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03-24-2014, 07:36 PM   #2731
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QuoteOriginally posted by chimpwithagun Quote
I've seen ads for jobs asking for specific cameras, no one ever lists Pentax as a possibility. It's all marketing, we should all write blogs about our Pentax gear, make youtube videos, etc. Let's bring Pentax into the public eye.
I think Pentax marketing has been hoping users would do that to make their jobs easier >_<

03-24-2014, 08:00 PM   #2732
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Well, it seems that Ricoh has a history with cameras (see below) that could predicate a genuine resurgence of Pentax as a "brand name". Why would they, though? Ricoh already has a name of it's own. I'm always suspicious of mergers and buyouts because most of them have to do with acquiring patents that can be applied to products unrelated to the company being bought out. Not to be a wet blanket but, who cares about Pentax beyond it's rather small user base? Did Hoya? Does Ricoh? I don't hold out much hope that Pentax will ever be nurtured and returned to it's former glory as a camera company. Despite it's early history Ricoh is an "imaging company" now and cameras are an afterthought.

In addition, we live in an era where people aren't used to having the number of choices once available in the past. They are used to a limited number of cable companies, cell & land line phone companies, ISPs, etc. They don't want more than Canon and Nikon because it would require an effort to make a choice beyond a simple few. The future of photography is very Huxleyan.
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03-24-2014, 09:25 PM   #2733
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QuoteOriginally posted by MD Optofonik Quote
In addition, we live in an era where people aren't used to having the number of choices once available in the past. They are used to a limited number of cable companies, cell & land line phone companies, ISPs, etc. They don't want more than Canon and Nikon because it would require an effort to make a choice beyond a simple few. The future of photography is very Huxleyan.

Boy did you hit the nail on the head right there! It's already happening with cell phones, boiling the choices down to Samsung and Apple.
03-24-2014, 10:05 PM - 1 Like   #2734
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@Alizarine: I think Pentax barely has a marketing department.

@MD Optofonik: Ricoh did state that they want Pentax for the camera business. They want to be a big player, even if it is just a hobby for them right now. I do think they want to build the brand, but that takes some time. They are improving distribution channels already, Pentax is doing quite a bit in Malaysia to promote and build the brand (within limited resources), and so on. Also, I'm not sure I can agree. The lack of choice in ISPs etc. is rather unfortunate, people do want choice, but regulations aren't in favor of choice. But look at music, movies, TV shows... people watch different things. Wear different things. Individualism is a big thing in some communities. That everyone uses Samsung or Apple is thanks to marketing. Samsung phones are crap. I have a Galaxy Nexus, which at least gets me around the awful Samsung software, but the hardware is nowhere near as robust as my previous HTC. My next phone will probably be either a HTC (if they can get their act together...) or Chinese, since the Chinese are now better in build quality than Samsung, they have better software (or use stock Android), ... I think (some) Chinese companies can and will make a big dent to Samsung's bottom line in the phone market. Mostly Lenovo (owning Motorola and being huge in the PC market), Xiaomi (having an ex-VP from Google work on their international expansion plans), Oppo, Huawei, Meizu and a few others who focus on building a good reputation through very high quality phones.

The problem I see is that they seem to be focusing on the hobbyist market for the most part, apart from medium format. And medium format is mostly studio only, so there is limited exposure to the general population.

@chimpwithagun: Hasselblad users have nothing to fear. a) they use it as a work tool, so I guess they couldn't care less, b) their cameras are massive and look really serious and c) they can always ask for the price tag of whoever clueless is making jokes and then laugh at the cheap toy and tell them how much their Hasselblad has cost...
Fuji owners IMHO fall under a few categories: People who want to go stealth, i.e. street photography. Something that doesn't draw much attention, so they'll be fine with not looking "pro". People enjoying photography itself, also I don't think they could care less. And hipsters who are happy when no one has ever heard of the brand before (I might fall under that category, at least I am happy that Pentax isn't the mainstream choice. And if it does become mainstream, I can say "I've been using Pentax before Pentax itself even knew it existed"). Besides Fuji has managed to build quite a reputation in the photographic community.

