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07-11-2011, 02:08 PM   #886
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QuoteOriginally posted by jamarley Quote
Which leads directly into what RioRico just said: "We're in a profound imaging revolution."
Thanks for noticing!

Another point is more insidious: Device as commodity. In 1980 I built my first microcomputer, a HeathKit H8 system. Soldered the desktop/CPU box together (with front-panel octal keypad!) along with floppy drives, printer, terminal, etc. At the time, micros were highly individual. Apple II, various Commodores, Atari's, TRC-80's, the nascent IBM-PC, zillions of other brands -- does anyone here recall ProcTology? All very different, like the early days of automobiles and film cameras.

Then came convergence -- many PC clones, various Apple products, and all the rest are gone -- does anyone here recall Wang, MindSet, Victor, Zenith? And by 15-20 years ago, computers had become commodities. How many, of all brands, are churned out by a few Chinese factories? How many differ only cosmetically?

I'll posit a parallel with digicams. Early 'compact' P&S's (and some not so compact, like Mavicas) were mostly different, many approaches being tried, many brands being flogged. Then came convergence -- how many name- (and nameless-)brand P&S's are churned out of a couple other Chinese factories? How many are clones? And cellphones, which are killing the P&S market, are essentially the same -- all just wholesale commodities, mostly indistinguishable between brands.

I said we're in an imaging revolution. It will eventually reach into the 'advanced' dSLR and MILC markets, with the same consolidation as with film SLRs (all those Sears-Focal-Ricoh-Fuji-Porst-Vivitar-Cosinaa-etc clones). We'll see a couple market leaders, and boatloads of commodity cams. This will last until the imaging revolution wipes all those away, as digital moatly has obliterated film. I don't know what those next revolutionary products will be. But they will knock your socks off!

07-12-2011, 07:04 AM   #887
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QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
Device as commodity.
A. The Kodak Brownie

B. Film

C. P&S (film and digital)

D. Low-end SLR's

E. Low-end DSLR's (already)

F. Cameraphones (already)

G. Photoshop as a $0.99 cent app (sooner than you think)


After the invention of film, the most profound revolution in imaging was the fax machine which helped topple Eastern Europe's communism by transmitting an image, then pixel level image editing on a computer.

Frankly, not much else about still images has changed all that much save for a ton of automation.
07-12-2011, 10:45 AM   #888
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Let';s get past the communism toppling thing.
"...helped topple Eastern Europe's communism by transmitting an image..."

That was twenty years ago, and frankly the first world has gone nowgere but downhill ever since. Canadians in particular have nothing to brag about their country, which is the among the most corrupt and venial in the world today.

Sorry, I realize that's totally off-topic, but these casual references to outdated events and empty triumphalism really upset me. I'll shut up now.
07-12-2011, 11:56 AM   #889
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QuoteOriginally posted by asaru Quote
Let';s get past the communism toppling thing.
"...helped topple Eastern Europe's communism by transmitting an image..."

That was twenty years ago, and frankly the first world has gone nowgere but downhill ever since. Canadians in particular have nothing to brag about their country, which is the among the most corrupt and venial in the world today.

Sorry, I realize that's totally off-topic, but these casual references to outdated events and empty triumphalism really upset me. I'll shut up now.
WTF, it was relevant in a discussion of imaging revolution (the point being there hasn't been one in a long time.)
the first world by the way was already in decline when this happened
China has just been slowly reasserting there historical dominance in the world (there only being a short (historically) period they weren't the dominant economy in the last couple of thousand years

07-12-2011, 12:49 PM - 1 Like   #890
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If Pentax could substantially penetrate China, Pentaxians would no longer be rare. Just well-done.
07-12-2011, 01:23 PM   #891
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QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
If Pentax could substantially penetrate China, Pentaxians would no longer be rare. Just well-done.
07-12-2011, 01:47 PM   #892
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QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
If Pentax could substantially penetrate China, Pentaxians would no longer be rare. Just well-done.
Gold!
07-12-2011, 06:07 PM   #893
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QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
If Pentax could substantially penetrate China, Pentaxians would no longer be rare. Just well-done.
If Pentax could substantially penetrate Yorkshire it'd be a start...

07-13-2011, 12:10 AM   #894
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Pentax in Yorkshire

Well I was in Yorkshire week with both my K100Ds in the camera bag. Mind you whilst that increased the Pentax numbers in Yorkshire it meant there were two fewer in Somerset where I live.

