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01-13-2015, 11:53 AM   #3451
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Long ago this yhing called the Internet killed most of the local camera shops. It isn't odd to me that they only carry what they can sell rapidly - the long tail is filled by Amazon and B&H etc.

01-13-2015, 12:40 PM   #3452
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It's like vicious circle IMO. But I wouldn't put the blame on the internet shops only. When I think about it - many of these online shops have huge stocks and lot of items available for immediate shipment. So what's the difference? Why couldn't the local shop have some items available as well and show them in the salesroom? Certainly there are still many people which prefer to see and touch the items before they make a decision. Then maybe have a little chat with the shop assistant and make few stops on the way home to test the new gear right away... But who would consider travelling 150 kms to the nearest reasonable camera shop just to find out that there's no assortment and yeah, they could order it for you (but then - why not to order it online right away?).


And if you're lucky you won't meet the same knowing shop assistant which tried to persuade me that I shouldn't buy the B+W UV filter because "it's for black & white photos only"

Last edited by zzeitg; 01-13-2015 at 12:46 PM.
01-13-2015, 12:55 PM   #3453
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QuoteOriginally posted by zzeitg Quote
It's like vicious circle IMO. But I wouldn't put the blame on the internet shops only. When I think about it - many of these online shops have huge stocks and lot of items available for immediate shipment. So what's the difference? Why couldn't the local shop have some items available as well and show them in the salesroom? Certainly there are still many people which prefer to see and touch the items before they make a decision. Then maybe have a little chat with the shop assistant and make few stops on the way home to test the new gear right away... But who would consider travelling 150 kms to the nearest reasonable camera shop just to find out that there's no assortment and yeah, they could order it for you (but then - why not to order it online right away?).


And if you're lucky you won't meet the same knowing shop assistant which tried to persuade me that I shouldn't buy the B+W UV filter because "it's for black & white photos only"


Find, "The long tail" it explains this better. Essentially a large volume dealer cab afford a small amount of inventory for low volume products that a lower volume dealer would not be able to support.

Demand drives this as does advertising.
01-13-2015, 01:12 PM   #3454
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Around where I live, I know of no other Pentax users. Sure there are some old lenses in the local camera shop, but they don't stock anything new.

Why don't shops also do online sales? I would think that that would also allow them to stock more product for local sales as well.

The other thing about local shops is that the prices are way, way higher than buying stuff online. Like 3-4x as much for accessories. I don't see how they even stay in business with how high the prices are.
And their selection pretty much is worthless. I went in there a few weeks ago looking for some shades, and all they really had was a dual sided black/silver one and the price was over twice of what I could get a large set online for.

Now I remember why I only set my foot in the local shop every 2-3 years.

01-13-2015, 01:39 PM   #3455
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I was told at the biggest camera store in Texas, that Nikon, Canon etc has a big advertising budget which drives the store's local and on-line advertising very much. I saw 2 and 3 full page ads in the local newspaper every day before Christmas, mostly for Nikon or Canon. Only saw an ad for Pentax 2 or 3 times placed with ads for other brands. The dealers just don't get the same advertising support from Ricoh. At least there is a sales rep now to help keep the dealers up to date on new products etc.
01-13-2015, 01:48 PM   #3456
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QuoteOriginally posted by cyclone3d Quote
Why don't shops also do online sales? I would think that that would also allow them to stock more product for local sales as well.
$ period. It's hard to setup an identity online that draws enough attention to pay for the infrastructure and security needed - alternatives like eBay and others are fee for service and eat into profits, take time and effort to manage, and have rules that favor the buyer. The headache vs. sales generated is likely too low.

What you get with a local dealer worth anything is personal service and help. The ability for us to support one another and trade gear also reduces our reliance on that model.

Just to be clear my 70+ year old Dad was a sales rep for two major camera manufacturers in the 1970's and then 1980's. He also worked for a local camera store for many years in between those gigs. The way things were sold then and now is night and day. The model that used to work doesn't work anymore.
01-13-2015, 01:56 PM   #3457
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An odd thing I have noticed with combined online/B&M retailers (of all types), and in many cases with large companies with multiple brands of retail shop is that they organise as a set of separate businesses rather than as one integrated whole. A chain of B&M stores with online services could spread their inventory around all their B&M sites, enabling display of some of the range everywhere, and when an online order arrives, dispatch from wherever it is, instead of running a separate online warehouse. This strategy would also help relatively small business which cannot afford large inventory and the real estate of an online warehouse to get into the online business. (The separateness of businesses goes as far as having completely separate buying offices for different brands of retail outlet owned by the same listed company. It seems the corporate strategy of having complete units that can be sold separately in
M&O is more important to them than gaining the efficiencies of consolidating the back-office.)


