Are we really THAT rare?

**DamienW** · 12-01-2021, 01:00 AM

Originally posted by SFTphotography

I got a pair of 645z's and couldn't be happier - some newer more weather sealed zooms wouldn't go a miss. It's two zooms away from utter omnipotance as a system.

Wouldn't mind me a 645Z some day. Have had the GAS for the system for a while, but never got as far as stumping up the cash.

Jonathan Mac · 12-01-2021, 01:19 AM

Originally posted by Alex645

What would a new full frame Pentax do that the current K1ii doesn't? There are a LOT of people that would be interested and buy into a full frame 35mm SLR IF used new glass currently on the market. However, the fear of obsolescence is strong.

Given the reality of the world today, a K1ii and a used MZ-S is the answer. Or with a big budget, why not the 645Z and a 645Nii?

I would say that the 67II is the absolute king of Pentax film cameras rather than the 645N II - go big or go home, as they say

Originally posted by TheBeav

I really would be interested in a full frame Pentax if they release a new version. I would like to get the body and 3 lenses.

There are four FA Limiteds now, not three

HoutHans · 12-01-2021, 01:32 AM

Originally posted by Lord Lucan

I think things must have changed with digital.

I was in a photographic club in the film era and I remember only two occasions when the subject of camera brand came up. One was when a member showed us his retirement gift of a Leica rangefinder in a presentation case. The other was a talk by the photographer from our local paper who told of his experiences and showed us his kit (a Nikon F3) and I remember thinking it did not seem to do anything my Pentax LX couldn't. I honestly never noticed what brand cameras the other club members were using. We talked instead about what film we were using and what processing (or processor) we used.

Ironically, we were called a "camera club" in our title.

Since digital, it happens that I have never been with any group of photo enthusiast. I did recently show my K-1 to a friend who is vaguely interested - at least he does not use a phone camera. I think he was non-plussed by it and his main comment was how big and heavy it was. His camera is small, I believe a 1" sensor type.

I think you're right about things having changed with digital. As rhe technology grew more capable there were more things/metrics by which one camera (brand) could distinguish itself from all others. In film you'd basically have shutter speeds, metering and that's about it. Nowadays the list is endless (don't get me started on the megapixels), and various comparison sites make it about the metrics, given that is ultimately for a lot of people the justification they need to buy gear. Having purchased a shiny new (and expensive) camera, it makes perfect sense to want to distinguish that thing from all other things, so the discussion is likely to be about the things, not so much what is produced with it.

**richard0170** · 12-01-2021, 01:37 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by DamienW

Wouldn't mind me a 645Z some day. Have had the GAS for the system for a while, but never got as far as stumping up the cash.

I seriously thought about upgrading to one recently. I bottled out though and went for K1 ii instead, sold on my Bronica ETRsi outfit and got a SQ-A one for an enhanced MF experience. It is not just the cost of the camera and the lenses I would need but also having to upgrade all my computer equipment to actually appreciate what the camera is capable of. And I really do not care for computer stuff much. Otherwise for slow considered work the 645Z does seem to be the best option out there. TBH though I am still blown away by the improvement in IQ the K1 brings over my KP and K3. I find it's not a resolution thing as such but the way the tones seem to melt together much more nicely and the colours require less processing for my optimal taste. I often find I am turning the saturation down rather than up with the K1.

**Cerebum** · 12-01-2021, 01:38 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Alex645

What would a new full frame Pentax do that the current K1ii doesn't? There are a LOT of people that would be interested and buy into a full frame 35mm SLR IF used new glass currently on the market. However, the fear of obsolescence is strong.

Given the reality of the world today, a K1ii and a used MZ-S is the answer. Or with a big budget, why not the 645Z and a 645Nii?

Sometimes people just want "new", even if the improvements are minimal.

**richard0170** · 12-01-2021, 02:01 AM

Originally posted by Alex645

What would a new full frame Pentax do that the current K1ii doesn't?

The K1 ii despite its wonderful ergonomics and engineering is heavy and bulky. It has a high MP count and the AF is relatively primitive. I held back on getting one for several years (I succumbed in October, and am exceedingly happy with it) for the first 2 of these reasons. I use almost exclusively MF on my Pentax stuff now so personally not so worried about AF performance. Mine is almost always used on a tripod for slow considered shooting to get the most out of the sensor. Used in this way it is a joy. As a walk about camera though I find it not so much so. I believe there is a case for a compact FF camera of the KP style with a lower MP count and improved AF which would be a low light beast. Not going to happen of course as Ricoh would never sell enough to get a return on the investment. Had Ricoh introduced such a camera back in 2016 as a rival to Nikon's D750 or Canon's 6D instead of the K1, I would have purchased such a machine a long time ago. But then, I would not have purchased my KP. Did Ricoh make the right commercial decisions back then? Who knows. What I do know is that I am very happy with having both the KP and K1 ii. Horses for courses really.

