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08-09-2007, 04:15 AM   #61
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Hello all (hey, first real post ),

I tend to agree with dkreithen above, improving the middle-to-high end segment will be a substantial plus to Pentax.
I think Pentax will not release a replacement for K10D, it would bring nothing new. What I do think is that they probably will aim a bit higher and release a "one-figure" model (like the 1 series from Canon). Not necessarily full-frame, but 1.3 crop. More fps, more accurate AF, the whole thing.
But then again, they might as well release branded leather shoulder straps

08-09-2007, 07:00 AM   #62
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We should just wait a few weeks and we'll know it all. Pentax has a big press event scheduled late August, no? Don't remember the exact date, but I'm sure we'll know all about it before September. This event looks like a first on this scale from Pentax in the digital era, so we're bound to see some announcements, that's been clear for a while now... Don't see what good stirring up the anticipation can do, except from a marketing hype creation point of view?

I expect news on various fronts, but since the consumer level lens front seems to be the most lacking in Pentax's current setup (incl the road map) that's where I expect some of the new stuff to be situated. I'm no customer for that gear, but I expect it will be important for Pentax as a brand.

I don't see them introducing new long teles onto the road map, but I would rather hear some concrete dates for the ones on the road map.

Something I would like to see is an extension to the flash system to add a ring flash or a controller flash (like the AF200FG, but with wireless controller capacity).

For the rest it's a public secret that I'm dreaming about TCs and a DA16/4, but I don't expect those anytime soon...

I'm going to try and make it to the Paris salon de photos if some of the goods are good enough to motivate me to buy a Thalys ticket and hop onto the train to Paris to get a closer look... Perhaps I'll meet Ben in the flesh.

Wim
08-09-2007, 07:49 AM   #63
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Does this have anything to do with the 645D? With an upgradeable 18MP sensor up to 30MP? Cause this is what I'm waiting for, though never in hell will I be able to afford it when it comes out! hahaha...
08-09-2007, 08:47 AM   #64
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I really dont think any new bodies will be announced this year unless its one of the following:
k10d super or k10d mkII > k10d with very small changes, same sensor.
k200d > k100d super with 10mpix sensor from k10d, nothing else new
645d

basically nothing really new. Altho we would like to see the k1d, i dont think it will arrive so soon, it will take a lot of time to make one and as far as i understood they had not really started creating one when the k10d was finished. also this would rely on a new sensor being available to the market, the next sensor we know is imminent is the near-FF sony and we know pentax wont make a body with that one, at least not anytime soon.

new lenses? sure new lenses might arrive in shops this year, but it wont be any that we dont already know about from the roadmap.

I think it would be more fun if it was something else, some pentax accsessories, they dont have eanough. like teleconverters, ringflash, extension tubes -whatever.

08-09-2007, 09:14 AM   #65
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QuoteOriginally posted by leadbelly Quote
Does this have anything to do with the 645D? With an upgradeable 18MP sensor up to 30MP? Cause this is what I'm waiting for, though never in hell will I be able to afford it when it comes out! hahaha...
Maybe the surprise is that you WILL be able to afford the 645D. It would be in keeping with the Pentax tradition to bring out a camera that's long on imaging power and short on price.
08-09-2007, 09:38 AM   #66
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QuoteOriginally posted by TaoMaas Quote
Maybe the surprise is that you WILL be able to afford the 645D. It would be in keeping with the Pentax tradition to bring out a camera that's long on imaging power and short on price.
no way, that 645 is gonna cost a fortune, the price that pentax has to pay kodak for the sensor is gonna assure that. actually its a crop right? 1.3x... are the available mf digital backs also crops? I dont think so. i guess that means its gonna be cheaper than those......

I dont think kodak ever made a really good sensor tho did they..... their sensors are so noisy too. I was shocked when i heard some of those huuuuge sensor mf backs dont even go beyond iso 400.
08-09-2007, 09:40 AM   #67
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QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
I really doubt that if you took an image with a 5D and a K10D and put them in a magazine you could tell the difference except for color tonality perhaps.

Ben
You are 100% right! Downloaded the test JEPGs from DP Review for the Canon D5 and K10D, and sharpen them the exact same amount in Photoshop CS3. Afterwards, printed them in Lightroom 1.1 on a Epson 2400 printer. Could not tell the difference in sharpness. The print from the K10D was a little more saturated than the Canon D5 print.
08-09-2007, 10:59 AM   #68
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I dont think kodak ever made a really good sensor tho did they.....



Huh? Kodak makes some of the best sensors in the business. "Low noise" is not everything, you know. Perhaps what you are missing is that very little photography for which someone would purchase an expensive medium format back would be done at ISO 800 and above (there is not much medium format film that was/is faster than ISO400, Ilford Delta 3200 is the only B&W or color one I can think of, and it is ISO 1000 or so, really). Instead, one would invest in good lighting equipment and/or fast prime lenses. Kodak full-frame CCDs (a type of CCD, not full-frame as in the size of the sensor) have some of the best dynamic ranges out there, not to mention color bit depth, etc. Most of the medium format digital back manufacturers who use Kodak sensors claim 12-14 stops of dynamic range, which is pretty astounding. I think if I needed one of these I would put the camera on a tripod and shoot at the lowest ISO possible, for maximum quality.

08-09-2007, 01:17 PM   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
Look..All of the Pro shoots I have done since January of 2007 have been with the K10D. There will be new gear coming out in the future, that you know will be the case. Now if you feel that your gear is not up to scratch, that is your issue. However, the fact that my stuff is coming out very well in print in magazine support as well as billboards is enough to satisfy my criteria. I really doubt that if you took an image with a 5D and a K10D and put them in a magazine you could tell the difference except for color tonality perhaps.