But one of the bigger problems with the internet is that although everyone can set up a shop, there is no 'next-door' if you do not find what you want at the shop you first thought of - where in B&M often there are a cluster of shops of a type, so they are in direct competition.
01-13-2015, 02:01 PM   #3458
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QuoteOriginally posted by tim60 Quote
An odd thing I have noticed with combined online/B&M retailers (of all types), and in many cases with large companies with multiple brands of retail shop is that they organise as a set of separate businesses rather than as one integrated whole. A chain of B&M stores with online services could spread their inventory around all their B&M sites, enabling display of some of the range everywhere, and when an online order arrives, dispatch from wherever it is, instead of running a separate online warehouse. This strategy would also help relatively small business which cannot afford large inventory and the real estate of an online warehouse to get into the online business.
It might work in Photography since the buyers might tolerate the lower delivery speed this model would likely result in. The big online retailers are very efficient in their delivery models - also the overhead of the sales staff and the personal attention of the local B&M stores might drive the cost of their inventory up. The B&M warehouse can be in a low rent district whereas the local stores may be paying higher rent. It's a different model with different solutions - the fact these are separated by so many companies likely means it works better with different incentives and cost structures.

01-13-2015, 02:05 PM   #3459
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QuoteOriginally posted by jeverettfine Quote
I was told at the biggest camera store in Texas, that Nikon, Canon etc has a big advertising budget which drives the store's local and on-line advertising very much. I saw 2 and 3 full page ads in the local newspaper every day before Christmas, mostly for Nikon or Canon. Only saw an ad for Pentax 2 or 3 times placed with ads for other brands. The dealers just don't get the same advertising support from Ricoh. At least there is a sales rep now to help keep the dealers up to date on new products etc.

Just curious, what is and where is the biggest camera store in Texas? I am by Galveston and we do not have one nearby.
01-13-2015, 02:56 PM   #3460
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Just finished (as subject) a photo shoot for an article about my firm. As we are talking, the photographer says you seem to know a lot about photography, what do you shoot? I said Pentax. He then asked, so you still shoot film?
01-13-2015, 03:03 PM   #3461
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QuoteOriginally posted by GeneV Quote
Just finished (as subject) a photo shoot for an article about my firm. As we are talking, the photographer says you seem to know a lot about photography, what do you shoot? I said Pentax. He then asked, so you still shoot film?
Sad...
01-13-2015, 03:39 PM   #3462
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UncleVanya:
Sorry for the off topic. I couldn't resist.

QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
I have been down this path before. I am a former <gasp> Palm Pre smartphone user.
Ha! I still have my original m515, my Tungsten T3 and my 680 smartphone. Palm is the original smartphone with every other one building on top of Palm's achievements.


TrevinoN
01-13-2015, 05:57 PM   #3463
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QuoteOriginally posted by trevinon Quote
Palm is the original smartphone with every other one building on top of Palm's achievements.
I think Nokia would dispute your claim, Trevino.
01-13-2015, 06:35 PM   #3464
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QuoteOriginally posted by tim60 Quote
But one of the bigger problems with the internet is that although everyone can set up a shop, there is no 'next-door' if you do not find what you want at the shop you first thought of - where in B&M often there are a cluster of shops of a type, so they are in direct competition.
I don't know about the US (or whereever you are), but in Germany there are a couple of price comparison sites that make it extremely easy to find the cheapest price of all online shops, including ratings of the shop. Something like that is coming up in Spain too, though with fewer dealers. This created a ton of competition in Germany, so much that the prices have hit rock bottom (they even compare internationally... so if a shop in Poland or the UK is cheaper, you'll find out, and maybe they can send it) and shops give you better prices when you visit them through these comparison sites, because they have to.
01-13-2015, 07:32 PM   #3465
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On our recent holiday I only saw two other Pentax DSLR's and that was in the last couple of days. In some ways I didn't mind because I felt like part of an exclusive group that knew what all the Canikon users were missing.
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