I was on a railway station photographing a steam train. There were loads of people there of whom 50% were using some form of compact. All the serious looking chaps (and they were nearly all males aged 50+) seemed to be using Canon or Nikon with expensive looking lenses. I did notice one or two with Sony and then little old me with the K100D

I did chuckle though. The vast majority were all jostling for position in the same place at the end of the platform, so all would have taken pretty much the same picture. I managed to find a spot, with, I think, a more interesting angle, where no one else was stood, so at least my shots were a little different from most others.

We are a rare bird indeed
07-17-2011, 09:08 AM   #895
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I saw somebody with a K-5 today in our local park. I was really surprised, because our town has a population of about 17K and I was there just for a moment. It was really a coincidence. I didn't talk to him (although I wanted), because he had earbuds.
07-17-2011, 09:43 AM   #896
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saw a teenage girl shooting photos with a K-5 yesterday in Vilnius (Lithuania), where I'm enjoying a weekend trip. also noted 2 or 3 people using Pentax p&s cameras (don't know which ones).

and saw a gazillion canons/ nikons, including a youg couple who had a Canon 7D each - one with a super-fancy telephoto and the other with a fixed focal wide angle lens (each had this red ribbon close to the end of the lens, so I reckon they were more towards high-end stuff; the telephoto had gray tubing). thought this was a nice way to avoid lens switching.

Last edited by maciek_w; 07-17-2011 at 02:47 PM.
07-17-2011, 10:07 AM   #897
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QuoteOriginally posted by abmj Quote
I've read the "pros dissing Pentax" thread and had a bit of a laugh. I shot high-end Canon for 30 years in my film days but am at a more laidback place now during semi-retirement. For the switch to DSLR, I couldn't justify the expense - particularly for good glass - that Canon entailed and went with Pentax. I am very happy with that choice despite the occasional sneer from my former Canon compatriots.

Now, my topic. During the recent Worldwide Photo Walk, I joined 40+ area photographers for a fun day of shooting followed by a group lunch and wrap-up. In that group, I saw exactly zero Pentax DSLRs - aside from my own. I found myself "justifying" my choice not to go with Canikon during good natured discussions. Not so much distain but more "why in the world would a serious photographer NOT buy Canikon??"

Are we really that sparse out in the world?
Don't worry about it. I have found that in general the quality of imagery coming from Pentax users far superior to the others. I don't know why, but I find the fact that Pentax users are a minority may add to the artistic neurotic angst that allows them to push the envelope and produce somewhat different imagery than the norm. Now I am referring to the public at large and not the upper echelon Professional community, where stuff gets a lot more blurry in terms of delineation.
07-17-2011, 10:15 AM   #898
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Let's revisit this topic in a year or so. A Pentaxian may no longer be such a rara avis then. Then these fora may be crowded with newbs, and old-timers (K7 owners etc) will bemoan our loss of cult status. "Damn, look at all those K3's and GXR2's and 67D's everywhere! I'm not special anymore!" Yada yada...
07-17-2011, 02:50 PM   #899
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what would we have to believe in for this story to become reality? I reckon that would require some serious sacrifice and worship effort to make the photo-gods look down on the Pentaxian tribe with parently love and say: "Let them be more". no?
07-17-2011, 03:17 PM   #900
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Most of the acceptance of Pentax is name recognition by advanced shooters. Advanced amateurs and pros know Pentax from when they first started out but as their careers progressed, they had nowhere to go with Pentax so they switched brands. Noobies are influenced by what they see on TV ads and pros using Canikon at sporting events.

There's a reason that most successful companies have larger advertising budgets than R & D budgets. It doesn't matter how good a product is if no body knows it exists.

On the other hand, who is concerned about Leica going out of business. A very select crowd can buy them and they are the envy of all. Similarly, Rolls Royce and Rolex are like that too. But still in each of those cases, they have general name recognition. You see the Rolex Cup in sports car racing. You see Rolls Royce in magazines and in ads. Pentax HAS TO get their name out. They don't have the luxury of prestige like Leica and Rolex.

I've heard it said that Pentax needs to distinguish it's self from the pack. My question is how do they do that? Do they make a camera similar to the Fuji X100? Amazon.com: Fujifilm X100 12.3 MP APS-C CMOS EXR Digital Camera with 23mm Fujinon Lens and 2.8-Inch LCD: Camera & Photo

Maybe Pentax should make all of their cameras and lenses weather sealed and highlight the toughness of the brand. I shot a music festival a few months ago and when it rained, the other shooters covered their cameras while I kept shooting. They were astounded that I didn't have to stop for the weather.

I don't know but it seems that Pentax needs a better marketing firm.

Last edited by john5100; 07-17-2011 at 03:23 PM.
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