla. Curve set to "Natural" in the camera.

Ira · 05-22-2010, 07:21 AM

Did you wait to see the shake reduction hand icon appear before fully depressing the shutter? Very important. It's not active before you see that icon, and can make things worse.

Also, have you done much serious photography in the past? And I ask for a simple reason, not to be condescending:

95% of casual shutters have the bad habit of bringing the camera down and away from their eye as they simultaneously click the shutter. It's almost an instinctive thing that everyone does, but you have to be aware of it with each and every shot.

Hold the camera steady before, during, and for a second AFTER you depress the shutter.

Marc Sabatella · 05-22-2010, 08:24 AM

I am having trouble seeing the problem. You're posting crops from areas that are clearly not in the focus zone, and they are underexposed to boot, because they are so much darker than other areas of the picture that are properly exposed.. Of course those areas are going to lack detail - that's going to be the case with *any* camera. Things are only going to show maximum detail when in focus and when exposed well. Asking the camera to produce less-than-best-quality JPEG's isn't helping, either.

Alfisti · 05-22-2010, 08:57 AM

This is easy, it's underexposed by almost a stop.

ROT with Pentax cameras, +0.5 Ev is where you start.

Ira · 05-22-2010, 09:18 AM

Originally posted by Alfisti

This is easy, it's underexposed by almost a stop.

ROT with Pentax cameras, +0.5 Ev is where you start.

What does ROT mean?

I'm terrible with acronyms.

audiobomber · 05-22-2010, 09:39 AM

Note too that the Natural image tone is meant for further processing. Natural defaults to -1 in sharpness, as opposed to Bright which is +1, two stops higher. And yes, the photo is definitely underexposed.

Ira, ROT stands for Rule of Thumb. I disagree with Alfisti about the K-x needing +.5 Ev all the time, but I would definitely have pushed the exposure one stop with these dark subjects and bright sky.

philbaum · 05-22-2010, 10:50 AM

I searched my photos for a 200 ISO examples, and found one that had noise like this, checked more and it was from the K10 where i had drawn detail out of shadow areas by a lot of fill light, and some exposure bump, etc. Taking my image back to import in LR, all the noise disappeared. yep, post processing did this.

Was this a jpeg or RAW. RAW will leave you with more detail.

Ecaterin · 05-22-2010, 11:49 AM

Going back and looking at my photos with the K-x kit lens, I have to say the lens plays a big role in your photos as well. The camera settings (exposure, SR, shutter speed) definitely needed more attention, but even at really optimum settings my k-x + kit lens didn't do much better. There's a reason we all upgrade

You can get really lovely shots out of the kit lens if you use it at its sweet spot and know your camera well, but it's not a lens that forgives much

05-22-2010, 05:16 AM	#1
noel Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Singapore Posts: 89	K-x image similar to Point&Shoot Recently shot some photos in bright daylight, outdoors, and at closer look, the 100% crop is quite smudgy and lost most of the details. Yes it was shot in JPG 3stars but i don't think it should be that bad. Does anyone else have the same prob? Setup: K-x, 18-55mm L, ISO 200, f/7.1, 1/250 I've shot K100D, K10D, K20D but this is quite bad compared to them. Actual Photo: 100% Crop: Notice the dark colours (noise??) , the subjects' hair is all smudgy.

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05-22-2010, 05:38 AM	#2
matam Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Berlin Posts: 112	wich was the FL of the picture? If it was @55mm then my 18-55 bheaves in a similar way, the long end isn't sharp when pixel peeping for my taste at every aperture and i try to avoid it. Also you're looking at the border of the image, and the kit lens isn't a stellar performer in that regard (at least my copy).

05-22-2010, 05:46 AM	#3
noel Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Singapore Posts: 89 Original Poster	Hi Matam, thanks for responding. Yes FL was 55mm. But this happened to all the photos even at the centers. I didn't post the centres coz they were family shots. I'm actually more concerned abt the rendering of the darks , see the dark-coloured shirts of the subjects. Very very noisy. I didn't really expect that from the acclaimed sensor.

