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01-15-2015, 04:11 PM - 1 Like   #3496
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QuoteOriginally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan Quote
I believe in starting them young....
She is lovely! And a Pentax user, to boot. Please post more of this young beauty.

01-15-2015, 04:40 PM   #3497
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QuoteOriginally posted by zzeitg Quote

But seriously - I've never used the video mode and don't even have plans to give it a try.
Kadajawi cannot comprehend you.
01-15-2015, 05:32 PM   #3498
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I am unsubscribing. Sorry folks but this thread went off track.
01-15-2015, 05:35 PM   #3499
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
Not sure I understand you (or you understand me). The weird thing that happened when Pentax launched the K-3 was that it launched a, in some ways, inferior product, and it didn't have to be inferior. Clearly the K-3 is intented more for video than the K-5. Dedicated video switch, manual video controls, headphone out (and there's really just one purpose for that... video). They have put some effort into video, but then managed to deactivate two things that would make it better than what Canikon have to offer.


All I'm advocating is that people should also take a hard look at the K-5, as for some that may be the better choice. And that Pentax starts to give us some OPTIONS in terms of video. For stills it's not a problem to offer several SR modes, several image quality modes, ... why not for video? Options also means the ability to turn off video and to be able to re-use video centric buttons and switches for other purposes.
That plain simple... You care of video as few others. I don't care and many don't neither. For me the video mode is waste of button real estate and if I had choice I would prefer the video capabilities to be removed entirely to free up for better still ergonomics.

To me outside of a few true video users, the video features of modern DSLR are more of a spec sheet war. The one with the most features for a given price win. You buy a DSLR, if it has a dedicated mode for video, it must be good! Right? That what the guy looking for a new camera must think, looking at all the nice features in the spec sheet he will never use. Obviously it is worse to not have a feature than to have it... The guy want the one with all the feature he will totally forget of a few weeks after purchase.

So that why we had to see to us useless video mode for the spec sheet, for all the guys explaining we must have a better video mode that we are never going to use. This is apparently more important to have direct access to video than more direct access buttons for still. This is more important to have video software update than to allow for more braketing options (like apperture) or implement a proper panorama mode in camera... Or than to improve the AF tracking features or to provide super resolution by merging several shoots. Or why not? To improve still SR so you can 1-2seconds still shoots handled.

Because obviously video is more important.

That's your point of view. Not everybody point of view. The K3 is a far greater still camera than K5, the autofocus is much much better to a level on can not even imagine with the old K5. The white balence is must more accurate as the exposure. The flash system get ride of its exposure bug, everything is faster as a whole and the 24MP + low pass filter removal improve sharpness of your lenses more efficiantly than by upgrading them in many cases.

This is not an inferior product, this is in most ways a better product... As for thoses that really wish video, I don't get it. Sure Pentax is not providing what you want/need. Why stay there continue to be disatisfied? Why not just use a camera that does it right? Really? It might not be as advenced for still... but well that's not your priority.


Last edited by Nicolas06; 01-15-2015 at 05:45 PM.
01-15-2015, 08:19 PM   #3500
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QuoteOriginally posted by Trey45 Quote
Please forgive my 2 cents. If I buy a DSLR I intend to shoot stills, if I wanted to shoot video I wouldn't buy a DSLR, I'd buy a dedicated video camera. As a matter of fact out of the 6 DSLR's that I own, I have shot video on exactly none of them, and all are capable of it. I use my JVC Everio for video.
QuoteOriginally posted by zzeitg Quote
But seriously - I've never used the video mode and don't even have plans to give it a try. I can fully understand that there are people which in contrary to me like to shoot video - but then again - why not to buy a real video camera which is fully designed for this purpose?


Simple. Have you seen any consumer video cameras? Usually they come with 1/4" or 1/6" sensors. Even compared to a common smartphone that is pathetic, they have 1/3" sensors. Even cheap point & shoot cameras tend to have 1/2.3". And that's how image quality from those cameras is. And the look. Everything, literally everything is in focus. It's just an ugly image, IMHO. You don't have control over the look. Video cameras are more of a convenient documentary tool, less an "artistic" or "creative" tool. Why don't you shoot photos with a point & shoot, or a smartphone? Granted, there are video cameras that do have larger sensors and good image quality. They tend to cost several times as much as a DSLR. The Arri Alexa is at something like 50-100000 Euro, and it has the same sensor size as a K-3. Is it better for video? Yes, of course. No doubt about that. It better be, at that price tag. One of Canon's best, if not the best video camera is the 1D C... basically a DSLR with some small modifications, sold at a big premium. And I want to shoot stills and video. And I don't want to carry several cameras for that. A DSLR fulfills my needs, a camcorder doesn't, and it never will.


