*istD vs K7

**eccs19** · 09-11-2010, 06:34 AM

My father has been bugging me to take some side by side pictures between the 2 cameras to see the difference. I finally got off my butt and did a unscientific study.

I started with the K7, set both cameras to manual and RAW. Both shots took with my Magnicon 70-210. I picked something in the middle of the zoom range of the lens, and used same F stop, zoom, focusing distance, shutter speed, tripod, timed shutter release etc, to try to get both cameras to take the same shot. My framing on both shots was off somewhat, but I was rushing to make sure lighting didn't change. I imported pictures out of camera into LR. Both imported with same treatments and WB set to Daylight, then crop of both pictures. K7 is first.

K7

*istD

K7 crop

*istD crop

amoringello · 09-11-2010, 07:27 AM

Out of context, I cannot tell which is more realistic.
Although from my own experience with both cameras, I personally like the color produced by the K7 more than from the istD.

**Ex Finn.** · 09-11-2010, 07:58 AM

Fun comparison, both take nice images.

Cheers, Mike.

**eccs19** · 09-11-2010, 08:18 AM

Originally posted by amoringello

Out of context, I cannot tell which is more realistic.
Although from my own experience with both cameras, I personally like the color produced by the K7 more than from the istD.

I would have to agree about the colors being better on the K7. Looking out the window at the scene I took, the K7 colors are more realistic.

Blue · 09-11-2010, 08:42 AM

Originally posted by eccs19

I would have to agree about the colors being better on the K7. Looking out the window at the scene I took, the K7 colors are more realistic.

Is that because of the actual sensor or the internal camera settings?

paperbag846 · 09-11-2010, 11:32 AM

It's likely the sensor, given that he shot raw and zeroed all of the colour related settings. You made the custom image settings equal, right?

séamuis · 09-11-2010, 11:35 AM

its the sensor and/or the algorithms Pentax used in the istD. I have both cameras myself (still love the istD very much) and ive done the same type of comparison.

tibbitts · 09-11-2010, 11:36 AM

While I like the k7 version better, I think it would be interesting to:

1. try to use PP to make them as similar as possible - in terms of whatever you think "looks good."

2. post the result at the same size, so the istD image would be at 100% and the k7 at whatever lower percentage it would have to be at to make that same image size.

While it's convenient to have the raw output look closer to the end result you want, what really matters is being able to somehow wind up with the desired result.

Paul

**eccs19** · 09-11-2010, 12:54 PM

Originally posted by paperbag846

It's likely the sensor, given that he shot raw and zeroed all of the colour related settings. You made the custom image settings equal, right?

That is correct. I imported both pictures, then just to be sure, I synced them in LR. Only change I did was White balance. (set to sunny on both)

**eccs19** · 09-11-2010, 12:57 PM

Originally posted by tibbitts

While I like the k7 version better, I think it would be interesting to:

1. try to use PP to make them as similar as possible - in terms of whatever you think "looks good."

2. post the result at the same size, so the istD image would be at 100% and the k7 at whatever lower percentage it would have to be at to make that same image size.

While it's convenient to have the raw output look closer to the end result you want, what really matters is being able to somehow wind up with the desired result.

Paul

I have no doubt that I could get the *istD picture to look like the K7 picture within LR, as I've done lots of pictures with the old camera, and was very pleased with the results. I just wanted to make sure I was comparing apples to apples for this purpose. I think the only thing I wouldn't be able to bring up to the K7 level would be the details in the spruce tree, so you could see the spines in it. Just not enough detail there to recover.

jeffkrol · 09-11-2010, 02:47 PM

Originally posted by eccs19

That is correct. I imported both pictures, then just to be sure, I synced them in LR. Only change I did was White balance. (set to sunny on both)

Color balance can be changed by what each camera multiplies the channels by.. ie RGB have different multipliers based on the camera model.....so using a "daylight" WB does not assume equivalence...
I generally believe the only way to "color" a sensor is the dyes used in the RGGB matrix overlay (which I doubt change that much) .. the other "color characteristics" (excluding lens) is all software voodoo.....