05-22-2010, 05:56 AM	#4
amoringello Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Virginia, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,562	Havent had a chance to use my 18-55 much yet, but other alternative possibilities... Lets say the ship was about 200ft away and your lens was at 50mm. (sort of looks that way from the photo), the near focus limit would be around 45ft. Part of the blurriness may simply be due to your focus point being in the distance. I'd be more interested to see what the railings on the ship look like since that is more in line with where the camera may have been focusing. (unless you specifically focused on the people before recomposing... in which case ignore what I just said, and the photo is pretty bad). Did you have any noise reduction on? Dunno how that works at higher shutter speeds and low ISO (does the Kx turn it off?), but it looks like noise reduction artifacts as well. Since you're shooting jpg, you might want to check the contrast and sharpness settings. If they got turned way down, maybe an issue?? Although this really doesn't look like its caused by those settings.

05-22-2010, 06:10 AM	#5
noel Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Singapore Posts: 89 Original Poster	Here's 2 more crops from different sections of the photo. Below: Notice the loss of details especially on the collar of the man facing us.

05-22-2010, 06:17 AM	#6
JohnBee Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Newrfoundland Photos: Albums Posts: 4,667	Something definitately not right with those...

05-22-2010, 06:34 AM	#7
matam Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Berlin Posts: 112	sorry was my monitor setting and i couldn't see a single trace of noise in the shirt, to me was almost all black. Now i've retuned my display and i must say that's not right at all and there's a lot of chroma noise too, i see purple and green noise on those central crop. Do you have shadow correction eneabled?

05-22-2010, 06:38 AM	#8
noel Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Singapore Posts: 89 Original Poster	Everything off No correction, plain vanilla. Curve set to "Natural" in the camera.

05-22-2010, 07:21 AM	#9
Ira Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Coral Springs, FL Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,216	Did you wait to see the shake reduction hand icon appear before fully depressing the shutter? Very important. It's not active before you see that icon, and can make things worse. Also, have you done much serious photography in the past? And I ask for a simple reason, not to be condescending: 95% of casual shutters have the bad habit of bringing the camera down and away from their eye as they simultaneously click the shutter. It's almost an instinctive thing that everyone does, but you have to be aware of it with each and every shot. Hold the camera steady before, during, and for a second AFTER you depress the shutter.

05-22-2010, 08:24 AM	#10
Marc Sabatella Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Denver, CO Photos: Gallery Posts: 10,685	I am having trouble seeing the problem. You're posting crops from areas that are clearly not in the focus zone, and they are underexposed to boot, because they are so much darker than other areas of the picture that are properly exposed.. Of course those areas are going to lack detail - that's going to be the case with any camera. Things are only going to show maximum detail when in focus and when exposed well. Asking the camera to produce less-than-best-quality JPEG's isn't helping, either.

05-22-2010, 08:57 AM	#11
Alfisti Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Toronto (for now) Posts: 1,748	This is easy, it's underexposed by almost a stop. ROT with Pentax cameras, +0.5 Ev is where you start.

05-22-2010, 09:18 AM	#12
Ira Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Coral Springs, FL Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,216	Originally posted by Alfisti This is easy, it's underexposed by almost a stop. ROT with Pentax cameras, +0.5 Ev is where you start. What does ROT mean? I'm terrible with acronyms.

05-22-2010, 09:39 AM	#13
audiobomber Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Sudbury, Ontario Photos: Albums Posts: 6,806	Note too that the Natural image tone is meant for further processing. Natural defaults to -1 in sharpness, as opposed to Bright which is +1, two stops higher. And yes, the photo is definitely underexposed. Ira, ROT stands for Rule of Thumb. I disagree with Alfisti about the K-x needing +.5 Ev all the time, but I would definitely have pushed the exposure one stop with these dark subjects and bright sky.

05-22-2010, 10:50 AM	#14
philbaum Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Port Townsend, Washington State, USA Posts: 3,659	I searched my photos for a 200 ISO examples, and found one that had noise like this, checked more and it was from the K10 where i had drawn detail out of shadow areas by a lot of fill light, and some exposure bump, etc. Taking my image back to import in LR, all the noise disappeared. yep, post processing did this. Was this a jpeg or RAW. RAW will leave you with more detail.

05-22-2010, 11:49 AM	#15
Ecaterin Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Seattle Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 723	Going back and looking at my photos with the K-x kit lens, I have to say the lens plays a big role in your photos as well. The camera settings (exposure, SR, shutter speed) definitely needed more attention, but even at really optimum settings my k-x + kit lens didn't do much better. There's a reason we all upgrade You can get really lovely shots out of the kit lens if you use it at its sweet spot and know your camera well, but it's not a lens that forgives much