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04-10-2012, 07:47 AM   #1441
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They know waht a Pentax is

QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
I'd say the KR/KX were both good entry level (ie student) cameras. Problem is any Photography/journalism/media studies Student is going to buy with an eye towards their career. Part of that involves having the FF upgrade path (never an issue in Film days since the upgrade path was medium format for a lot of serious pro work so lens compatability wasn't the issue, you would be running 2 systems)
Right now when they look at the brand (and one of the best Pentax dealers in Toronto is right by the school with the most photographers as well - the one normhead taught at BTW) they don't see that path with just 2 bodies. I know there are a couple of photo students working at the shop and at least one has a Pentax 67, but they shoot canikon for their digital because they want the FF (if they haven't already bought it)
In the US "student" means high school photojournalism,. which is taught as part of the art curriculum and practiced as part of the Newspaper/Yearbook (which is offered for-credit). Around 2004 our local suburban school district used Federal Funds to purchase 40 Canon digital cameras, lenses, 40 Apple computers and Adobe CSx (necessary to "develop" digital images), hired a software teacher, closed the darkrooms to save on consumables and started delivering Yearbook and Newspaper electronically at a further saving. The savings were significant enough to pay for the additional instructor, but only worked because the hardware was "free" to the School District.

This year the Art Department got the ancient K1000's out of the closet, opened the darkrooms and is again instruction wet-process photography (they teach the entire curriculum from taking through printing). If they were to purchase new film camera bodies I guess they'd be forced to buy Nikon - which feeds into something by the loginc of this thread.

When I cross paths with an Art student through my community service, though, and I have a Pentax camera around my neck, they know what it is. I actually had the very experience as a chaperone on a recent High School Ski Day. When I was taking the requisite "parents" group shot (after the Photojournalist took the Yearbook shot) several students approached me about my K10D!


Last edited by monochrome; 04-10-2012 at 08:12 AM.
04-10-2012, 08:00 AM   #1442
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
In the US "student" means high school photojournalism,. which is taught as part of the art curriculum and practiced as part of the Newspaper/Yearbook (which is offered for-credit). Around 2004 our local suburban school district used Federal Funds to purchase 40 Canon digital cameras, lenses, 40 Apple computers and Adobe CSx (necessary to "develop" digital images), hired a software teacher, closed the darkrooms to save on consumables and started delivering Yearbook and Newspaper electronically at a further saving. The savings were significant enough to pay for the additional instructor, but only worked because the hardware was "free" to the School District.

This year the Art Department got the ancient K1000's out of the closet, opened the darkrooms and is again instruction wet-process photography (they teach the entire curriculum from taking through printing). If they were to purchase new film camera bodies I guess they'd be forced to buy Nikon - which feeds into something by the loginc of this thread.

When I cross paths with an Art student through my community service, thoughh, and I have a Pentax camera around my neck, they know what it is.
the Nikon is actually a Cosina (at least the cheap one) I doubt they are buying the F6 - may as well buy D700s at that price

I think there are some other film bodies (essentially the same actually with different mounts) but they aren't distributed over here (Kenko makes some AFAIK, and there is a Vivitar in K mount I think)

they would have been wise to buy *ist DS in 2004 if they had a store of K1000 bodies and lenses, someone did them no favours (the ds was better built than the canons at that time I sold both - and bought the ds)
too late now of course
I think having the wet darkroom and film as part of the program has huge benefits. No automation and all manual controls will make them think about what they are doing and make them better photographers IMo (combined with the instant feedback of digital it's actually a great way to learn I think)
Not sure about now, but when i were a lad (imagine heavy northern English accent here) the yearbook and photography were all extracurricular not credit activities
04-10-2012, 10:59 AM   #1443
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
the Nikon is actually a Cosina (at least the cheap one) I doubt they are buying the F6 - may as well buy D700s at that price

I think there are some other film bodies (essentially the same actually with different mounts) but they aren't distributed over here (Kenko makes some AFAIK, and there is a Vivitar in K mount I think)

they would have been wise to buy *ist DS in 2004 if they had a store of K1000 bodies and lenses, someone did them no favours (the ds was better built than the canons at that time I sold both - and bought the ds)
too late now of course
I think having the wet darkroom and film as part of the program has huge benefits. No automation and all manual controls will make them think about what they are doing and make them better photographers IMo (combined with the instant feedback of digital it's actually a great way to learn I think)
Not sure about now, but when i were a lad (imagine heavy northern English accent here) the yearbook and photography were all extracurricular not credit activities
Yep - likely. Our school district (urban but not suburban - middle class, neither poor nor wealthy) takes the position that everything is vocational, so everything is for credit. Music is taught as if you will play professionally (several in the last ten years have landed as Nashville and Hollywood studio musincians). Same with dance, fine art (graphic design), journalism, business, science, history, language, athletics - it is all taught with some practical application framework. Everything gets curricular funding - there is nothing extra-curricular, even athletics (athletics requires extensive kinesiology and physiology classroom work).

Interesting concept, huh?
04-10-2012, 01:00 PM   #1444
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The reason why students prefer CaNikon over Pentax is actually very simple. When they buy CaNikon, the school can lend them lenses and other equipment (for free of course). At least that is common practice here in the Czech Republic speaking about colleges focused on design & photography. I'm actually going to go to college myself in September, so I know what I'm talking about. And although it's not a photography-focused one, I am definitelly going to continue photography as my past-time activity. I love my K-x so far and it has never let me down.