I have had access to a 1500 Euro'ish camcorder from 2012. Compared to my K-5 the image looks bloody awful. It's sharper out of camera, but that's the only advantage. The SR looks too artificial (though it is very effective, more so than the Pentax SR...), the dynamic range of the 3 sensors is awful (you can see the sensors clipping all. the. time. Messes up colors etc.). Low light performance is bad, and it's not like my K-5 is great at that. I have asked others, and IIRC everyone I asked, except for the owner of the camcorder, prefers the material out of my K-5 (shot at the same time and location). The codec though does a lot right... many options, and it creates high enough quality at good sizes. Why does Lauren shoot video with DSLRs, in her case the K-3? (She is using expensive gear to get around some of the limitations of the K-3 over the K-5, and needs the additional control it gives her).

QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
Kadajawi cannot comprehend you.
Oh, actually I can. And I am perfectly fine with that. Again, I propose that there is ONE button on the camera, and one mode dial item, and that's all the dedicated video controls there should be. And it should be possible to change them in the menu to do some stills function. Don't want video, deactivate it in the menu, reassign the button and mode dial position (could be another user mode?). I am asking for flexibility and options, and that goes both ways. Please accept that some people do want to shoot video, and if Pentax is to remain relevant it better keeps that in mind. Being vastly superior on the stills side of things is difficult. Being so superior that regular people are willing to give up video, even if they only might use it, is even harder.

QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote
That plain simple... You care of video as few others. I don't care and many don't neither. For me the video mode is waste of button real estate and if I had choice I would prefer the video capabilities to be removed entirely to free up for better still ergonomics.

To me outside of a few true video users, the video features of modern DSLR are more of a spec sheet war. The one with the most features for a given price win. You buy a DSLR, if it has a dedicated mode for video, it must be good! Right? That what the guy looking for a new camera must think, looking at all the nice features in the spec sheet he will never use. Obviously it is worse to not have a feature than to have it... The guy want the one with all the feature he will totally forget of a few weeks after purchase.

So that why we had to see to us useless video mode for the spec sheet, for all the guys explaining we must have a better video mode that we are never going to use. This is apparently more important to have direct access to video than more direct access buttons for still. This is more important to have video software update than to allow for more braketing options (like apperture) or implement a proper panorama mode in camera... Or than to improve the AF tracking features or to provide super resolution by merging several shoots. Or why not? To improve still SR so you can 1-2seconds still shoots handled.

Because obviously video is more important.

That's your point of view. Not everybody point of view. The K3 is a far greater still camera than K5, the autofocus is much much better to a level on can not even imagine with the old K5. The white balence is must more accurate as the exposure. The flash system get ride of its exposure bug, everything is faster as a whole and the 24MP + low pass filter removal improve sharpness of your lenses more efficiantly than by upgrading them in many cases.

This is not an inferior product, this is in most ways a better product... As for thoses that really wish video, I don't get it. Sure Pentax is not providing what you want/need. Why stay there continue to be disatisfied? Why not just use a camera that does it right? Really? It might not be as advenced for still... but well that's not your priority.
Pentax surely treats it that way, yes. The 645Z really only has video because it is technically possible... barely, and it came (almost) free for Pentax.


How about shake reduction as a feature for the spec sheet war? It's a feature that is actually useful, it is technically possible, older cameras have shown that, it's a feature videographers like, it's one consumers like (no one likes jiddery video... seen many well done videos made with Canon cameras where the jidder and shakiness ruined it, and Pentax' SR system would easily eliminate that. Those videos usually don't use in camera audio anyway, so Pentax' reason that SR messes up the audio (it barely does, actually) is really missing the market).


I'd like you to get your direct stills access buttons, I could use them too. And one of them I'd assign to switch into the video mode, and you'd give them another feature. Flexibility.


I want stills braketing, in my case it's to move the sensor to it's 4 corners (not sure what aperture braketing is useful for... but what about focus braketing?). Panorama mode in camera... maybe one that assists me by fixing exposure, aperture and focus, and showing the overlap... but more than that is really unnecessary. Super resolution by merging several shots? Yes, PLEASE! (IMHO an API with WiFi or USB tethering would solve that... one of us can create a small app that gives the camera this functionality. A right, Samsung does it with the NX1 it seems, they offer a SDK. Pentax apparently flat out rejected that idea).


Better AF tracking... would be nice, but wouldn't mirrorless with a PDAF sensor be better for that? There isn't such a big delay, you can focus right before the shot is taken, because no mirror has to flap open, and if you use an electronic shutter (which gets more useful as sensor readout gets faster (less rolling shutter... good for video)) it's even faster. Faster CPU is needed for video... and a faster CPU will also give you better AF processing speed. It's a case of features developed for video improving the stills capabilities of a camera. Still SR that can handle 1-2 seconds handheld would also benefit video, if activated.


