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08-17-2010, 06:56 PM   #1
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Is my wife's Nikon P&S Really Better than my K10D?

Just got back from a weekend visit to MD. Took some shots on Sat = bright and sunny, and Sun = gray overcast. Took some at the same time and same subject as Mrs. yustr did with her new Nikon S6000 P&S. And upon downloading back home her's look better. More vibrant both color and contrast. Sharper too. Her's done in various auto mode JBGs, mine in RAW. Exposures are fine there's just no punch to them.

I'm guessing its my lens (kit 18-55, Promaster (Tamron) 70-300 and Sigma 28-70.

Somebody help before I put the whole kit up for sale and get a E-PL1

08-17-2010, 07:07 PM   #2
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We'd like to see some sample images out of your K10D first.

My guess is it's certainly not the camera. I've seen some great photos come out of the K10D. I think it's best if you picked up a tutorial on basic post production or stick with a point and shoot.

Last edited by hangu; 08-17-2010 at 07:10 PM. Reason: got mixed up with the ist dl thread (thought I clicked on that)
08-17-2010, 07:09 PM   #3
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Nothing wrong with your K10D.

Remember that your K10D could be set to neutral and not vibrant. Also check the contract, saturation, sharpness and other parameters. And check the same things on the Nikon.

Remember that P&S cameras usually have some of these parameters set to higher values so the JPGs straight out of the camera have more punch.

If you change the K10D's settings you should be able to get equally punchy JPGs compared to the Nikon P&S.

Regards

Chris Stone
08-17-2010, 07:10 PM   #4
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This has been talked about before, you can set your DSLR's jpgs to look great out of the camera. The big difference between a P&S and DSLR is the control of DOF. Really any camera can take great photos... P&S are preferred because no PP is usually needed... but in difficult settings and when you need to crop or blow up a photo bigger than 8x10 the DLSR will shine...

08-17-2010, 07:13 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by yustr Quote
Just got back from a weekend visit to MD. Took some shots on Sat = bright and sunny, and Sun = gray overcast. Took some at the same time and same subject as Mrs. yustr did with her new Nikon S6000 P&S. And upon downloading back home her's look better. More vibrant both color and contrast. Sharper too. Her's done in various auto mode JBGs, mine in RAW. Exposures are fine there's just no punch to them.

I'm guessing its my lens (kit 18-55, Promaster (Tamron) 70-300 and Sigma 28-70.

Somebody help before I put the whole kit up for sale and get a E-PL1
Remember that p&s cameras tend to oversaturate their images to make them "punchy" You can easily do that in post processing as well and they will be much sharper than the p&s, just make equivalent pictures from both cameras and make them 100% size. Your Raw images should be sharper than her p&s now. If they aren't it's not the camera. It takes time to learn your equipment. You can just walk out and "snap" a picture. your lens has alot to do with it also. The better the lens the better the image usually. Its also about how you frame the shot, what lens, etc. The good thing about RAW is that you can have those punchy "live" pictures by increasing the contrast and saturating your pictures more. Remember it takes time and patience.

theperception2008
08-17-2010, 08:24 PM   #6
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The OP said he was shooting in RAW, so it has nothing to do with the camera settings and everything to do with the software he is using for PP.

yustr: Can you please tell us more about what you are using to process your RAW files?
08-17-2010, 09:07 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by yustr Quote
Just got back from a weekend visit to MD. Took some shots on Sat = bright and sunny, and Sun = gray overcast. Took some at the same time and same subject as Mrs. yustr did with her new Nikon S6000 P&S. And upon downloading back home her's look better. More vibrant both color and contrast. Sharper too. Her's done in various auto mode JBGs, mine in RAW. Exposures are fine there's just no punch to them.

I'm guessing its my lens (kit 18-55, Promaster (Tamron) 70-300 and Sigma 28-70.

Somebody help before I put the whole kit up for sale and get a E-PL1
Ah dude, this is normal. Point and shoot output is processed-up all punchy, sharp, and ready-to-view. My wife outshoots me sometime with her little Canon, and she does it all effortlessly, while I change lens after lens, and suffer through the most complicated post-processing. Believe me it annoys the hell out of me.

Also, is it possible your wife might just be a better photographer than you!!? My wife has certainly outshot me many times. It's a humbling experience for us SLR owners, but it certainly happens. Give her some credit.

Last edited by jeff knight; 08-17-2010 at 09:12 PM.
08-17-2010, 09:52 PM   #8
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As mentioned, posting pictures would help, but differences in contrast & saturation / "image tone" are probably part of it. Her possibly having an especially good eye might be part of it it too.

But FWIW, when taking shanshots outdoors in good light, your K10D shouldn't be expected to be any better than a P&S. But see how well her P&S does in settings where, for instance, you are trying to shoot in low light without flash. Or when you want a shallow DOF.