04-10-2012, 01:16 PM   #1445
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QuoteOriginally posted by freddykrueger Quote
The reason why students prefer CaNikon over Pentax is actually very simple. When they buy CaNikon, the school can lend them lenses and other equipment (for free of course). At least that is common practice here in the Czech Republic speaking about colleges focused on design & photography. I'm actually going to go to college myself in September, so I know what I'm talking about. And although it's not a photography-focused one, I am definitelly going to continue photography as my past-time activity. I love my K-x so far and it has never let me down.
For the Schools here you supply your own gear, but sharing the same brand as the other students does mean some chance of a common lens pool if people are willing to lend their gear.
Ryerson offers a 4 year university degree program in Image Arts which can be photography, film, or media based, with several grad program options (AFAIK it's a unique program as it is offered as a university level course rather than college level (and it's not a fine arts program that is separate)
One big advantage is the ability to rent specialty lenses in Canikon formats there are at least 3 big pro rental shops downtown here all canikon or mamiya hassleblad - when film was prevalent you could rent 645 and 67 lenses it took so long for the 645D to come out that died.
04-10-2012, 07:18 PM   #1446
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Pentax wasn't so rare when these guys were the talk of the town:


QuoteQuote:
I think having the wet darkroom and film as part of the program has huge benefits. No automation and all manual controls will make them think about what they are doing and make them better photographers IMo (combined with the instant feedback of digital it's actually a great way to learn I think)
I agree to this. The degree of comparison they can make between "computer-assisted" and "all manual" will further their learning of the art, and the techniques. Also, they learn a lot in the FF-vs.-APS-C FL thing (because I doubt schools buy 35mm digital for their students), which get a lot of newbies stumped in the beginning of their learning curve.
04-10-2012, 10:12 PM   #1447
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QuoteOriginally posted by Alizarine Quote
Also, they learn a lot in the FF-vs.-APS-C FL thing (because I doubt schools buy 35mm digital for their students), which get a lot of newbies stumped in the beginning of their learning curve.
This is also another reason why fisheye lenses are useful.
04-10-2012, 10:56 PM   #1448
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Possibly.Some consumer's are not content unless they own the most popular car,camera,stock portfolio...etc. It makes them feel "special." I,on the otherhand know I am special because,even though I could have afforded a Canon or Nikon,I chose Pentax because it ain't necessarily the camera folks.It's the person behind the lens. I know people who own Canon's and Nikons.They are lousy photographers.Why?Well..first there is composition.A beautiful baby deer won't look that good if there is a garbage can in the picture. Then you have to know all about f-stops.Shutter speed,etc.sure,you can use AF and AE all you want,but are you really taking the picture,or is the camera?I chose the k2000 as my first d-SLR.Why? Well...the price was right. Pentax is always good quality.The fact that I can use Pentax lenses from 50 years ago really sold me.yes,I have to shoot using Manual,but so what??That only makes me learn more and the end result is my interpretation of a particular subject.But the most important reason I chose the k2000 is that there wasn't a live view.I have to use the viewfinder,just like I did when I first got hooked on photography. It helps me with composition.I don't like automatic transmissions and I don't like a little computer controlling me.I am in control!!! Hear me roar!! Long live Pentax!! Maybe they really have Pentax-envy??And have to be snotty because they are mortified that they spent a gazillion bucks on a hotsy-totsy camera when a lowly old Pentax would have done the trick.

04-10-2012, 11:15 PM - 1 Like   #1449
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Yeah! Canon and Nikon users are stoopid and their pikchers suck!

(Expecting our Beginner's Corner and photo critique sections to be eliminated as superfluous now. The purchasing of a Pentax indicates photographic knowledge and skill).
04-10-2012, 11:53 PM   #1450
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QuoteOriginally posted by PenPen Quote
I know people who own Canon's and Nikons.They are lousy photographers.
Most professionals use C and N. Journalists, wedding photogs, etc. Can't say they're lousy when people pay them for their photos...

QuoteOriginally posted by PenPen Quote
Pentax is always good quality.
Not really... just look at the number of SDM complaints on DA* lenses... the K-5 sensor stain issue, the K-r ff/bf issues... but of course, the aim is always there to make quality products. QC just has to tighten up more.

QuoteOriginally posted by PenPen Quote
And have to be snotty because they are mortified that they spent a gazillion bucks on a hotsy-totsy camera when a lowly old Pentax would have done the trick.
This I agree to a big extent, on the entry-level products (or user mindset in terms of purchase)
04-11-2012, 12:06 AM   #1451
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mike Cash Quote
Yeah! Canon and Nikon users are stoopid and their pikchers suck!

My wife's friend showed me her D90 with kit lens the other day. We talked about photography and I showed her some of my shots with a $50 SMC 50mm f1.4 lens and she inquired about the bokeh.

I explained that I was using a cheap, fast lens and about aperture etc. and she had a confused look on her face.

She showed me how she produced bokeh....by taking a photo and quickly turning the zoom ring....
04-11-2012, 12:18 AM   #1452
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QuoteOriginally posted by knaff Quote
She showed me how she produced bokeh....by taking a photo and quickly turning the zoom ring....
*Twitch*
04-11-2012, 12:49 AM   #1453
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How did Annie (PenPen) get banned so quickly?
04-11-2012, 01:33 AM   #1454
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mike Cash Quote
How did Annie (PenPen) get banned so quickly?
Who?
When?
04-11-2012, 02:09 AM   #1455
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Banned? What?
QuoteOriginally posted by PenPen Quote
Possibly.Some consumer's are not content unless they own the most popular car,camera,stock portfolio...etc. It makes them feel "special."
"Well, I'm watching my TV
And a man comes on and tells me
How white my shirt should be
Or that he can't be a man
'Cause he doesn't smoke
The same cigarette as me
I can't get no, no no no...
No satisfaction"
--Sir M.Jagger
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