09-11-2010, 06:34 AM	#1
eccs19 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Lisle, Ontario Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,510	istD vs K7 My father has been bugging me to take some side by side pictures between the 2 cameras to see the difference. I finally got off my butt and did a unscientific study. I started with the K7, set both cameras to manual and RAW. Both shots took with my Magnicon 70-210. I picked something in the middle of the zoom range of the lens, and used same F stop, zoom, focusing distance, shutter speed, tripod, timed shutter release etc, to try to get both cameras to take the same shot. My framing on both shots was off somewhat, but I was rushing to make sure lighting didn't change. I imported pictures out of camera into LR. Both imported with same treatments and WB set to Daylight, then crop of both pictures. K7 is first. K7 istD K7 crop *istD crop

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09-11-2010, 07:27 AM	#2
amoringello Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Virginia, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,562	Out of context, I cannot tell which is more realistic. Although from my own experience with both cameras, I personally like the color produced by the K7 more than from the istD.

09-11-2010, 07:58 AM	#3
Ex Finn. Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Southern Maryland. Espoo. Kouvola. Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,975	Fun comparison, both take nice images. Cheers, Mike.

09-11-2010, 08:18 AM	#4
eccs19 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Lisle, Ontario Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,510 Original Poster	Originally posted by amoringello Out of context, I cannot tell which is more realistic. Although from my own experience with both cameras, I personally like the color produced by the K7 more than from the istD. I would have to agree about the colors being better on the K7. Looking out the window at the scene I took, the K7 colors are more realistic.

09-11-2010, 08:42 AM	#5
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	Originally posted by eccs19 I would have to agree about the colors being better on the K7. Looking out the window at the scene I took, the K7 colors are more realistic. Is that because of the actual sensor or the internal camera settings?

09-11-2010, 11:32 AM	#6
paperbag846 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,395	It's likely the sensor, given that he shot raw and zeroed all of the colour related settings. You made the custom image settings equal, right?

09-11-2010, 11:35 AM	#7
séamuis Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Savannah, U.S./Baguio City, P.H. Posts: 5,979	its the sensor and/or the algorithms Pentax used in the istD. I have both cameras myself (still love the istD very much) and ive done the same type of comparison.

09-11-2010, 11:36 AM	#8
tibbitts Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Oklahoma USA Posts: 2,193	While I like the k7 version better, I think it would be interesting to: 1. try to use PP to make them as similar as possible - in terms of whatever you think "looks good." 2. post the result at the same size, so the istD image would be at 100% and the k7 at whatever lower percentage it would have to be at to make that same image size. While it's convenient to have the raw output look closer to the end result you want, what really matters is being able to somehow wind up with the desired result. Paul

09-11-2010, 12:54 PM	#9
eccs19 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Lisle, Ontario Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,510 Original Poster	Originally posted by paperbag846 It's likely the sensor, given that he shot raw and zeroed all of the colour related settings. You made the custom image settings equal, right? That is correct. I imported both pictures, then just to be sure, I synced them in LR. Only change I did was White balance. (set to sunny on both)

09-11-2010, 12:57 PM	#10
eccs19 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Lisle, Ontario Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,510 Original Poster	Originally posted by tibbitts While I like the k7 version better, I think it would be interesting to: 1. try to use PP to make them as similar as possible - in terms of whatever you think "looks good." 2. post the result at the same size, so the istD image would be at 100% and the k7 at whatever lower percentage it would have to be at to make that same image size. While it's convenient to have the raw output look closer to the end result you want, what really matters is being able to somehow wind up with the desired result. Paul I have no doubt that I could get the *istD picture to look like the K7 picture within LR, as I've done lots of pictures with the old camera, and was very pleased with the results. I just wanted to make sure I was comparing apples to apples for this purpose. I think the only thing I wouldn't be able to bring up to the K7 level would be the details in the spruce tree, so you could see the spines in it. Just not enough detail there to recover.

09-11-2010, 02:47 PM	#11
jeffkrol Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wisconsin USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,434	Originally posted by eccs19 That is correct. I imported both pictures, then just to be sure, I synced them in LR. Only change I did was White balance. (set to sunny on both) Color balance can be changed by what each camera multiplies the channels by.. ie RGB have different multipliers based on the camera model.....so using a "daylight" WB does not assume equivalence... I generally believe the only way to "color" a sensor is the dyes used in the RGGB matrix overlay (which I doubt change that much) .. the other "color characteristics" (excluding lens) is all software voodoo.....