**Alex645** · 12-01-2021, 10:37 AM

Originally posted by Jonathan Mac

I would say that the 67II is the absolute king of Pentax film cameras rather than the 645N II - go big or go home, as they say

Originally posted by richard0170

The K1 ii despite its wonderful ergonomics and engineering is heavy and bulky. It has a high MP count and the AF is relatively primitive. I held back on getting one for several years (I succumbed in October, and am exceedingly happy with it) for the first 2 of these reasons. I

@JM: To paraphrase @richard, despite the 67II being the film size Pentax king, for me it is too heavy and bulky for all day street photography or a long hike in nature. And although the auto focus on the 645Nii is basic, the 67II is manual focus only.

I also paired the 645Nii and the 645Z because they can share lenses which the OP mentioned as the preferred set up.

---------- Post added 12-01-21 at 11:46 AM ----------

Originally posted by Cerebum

Sometimes people just want "new", even if the improvements are minimal.

Well the K1ii is still manufactured and sold as new, even though it's nearly 4 years since it's release. Only three other FF DSLRs are newer; one from Canon and two from Nikon.

Unfortunately for those of us that still shoot film, the last 35mm SLR new was the Nikon F6, and although I fantasize that an updated Pentax MZ-S or even LX would be made again, it would have to be the pet project for something like AmazonBasics and probably wouldn't have a Pentax mount.

There are also many examples when 'new' was a downgrade.

Last edited by Alex645; 12-01-2021 at 10:49 AM.

**ehrwien** · 12-02-2021, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by Jonathan Mac

There are four FA Limiteds now, not three

Well actually the fourth one is a D FA Limited lens. I guess the D is supposed to make a difference, at least to the designers and/or marketing people at Pentax D FA Limited | PENTAX Limited Lens Special Site | RICOH IMAGING

**Mikesul** · 12-02-2021, 12:20 PM

Originally posted by ehrwien

Well actually the fourth one is a D FA Limited lens. I guess the D is supposed to make a difference, at least to the designers and/or marketing people at Pentax D FA Limited | PENTAX Limited Lens Special Site | RICOH IMAGING

Yes. It was designed for digital so D.

**kiwi_jono** · 12-02-2021, 12:59 PM

Well I know there are a few New Zealanders on these forums but I'm struggling remember the last time I came face to face with another Pentaxian. I think it might have been 3 years ago when I was buying a second hand lens locally.
But that said the number of people wondering around with DSLRs (or SLRs) has diminished significantly in recent years, as mobile phone cameras have improved greatly and are good enough for most uses.

**beachgardener** · 12-03-2021, 01:57 AM

Not seen a fellow Pentaxian around my neck of the woods for some time now, maybe soon

totsmuyco · 12-04-2021, 01:55 AM - **1 Like**

Went out for a shoot for 2 consecutive Saturdays, last week and today. I was the only one with a camera. So maybe we can say they (canikonyfu) are kinda rare during Saturdays and Pentax isn't that rare as a Pentax camera was roaming around the city.

BeeShooter · 12-04-2021, 08:14 PM

Originally posted by totsmuyco

Went out for a shoot for 2 consecutive Saturdays, last week and today. I was the only one with a camera. So maybe we can say they (canikonyfu) are kinda rare during Saturdays and Pentax isn't that rare as a Pentax camera is roaming around the city.

That's a great point! I see more Bufflehead ducks than I do canikonsofu.

house · 12-05-2021, 02:48 AM

The pandemic has, despite no lockdowns and few restrictions, meant reduced time in crowds. So I've seen less cameras than ususal. Very locally there are a couple of Fujis regularly on the street. A M43 shooter, I can't tell the brand. I've seen tourists with 5D's and a few R's. Strangely very few Sony's recently.

swanlefitte · 12-05-2021, 09:22 AM

I am in wild parks and I have seen 7 other slrs this year plus a few wedding photoshoots.
One is my friends olympus. 2 more are also nature photographers I exchange info on where things are. The other 4 were portrait photographers. Only once was I asked about my camera but lenses and how they help and hinder comes up.

12-04-2021, 01:55 AM - 1 Like	#6732
totsmuyco Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Iloilo City Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,276	Went out for a shoot for 2 consecutive Saturdays, last week and today. I was the only one with a camera. So maybe we can say they (canikonyfu) are kinda rare during Saturdays and Pentax isn't that rare as a Pentax camera was roaming around the city. Last edited by totsmuyco; 02-01-2022 at 12:30 AM.