03-24-2014, 10:49 PM   #2735
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QuoteQuote:
Ricoh did state that they want Pentax for the camera business.
A corporation rarely states it's true intentions and gives away it's plans to the competition.

QuoteQuote:
The lack of choice in ISPs etc. is rather unfortunate, people do want choice, but regulations aren't in favor of choice.
If people want to change regulations they get off there a** and do so. It's how democracy works in a non-Huxleyan society.

QuoteQuote:
But look at music,
I'll give you music, sort of.

QuoteQuote:
movies,
I work in "the business" don't get me started.

QuoteQuote:
TV shows... people watch different things.
See above, and staring blankly at a box is staring blankly at a box, it doesn't matter what's on it (Here's a scary experiment: put your video camera on a tripod, point it at yourself whilst watching TV, and press record. Then, after you've finished prime time, plug the camera into your TV and watch what you've just accomplished).

QuoteQuote:
Wear different things.
Have you been to a public place recently?

QuoteQuote:
Individualism is a big thing in some communities.
Everyone trying to re-contextualize "being different" in the past is... different?

QuoteQuote:
That everyone uses Samsung or Apple is thanks to marketing.
Did I mention Aldous Huxley yet?




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03-24-2014, 11:23 PM   #2736
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QuoteOriginally posted by MD Optofonik Quote
In addition, we live in an era where people aren't used to having the number of choices once available in the past. They are used to a limited number of cable companies, cell & land line phone companies, ISPs, etc. They don't want more than Canon and Nikon because it would require an effort to make a choice beyond a simple few. The future of photography is very Huxleyan.
Must be a regional thing. Just in my small country (population of 10 mil) there are 15-20 cell line phone companies and probably more ISP's. On the other hand, there actually are stores carrying Pentax here
03-24-2014, 11:24 PM - 1 Like   #2737
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
. The lack of choice in ISPs etc. is rather unfortunate, people do want choice, but regulations aren't in favor of choice. But look at music, movies, TV shows... people watch different things. Wear different things. Individualism is a big thing in some communities. That everyone uses Samsung or Apple is thanks to marketing.

You say that Samsung/Apple domination is due to marketing, then argue that people want more choices. There were/are MANY cell phone manufacturers, like cameras, and yet only two companies DOMINATE the market. Same with Cable and Satellite. It has nothing to do with regulation, and EVERYTHING to do with marketing. You're right, HTC make VASTLY superior hardware, so why is their market-share so small? Because only a small percentage of people have heard of them, and even fewer have used them.


I never said Hasselblad users have anything to fear, I didn't say ANYONE has reason to FEAR, just musing on how they feel about using a specific brand. It may be a tool for the working professional, but every professional cares about his tools. Carpenters won't use a dollar store hammer, they spend a good deal on quality tools and take pride in them.


I actually never thought about what camera brand I used, I used to go to the shop and poke at them until I found one I liked, it wasn't until I started taking photography serious as my source of income that it was brought to my intention that brand mattered. Every other professional I met seemed to resign themselves to one brand. This phenomenon seems to apply more to digital than film users, perhaps due to the higher cost. It's one of the biggest differences I have with other working photographers, at least in my area. It's a pissing contest, I would bet money that the same concept applies to every industry.


Things are changing, but don't fear, they're changing for the better.