Video isn't important to Pentax, beyond the spec sheets, that's why there are some unnecessary deficiencies. Or maybe it is important, but they don't understand it. Other brands hire external consultants it seems. Olympus is rumored to circulate their OM-D E-M1 in Hollywood. Panasonic talks to videographers. Canon probably too, though they want to limit their DSLRs to push videographers to their cinema line of cameras (which is expensive...). Pentax couldn't have done any of that, or the K-3 would not be limited to a bad h264 implementation at 24 Mbps (not enough, think highly compressed JPEG, and that's all you get), and it would have SR enabled as an option (people who are serious about video tend to use external audio anyway).


Why wasn't the exposure bug fixed in the K-5? I'd like to see the improved speed of the K-3, and the better AF, that's what makes it so frustrating that they just DISABLED perfectly good and useful features that were present in the K-5. With them activated I'd say the K-3 is pretty near to perfection, and it would appeal to both stills and video shooters.


I'm sticking with Pentax because until now the K-5 is, for me, the best mix between stills and video. It has a good codec and great SR, the material looks very good, almost cinematic (can't do that with a camcorder), and it's great for stills. The Olympus OM-D E-M1 and the Sony A7 II are the only other large sensor cameras that have SR in video, and the OM-D has an even worse video mode than Pentax, and a smaller sensor. The A7 II is good, but the larger sensor limits the effectiveness of the SR system, and overall it's not tempting enough. Not a big fan of the A7 series.


This thread goes off topic, comes back to topic (then it usually stays depressingly quiet for a while... not too many sightings out there I'm afraid), goes off topic, ... personally I think that's fine. Threads develop and change.
01-15-2015, 09:23 PM   #3501
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
Simple.
Dude, please take this somewhere else! If you have to post off topic, keep it to one or two posts and then go to PM or start a new thread!

In the spirit of trying to keep this thread going in the right direction, today I saw a k20d around the neck of an older gentleman in the downtown area of St. Catharines, Ontario.
01-16-2015, 06:08 AM - 1 Like   #3502
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
S
This thread goes off topic, comes back to topic (then it usually stays depressingly quiet for a while... not too many sightings out there I'm afraid), goes off topic, ... personally I think that's fine. Threads develop and change.
Many others don't think that's fine. It would be better to stick to the topic and take the video rant elsewhere.

Last edited by Parallax; 01-16-2015 at 06:14 AM.
01-16-2015, 06:51 AM   #3503
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parallax Quote
Many others don't think that's fine. It would be better to stick to the topic and take the video rant elsewhere.
+1...

01-16-2015, 08:15 AM   #3504
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parallax Quote
Many others don't think that's fine. It would be better to stick to the topic and take the video rant elsewhere.
+2
01-16-2015, 08:17 AM - 2 Likes   #3505
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I saw a Pentax user this morning! I was looking in the mirror at the time, but I still saw one! Handsome fellow too, with a nice K5iis.
01-16-2015, 08:45 AM   #3506
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QuoteOriginally posted by virusn3t Quote
Era solo el catálogo en linea o un promocional dentro de la tienda? Ojala no se aumenten demasiado los precios
No. It is the 2015 printed catalogue delivered to my door-steps, the kind of things I do not even check, but for some reason this time I decided to check the camera section and there it was, a full page promoting Pentax. I looked at their website to see if there was an electronic version of it but couldn't find any. :-(

But still, finding a promotional on Pentax in a catalogue by a company that is all over the country is a first in a very long time.

There was no indication about prices but from experience I wouldn't expect low prices. I would still go and by my stuff in Amazon USA or directly with B&H on-line.


Trevinon
01-16-2015, 08:50 AM   #3507
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You mean take it somewhere where no one will read it, just so that someone will again say: Buy a video camera? They are meant for that? It has been explained several times in this forum why DSLRs are (sometimes) better for video than video cameras, yet people repeatedly say the same things.

I didn't mean to take it this off topic, and to continue with the thread. I just wanted to answer and explain. And the thing that started it all was just meant as a maybe he will end up/be happier with a K-5. Who knows. Would have been perfectly happy if it had ended there. Or at the explanation that followed.

And come on, if people have to look in the mirror to find a Pentax shooter that they can mention here...

I hope those who asked and wondered have read my posts and understand now, and that we can let the subject end here. There is more info on the video subsection (yes, it exists) of this forum, for example.

As for the topic... Still haven't seen a Pentax shooter in a while. The last major one was in Beijing (or was it Shanghai) in a major shopping street... A man in his 30s I'd say with a 645D.

Last edited by kadajawi; 01-16-2015 at 09:04 AM.
01-16-2015, 09:30 AM - 1 Like   #3508
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01-16-2015, 09:40 AM - 1 Like   #3509
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QuoteOriginally posted by Giklab Quote
+2
+3...

@kadajawi Please consider to stop the off topic and complaining in particular after a moderator explained that this should stop.
01-16-2015, 09:49 AM   #3510
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I just discovered the ignore button, it works!
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