Ben
EXACTLY! I am realizing my gear IS up to scratch. Once one approaches a certain level of camera so that their gear is no longer limiting what they can do for the style they are shooting, it is less about the gear itself and more about the results.

It takes talented people like yourself to continually remind us that results speak for themselves.

I never said I was that bright, and I am slowly-but-surely realizing that it would be dumb to covet a camera I hate and give up one I love, just to realize some internal belief that it costs more so it MUST be a better camera.

When our advertising campaign hits the market, not one single person in the world will be able to tell which was shot with the 5D and which was shot with the K10D. And our clients certainly don't care either. They pay for the results they need.

Now that I got that off my chest, I am going to sell off one or two istD bodies and get another K10D. All this talk of cameras has gotten my addiction stirred up again!
08-09-2007, 03:55 PM   #70
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Sorry

QuoteOriginally posted by Chickenhawk Quote
EXACTLY! I am realizing my gear IS up to scratch. Once one approaches a certain level of camera so that their gear is no longer limiting what they can do for the style they are shooting, it is less about the gear itself and more about the results.

It takes talented people like yourself to continually remind us that results speak for themselves.

I never said I was that bright, and I am slowly-but-surely realizing that it would be dumb to covet a camera I hate and give up one I love, just to realize some internal belief that it costs more so it MUST be a better camera.

When our advertising campaign hits the market, not one single person in the world will be able to tell which was shot with the 5D and which was shot with the K10D. And our clients certainly don't care either. They pay for the results they need.

Now that I got that off my chest, I am going to sell off one or two istD bodies and get another K10D. All this talk of cameras has gotten my addiction stirred up again!
Sorry..Didn't comment to have you go out and buy another camera. None the less, enjoy!

Ben
08-09-2007, 04:20 PM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by TaoMaas Quote
Maybe the surprise is that you WILL be able to afford the 645D. It would be in keeping with the Pentax tradition to bring out a camera that's long on imaging power and short on price.
I hope that's the surprise! The posters of the 645D in Pentax stores here are making me drool, and at the same time making me wonder how much it'll cost considering the old film 645 is still way out of my league!
08-10-2007, 07:39 AM   #72
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FOV 1.5 crop here to stay?

QuoteOriginally posted by JollyRoger Quote
... What I do think is that they probably will aim a bit higher and release a "one-figure" model (like the 1 series from Canon). Not necessarily full-frame, but 1.3 crop...
It strikes me that the FOV 1.5 crop is here to stay, based on some of the Pentax interviews I have read here in the forums, and based on the Pentax Lens Development Roadmap. Does anyone know if the new DA* lenses (16-50mm and 50-135mm) support a 1.3 crop? If not, then I doubt Pentax is going to come out with another DSLR with a different FOV crop.

We are all excited by Ben's teaser. What makes more sense is the release of a new 645, but even more likely is the release of the DA* 200mm F2.8 and DA* 300mm F4. Afterall, the Roadmap says targeted availability of Sept 2007.

Last edited by WaterDog; 08-10-2007 at 07:49 AM. Reason: fixed typos
08-10-2007, 08:03 AM   #73
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QuoteOriginally posted by WaterDog Quote
What makes more sense is the release of a new 645...
Has Pentax ever abandoned people who own Pentax lenses? I'm thinking there's too many 645 and 6X7 lenses floating around out there for Pentax to ignore that market for long. All that's needed is a suitable digital body that can make use of those lenses.
08-10-2007, 02:28 PM   #74
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QuoteOriginally posted by TaoMaas Quote
Has Pentax ever abandoned people who own Pentax lenses? I'm thinking there's too many 645 and 6X7 lenses floating around out there for Pentax to ignore that market for long. All that's needed is a suitable digital body that can make use of those lenses.
Well, I for one still have two 645 bodies and a bunch of lenses sitting in my darkroom somewhere. (Actually, in retrospect, I think I used them about the last time I used the darkroom ... which is quite a few years ago, I might add. Some of you young 'uns can google what a 'darkroom' is.)
08-10-2007, 09:38 PM   #75
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QuoteOriginally posted by and Quote
I really dont think any new bodies will be announced this year unless its one of the following:
k10d super or k10d mkII > k10d with very small changes, same sensor.

That would be a stupid, ignorant move. Obviously they know the K10D has a few issues, especially lacking chroma NR & sharpness type menu choices for those who need jpg files in time constrained emergencies and can't post process.

Introducing a K10D Super with the same sensor, but with improvements within the same year would only make sense if current K10D owners get those improvements in a firmware update. Abandoning current owners in favor of making note of all customer difficulties, denying everything, and having a wealth of software based improvements in the new same-level/same-sensor model would be unacceptable.

Solving high-iso mid-shadow VPN, and HPN in a K10D Super, while dismissing customer complaints saying it was user error in current regular K10D cameras is lack of customer respect.

Those only shooting RAW, and those with photography styles not affected by VPN, or have cameras built with better quality control where all is aligned to have minimal VPN, or grip induced HPN are fortunate, and should hold on to what they have and enjoy it.

But if all these "non-issues" miraculously disappear in a K10D Super, then say what you want - internally Pentax acknowledged these things and took them seriously enough to fix them - therefore NOT non-issues.

Far more profit in selling new improved K10D Supers than satisfying current owners that noticed what needed improving and weren't happy with defects in their results.

At least the K100D Super was put out due to neccessity, and a later decision to make SDM lenses. Stopping regular K100D production, and adding this control to K100D Super lets Pentax sell more SDM lenses. It wasn't a hardware defect fix, or firmware added functionality done without offering it to regular K100D owners. It was a logical business decision to sell more of the new lenses.

A model above the K10D makes far more sense. Current K10D owners should be given new firmware with added functionality, and menu options stemming from improved algorithms.

Larry
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