---------- Post added 03-24-14 at 11:27 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by retroflex Quote
Must be a regional thing. Just in my small country (population of 10 mil) there are 15-20 cell line phone companies and probably more ISP's. On the other hand, there actually are stores carrying Pentax here


Yes, most of this weird two company domination crap is the U.S. I think we're more susceptible to marketing schemes than other countries. The "American Dream" hasn't lived in the states for years.
03-25-2014, 02:48 AM   #2738
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QuoteOriginally posted by chimpwithagun Quote
Yes, most of this weird two company domination crap is the U.S. I think we're more susceptible to marketing schemes than other countries. The "American Dream" hasn't lived in the states for years.
Or perhaps that big players can dominate a market by fair means or foul to squeeze out other players. Some of it depends on the nature of the law, whether it forces open competition or allows things like deals to stock one brand coming with a condition not to stock another. A shop cannot afford to not stock the main brand in their sector.

Two player market: cola drinks. I saw something amazing in the Gold lounge in Changi T3 on Saturday: Pepsi and Coke in the same (unbranded) fridge. Most vendors (other than the two big brands of supermarket) only have one or the other - try asking for Pepsi at Maccas or Coke at KFC. (Yes KFC is owned by Pepsi, but Maccas in not a Coke brand.

Have you ever noticed how the day a big company is taken to court on a 'predatory pricing' charge the stock price rises: it shows the management are aggressively driving their business, which outweighs the PP penalty?

03-25-2014, 02:48 PM   #2739
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I was sitting in a cafe in Toronto, where I'll be moving this summer, and two gentlemen expressed an interest in my Q 7. One was a K 5 owner and the other very knowledgable about cameras including Pentaxes. They were, however, under the impression that the Q line had gone out of production. I was able to set them right about that, and they told me about places to have film developed in Toronto, in the course of an enjoyable conversation.
03-26-2014, 09:09 AM   #2740
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Android/IOS
Democrat/Republican
Liberal/Tory
Ford/Chevy
Canon/Nikon
Coke/Pepsi
PC/Mac

People tend to favor the easy choice, even when the choices are virtually identical. I for one, don't favor any of the above binary solutions.


Steve

(...Ok, I do own an Android phone, but that is only because of expense and the Windows Phone sucks...)
03-26-2014, 11:27 AM   #2741
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
Maybe that is what Pentax should stress in ads.
Thirty years ago the slogan was 'Just Hold a Pentax' Shutterbug article
.

among the Pentax SV's qualities is its marvellous feel, which led the Rank Organisation, Asahi's UK importers, to initiate the 'Just Hold a Pentax' campaign. This was so successful that it spread around the world, boosting Asahi's sales at just the point where they faced increasing competition from a burgeoning SLR Market.

PIXIS WEBPOST

The SV is the ONLY Pentax camera I will never sell. Literally the only one.
03-26-2014, 10:59 PM   #2742
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Mhhh... Fritz Cola! I miss all the good coke alternatives you can get in Germany.

Maybe Pentax can just reprint the old ad, along a photo of the K-3 and the words "still true". That could remind people of the brand/show young folks how much history the brand has, and it would save money in coming up with a new ad.

Anyway Pentax needs to get into shops. With the cameras not locked away. Incentives and training for sales personnel to get people to touch the camera and a competitor should be enough to drive up sales.
03-26-2014, 11:11 PM   #2743
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I spent a few days in Seville this past weekend and I saw two Pentax DSLRs (very rare in Spain, so I'm sure their owners weren't spaniards). I've no idea what either of them were but one had a DA* 16-50 on it.

Last edited by Jonathan Mac; 03-27-2014 at 02:07 PM.
03-27-2014, 05:57 AM   #2744
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
Mhhh... Fritz Cola! I miss all the good coke alternatives you can get in Germany.
Try Boylan Cola if you can find it - very good. Jones is also pretty good. Boylan's Black Cherry soda is outstanding, too.

Just like more niche brands, if they're not in the stores, you won't find them...
For instance, Costco sells the K50 kit at a decent price, but they're not usually in the stores - just online.
04-02-2014, 01:08 AM   #2745
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A few weeks back we had a wedding reception and the official photographer had a pentax! Was working so couldn't stop to have a chat. Would have loved to have ogled his gear though.
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