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12-01-2021, 01:00 AM	#6721
DamienW Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2019 Location: Canberra, Australia Posts: 847	Originally posted by SFTphotography I got a pair of 645z's and couldn't be happier - some newer more weather sealed zooms wouldn't go a miss. It's two zooms away from utter omnipotance as a system. Wouldn't mind me a 645Z some day. Have had the GAS for the system for a while, but never got as far as stumping up the cash.

12-01-2021, 01:19 AM	#6722
Jonathan Mac Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Madrid, Spain Posts: 10,897	Originally posted by Alex645 What would a new full frame Pentax do that the current K1ii doesn't? There are a LOT of people that would be interested and buy into a full frame 35mm SLR IF used new glass currently on the market. However, the fear of obsolescence is strong. Given the reality of the world today, a K1ii and a used MZ-S is the answer. Or with a big budget, why not the 645Z and a 645Nii? I would say that the 67II is the absolute king of Pentax film cameras rather than the 645N II - go big or go home, as they say Originally posted by TheBeav I really would be interested in a full frame Pentax if they release a new version. I would like to get the body and 3 lenses. There are four FA Limiteds now, not three

12-01-2021, 01:32 AM	#6723
HoutHans Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Appingedam Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,119	Originally posted by Lord Lucan I think things must have changed with digital. I was in a photographic club in the film era and I remember only two occasions when the subject of camera brand came up. One was when a member showed us his retirement gift of a Leica rangefinder in a presentation case. The other was a talk by the photographer from our local paper who told of his experiences and showed us his kit (a Nikon F3) and I remember thinking it did not seem to do anything my Pentax LX couldn't. I honestly never noticed what brand cameras the other club members were using. We talked instead about what film we were using and what processing (or processor) we used. Ironically, we were called a "camera club" in our title. Since digital, it happens that I have never been with any group of photo enthusiast. I did recently show my K-1 to a friend who is vaguely interested - at least he does not use a phone camera. I think he was non-plussed by it and his main comment was how big and heavy it was. His camera is small, I believe a 1" sensor type. I think you're right about things having changed with digital. As rhe technology grew more capable there were more things/metrics by which one camera (brand) could distinguish itself from all others. In film you'd basically have shutter speeds, metering and that's about it. Nowadays the list is endless (don't get me started on the megapixels), and various comparison sites make it about the metrics, given that is ultimately for a lot of people the justification they need to buy gear. Having purchased a shiny new (and expensive) camera, it makes perfect sense to want to distinguish that thing from all other things, so the discussion is likely to be about the things, not so much what is produced with it.

12-01-2021, 01:37 AM - 1 Like	#6724
richard0170 Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2017 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,032	Originally posted by DamienW Wouldn't mind me a 645Z some day. Have had the GAS for the system for a while, but never got as far as stumping up the cash. I seriously thought about upgrading to one recently. I bottled out though and went for K1 ii instead, sold on my Bronica ETRsi outfit and got a SQ-A one for an enhanced MF experience. It is not just the cost of the camera and the lenses I would need but also having to upgrade all my computer equipment to actually appreciate what the camera is capable of. And I really do not care for computer stuff much. Otherwise for slow considered work the 645Z does seem to be the best option out there. TBH though I am still blown away by the improvement in IQ the K1 brings over my KP and K3. I find it's not a resolution thing as such but the way the tones seem to melt together much more nicely and the colours require less processing for my optimal taste. I often find I am turning the saturation down rather than up with the K1.

12-01-2021, 01:38 AM - 1 Like	#6725
Cerebum Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2017 Location: Lancaster Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,828	Originally posted by Alex645 What would a new full frame Pentax do that the current K1ii doesn't? There are a LOT of people that would be interested and buy into a full frame 35mm SLR IF used new glass currently on the market. However, the fear of obsolescence is strong. Given the reality of the world today, a K1ii and a used MZ-S is the answer. Or with a big budget, why not the 645Z and a 645Nii? Sometimes people just want "new", even if the improvements are minimal.

12-01-2021, 02:01 AM	#6726
richard0170 Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2017 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,032	Originally posted by Alex645 What would a new full frame Pentax do that the current K1ii doesn't? The K1 ii despite its wonderful ergonomics and engineering is heavy and bulky. It has a high MP count and the AF is relatively primitive. I held back on getting one for several years (I succumbed in October, and am exceedingly happy with it) for the first 2 of these reasons. I use almost exclusively MF on my Pentax stuff now so personally not so worried about AF performance. Mine is almost always used on a tripod for slow considered shooting to get the most out of the sensor. Used in this way it is a joy. As a walk about camera though I find it not so much so. I believe there is a case for a compact FF camera of the KP style with a lower MP count and improved AF which would be a low light beast. Not going to happen of course as Ricoh would never sell enough to get a return on the investment. Had Ricoh introduced such a camera back in 2016 as a rival to Nikon's D750 or Canon's 6D instead of the K1, I would have purchased such a machine a long time ago. But then, I would not have purchased my KP. Did Ricoh make the right commercial decisions back then? Who knows. What I do know is that I am very happy with having both the KP and K1 ii. Horses for courses really.