08-17-2010, 10:57 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by yustr Quote
Just got back from a weekend visit to MD. Took some shots on Sat = bright and sunny, and Sun = gray overcast. Took some at the same time and same subject as Mrs. yustr did with her new Nikon S6000 P&S. And upon downloading back home her's look better. More vibrant both color and contrast. Sharper too. Her's done in various auto mode JBGs, mine in RAW. Exposures are fine there's just no punch to them.

I'm guessing its my lens (kit 18-55, Promaster (Tamron) 70-300 and Sigma 28-70.

Somebody help before I put the whole kit up for sale and get a E-PL1
First of all, Welcome aboard.

Second, if you think that selling the camera and buying a different one is going to change things that much, go for it.

Now that my rude and snarky comment is out of the way (hope you're still reading), Comparing RAW files to camera processed JPGs is rather pointless. If you want your photos to have snap, crackle, and pop, you have to provide it in post processing. Camera settings mean nothing when it comes to the RAW files. Only when the camera generates the JPG will it matter.

The K10d, in my experience, Always underexposes some. Personally, I like it that way because it always helped me avoid blowing the highlights. I always left mine at Natural for in camera JPG processing because, if the colors aren't bright, plastic, and over saturated, then I didn't want them captured that way. I think I'm alone in that respect though.

As for sharpness, I never was very impressed with the K10d Kit lens. So unimpressed in fact that I sold mine a couple weeks after getting the camera (which meant I could no longer return the kit). With the Promaster however, if it is in fact a Tamron equivalent, you should be able to get a decent photo...



I don't know anything about the Sigma..

I'll guess that you already know the advantages of an SLR over a P&S so I won't bore you with listing them out (and I believe the list is long). However, let's see a point and shoot do this... (composition problems aside)..



or this..



All done with a K10d (bottom two with an FA31 Limited)

None of the above isn't anything anyone else hasn't already said, here's another. It would help us help you if we could See what your issues were. Post some examples.

08-18-2010, 12:04 AM   #10
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If you could show picture of the same thing from the same place for both cameras... then we can see.
Anyway, as others have said, if you don't do the magic in PPing, the raws will be not all that interesting. Although it all depends on exposure and lens used. Anyway, compare P&S and DSLR is not all that fair IMO, as P&S cameras are tuned to deliver bright, punchy pics to appeal. DSLRs on the other side go more for the "real thing" in my experience.

my 2p
08-18-2010, 12:13 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by yustr Quote
Just got back from a weekend visit to MD. Took some shots on Sat = bright and sunny, and Sun = gray overcast. Took some at the same time and same subject as Mrs. yustr did with her new Nikon S6000 P&S. And upon downloading back home her's look better. More vibrant both color and contrast. Sharper too. Her's done in various auto mode JBGs, mine in RAW. Exposures are fine there's just no punch to them.

I'm guessing its my lens (kit 18-55, Promaster (Tamron) 70-300 and Sigma 28-70.

Somebody help before I put the whole kit up for sale and get a E-PL1

If you want punchy pics then shoot in JPEG and set color and sharpness to +2 and contrast to +1. I do not recommend "bright mode" with these settings, so stick to "normal mode".

Kind regards
.lars
08-18-2010, 12:39 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by yustr Quote
Just got back from a weekend visit to MD. Took some shots on Sat = bright and sunny, and Sun = gray overcast. Took some at the same time and same subject as Mrs. yustr did with her new Nikon S6000 P&S. And upon downloading back home her's look better. More vibrant both color and contrast. Sharper too. Her's done in various auto mode JBGs, mine in RAW. Exposures are fine there's just no punch to them.

I'm guessing its my lens (kit 18-55, Promaster (Tamron) 70-300 and Sigma 28-70.

Somebody help before I put the whole kit up for sale and get a E-PL1
This ia a shot by my friend using my K10D and the kit lens, and he is a P&S user .

08-18-2010, 12:47 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ken T Quote
This ia a shot by my friend using my K10D and the kit lens, and he is a P&S user .
Back in my P&S days, I found it very difficult to get any texture detail in a yellow (or red) flower at all. Nicely done.

08-18-2010, 01:28 AM   #14
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Dear OP,

+1 on all who said that P&S deliver more attractive images in bright light because then the f is probably at least 8, those little noisy sensors have a great amount of light to work with and the settings are made that way, to make reality more "attractive"

On the other hand, the P&S could not handle DOF, wide angles, high ISO, fast operation and focusing and so on..

So, if you use your K10 D as a P&S, the "real" P&S would probably deliver better. If you take advantage of DSLR superior features, then the P&S would not be even there to compare.

My 2c.
08-18-2010, 01:37 AM   #15
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As some posters have mentioned, the OP says his pictures were taken in raw, but he has not told us how he is processing them.

The raw file without any adjustments is flat, lacking vibrancy, and unsharp. Raw files need to be processed.
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