12-01-2021, 10:37 AM	#6727
Alex645 Site Supporter Join Date: May 2015 Location: Kaneohe, HI Photos: Albums Posts: 3,526	Originally posted by Jonathan Mac I would say that the 67II is the absolute king of Pentax film cameras rather than the 645N II - go big or go home, as they say Originally posted by richard0170 The K1 ii despite its wonderful ergonomics and engineering is heavy and bulky. It has a high MP count and the AF is relatively primitive. I held back on getting one for several years (I succumbed in October, and am exceedingly happy with it) for the first 2 of these reasons. I @JM: To paraphrase @richard, despite the 67II being the film size Pentax king, for me it is too heavy and bulky for all day street photography or a long hike in nature. And although the auto focus on the 645Nii is basic, the 67II is manual focus only. I also paired the 645Nii and the 645Z because they can share lenses which the OP mentioned as the preferred set up. ---------- Post added 12-01-21 at 11:46 AM ---------- Originally posted by Cerebum Sometimes people just want "new", even if the improvements are minimal. Well the K1ii is still manufactured and sold as new, even though it's nearly 4 years since it's release. Only three other FF DSLRs are newer; one from Canon and two from Nikon. Unfortunately for those of us that still shoot film, the last 35mm SLR new was the Nikon F6, and although I fantasize that an updated Pentax MZ-S or even LX would be made again, it would have to be the pet project for something like AmazonBasics and probably wouldn't have a Pentax mount. There are also many examples when 'new' was a downgrade. Last edited by Alex645; 12-01-2021 at 10:49 AM.

12-02-2021, 11:05 AM	#6728
ehrwien Site Supporter Join Date: May 2016 Posts: 2,782	Originally posted by Jonathan Mac There are four FA Limiteds now, not three Well actually the fourth one is a D FA Limited lens. I guess the D is supposed to make a difference, at least to the designers and/or marketing people at Pentax D FA Limited \| PENTAX Limited Lens Special Site \| RICOH IMAGING

12-02-2021, 12:20 PM	#6729
Mikesul Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 7,594	Originally posted by ehrwien Well actually the fourth one is a D FA Limited lens. I guess the D is supposed to make a difference, at least to the designers and/or marketing people at Pentax D FA Limited \| PENTAX Limited Lens Special Site \| RICOH IMAGING Yes. It was designed for digital so D.

12-02-2021, 12:59 PM	#6730
kiwi_jono Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Christchurch, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,437	Well I know there are a few New Zealanders on these forums but I'm struggling remember the last time I came face to face with another Pentaxian. I think it might have been 3 years ago when I was buying a second hand lens locally. But that said the number of people wondering around with DSLRs (or SLRs) has diminished significantly in recent years, as mobile phone cameras have improved greatly and are good enough for most uses.

12-03-2021, 01:57 AM	#6731
beachgardener Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,842	Not seen a fellow Pentaxian around my neck of the woods for some time now, maybe soon

12-04-2021, 08:14 PM	#6733
BeeShooter Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2021 Location: Oregon Posts: 36	Originally posted by totsmuyco Went out for a shoot for 2 consecutive Saturdays, last week and today. I was the only one with a camera. So maybe we can say they (canikonyfu) are kinda rare during Saturdays and Pentax isn't that rare as a Pentax camera is roaming around the city. That's a great point! I see more Bufflehead ducks than I do canikonsofu.

12-05-2021, 02:48 AM	#6734
house Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 3,306	The pandemic has, despite no lockdowns and few restrictions, meant reduced time in crowds. So I've seen less cameras than ususal. Very locally there are a couple of Fujis regularly on the street. A M43 shooter, I can't tell the brand. I've seen tourists with 5D's and a few R's. Strangely very few Sony's recently.

12-05-2021, 09:22 AM	#6735
swanlefitte Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Location: Minneapolis Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,068	I am in wild parks and I have seen 7 other slrs this year plus a few wedding photoshoots. One is my friends olympus. 2 more are also nature photographers I exchange info on where things are. The other 4 were portrait photographers. Only once was I asked about my camera but lenses and how they help and hinder comes up.