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09-22-2010, 10:31 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by knoxploration Quote

It's not that Pentax couldn't include the feature -- indeed, the K-7 had a basic version of in-movie AF with its early prototype firmware. For whatever reason they've either decided that they haven't yet been able implement it well enough, can't do so well enough for hardware reasons, or don't feel it would be a smart return on their development investment. Only they know which of the above applies.

Ok, I have a video camera I am using for my video shots, I haven't used video except 5-6 try-outs with my K-7, and I am against the video on such a photo camera.

My experience tells me practically video without AF is useless for me, I have +1 astigmatism and I can't see LCD well without glasses. I don't think a perfect eye can use the manual focus during the video shot, deciding between the composition and the focus gives blurry segments and I believe no-one can be fast enough to make both at the same time , because sometimes you turn the ring to wrong side, go completely out-of-focus then come back again, then there we have a blurry segment again. Not to mention very slight movements on focusing ring changes focused area drastically with DA lenses, very easy to fall into -out of focus- area with one touch. For instance my try with FA 28-105 was horrible, no focus at all. But I've got better shots with DA 16-45.

My only solution was using a wide angle lens to get maximum DOF but it was far from perfect. I guess only infinity shots would be perfect without AF. Pentax shouldn't put the video feature if it can't handle the AF.

Well in fact I hope that I am wrong for the sake of the video shooters with a photo camera..

09-22-2010, 11:00 PM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by cbaytan Quote
I don't think a perfect eye can use the manual focus during the video shot, deciding between the composition and the focus gives blurry segments and I believe no-one can be fast enough to make both at the same time , because sometimes you turn the ring to wrong side, go completely out-of-focus then come back again, then there we have a blurry segment again.
Hollywood would like to disagree with you. ;-)

Seriously, though -- no, pulling focus manually isn't easy. Yes, it *is* possible for some people, with adequate practice. I'm not one of them, incidentally. There's also a lot that can be done in setting up a shot to minimize the need to adjust focus, and/or allow you to practice the focus adjustment needed ahead of time. And like you note yourself, selecting lenses and apertures with greater depth of field can help, although then you lose some of that filmic look that has many people angling for DSLR video in the first place.

Problem is, for typical consumer snapshot video -- your kids running around with the pet dog in a field -- you can't practice the shot ahead of time, you can't set up the shot to avoid having to change focus much, and you can only do so much in less than perfect light to control depth of field. So for consumers, DSLRs are perhaps more of a challenge video-wise than they are for pros who know what they're doing, and can work around the limitations.

I've seen some beautiful stuff shot with the K-7, so it's unquestionably capable of it. I'd expect the K-5 to be as good or better. That, for me, says the feature belongs there even if I personally don't have the skills to take advantage of it.
09-22-2010, 11:26 PM   #18
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I've yet to see a Video-capable dSLR which does a decent continuous AF (maybe there are).

So while the reaction may be "Ooo...the K-5 doesn't do Video AF", those dSLRs which do so on paper specs. mostly don't make a good job of it.
I'm not sure which is worse - no Video AF, or a dodgy implementation , which is mostly what's on the market right now.
09-23-2010, 12:26 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by knoxploration Quote
Hollywood would like to disagree with you. ;-)

Seriously, though -- no, pulling focus manually isn't easy. Yes, it *is* possible for some people, with adequate practice. I'm not one of them, incidentally...........
I've seen some beautiful stuff shot with the K-7, so it's unquestionably capable of it.
Yes, your statement speaks for itself, we've all seen good shots with K-7, so some people can use it, but we both can't. So my question was how many, or how many percent people can use it effectively as video feature as intended, without the AF? Especially when you need to be real quick to catch instantaneous situations.

In a partly cloudy garden shot, I put my best glasses on, which gives me a better vision than my eyes were real young, t was impossible to tell if I am focused right or not with that 3" LCD. Maybe if K-7 had a tilt LCD screen I could manage better focusing without flare-ups and backlight.. Maybe.

Still, I think video would be useful, when unforgettable moments caught you up and your K7 or K5 is handy, -if- it had AF option.

09-23-2010, 01:07 AM   #20
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Let me clear this up. The main concern is the need to change focus during the video shoot. You do get the AF before the video start, right? For my needs anyways, I don't really need AF during video all the time; especially with a bit of planning ahead. Unless you are talking about running kids, you should be able to capture those "unforgettable moments" majority of the time with K-5.

IS/SR is much more important to me. And the ability to have IS/SR when taking video with wide/standard prime lens is a huge advantage for K-5; and the lack of IS/SR with wide/standard prime is a major flaw with D7000. Hand held video without IS/SR is simply not acceptable to me.

QuoteOriginally posted by cbaytan Quote
Yes, your statement speaks for itself, we've all seen good shots with K-7, so some people can use it, but we both can't. So my question was how many, or how many percent people can use it effectively as video feature as intended, without the AF? Especially when you need to be real quick to catch instantaneous situations.
In a partly cloudy garden shot, I put my best glasses on, which gives me a better vision than my eyes were real young, t was impossible to tell if I am focused right or not with that 3" LCD. Maybe if K-7 had a tilt LCD screen I could manage better focusing without flare-ups and backlight.. Maybe.
Still, I think video would be useful, when unforgettable moments caught you up and your K7 or K5 is handy, -if- it had AF option.
09-23-2010, 01:21 AM   #21
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In a German press release
Pentax-Flaggschiff K-5 | photoscala
there is a sentence translated by Google to:
"The video function with autofocus now provides full-HD quality at 1920x1080 pixels in 16:9 format at 25 B / sec."

But, who knows???
09-23-2010, 01:46 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by nosnoop Quote
Let me clear this up. The main concern is the need to change focus during the video shoot. You do get the AF before the video start, right? For my needs anyways, I don't really need AF during video all the time; especially with a bit of planning ahead. Unless you are talking about running kids, you should be able to capture those "unforgettable moments" majority of the time with K-5.
Most of the time, yes, I completely agree with you but I have an irresistible feeling to bug readers:

Imagine a baby trying to say a new word she just learned, and you are trying to focus her mouth with only 3 teethies and wet lips, and you turn to focus on the wrong way, argh!

Sorry,I know this emotional abuse was unnecessary.
09-23-2010, 03:54 AM   #23
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Auto focus with a DSLR in video mode is probably going to be clunky to say the least. At the same time, it isn't hard to prefocus and then make fine adjustments. In bright situations, you can stop way down to f16 and use huge depth of field, like camcorders have, to benefit you. I can't imagine being in your yard, having your kids and dog running around and constantly having your focus point changing, getting blurry off and on. I do use my K7 to take video of my kids and really haven't had any trouble with it.

09-23-2010, 04:08 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by shady Quote
What am I missing?
3 things:

Bokeh,the image quality of the expensive glass, and low light capabilities.

All prosumer camcorders suck in average to low light.
09-23-2010, 04:12 AM   #25
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These bodies have full HD video with AF.....look clunky to you?

- D7000
- D7000
- A55
- D3100

The Panasonic GH1 and GH2 also feature AF and HD video....if the technology is there and has been there for more than just a few months, why sell yourself short?


Jason
09-23-2010, 05:27 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jasvox Quote
These bodies have full HD video with AF.....look clunky to you?


The Panasonic GH1 and GH2 also feature AF and HD video....if the technology is there and has been there for more than just a few months, why sell yourself short?


Jason
I have a hard time telling much from these videos. I don't actually see much real auto focus in the D7000 videos. A lot of it is shot with small apertures in good lighting situations and so the need to auto focus is pretty minimal. The editing has been done in such a way to eliminate a lot of the focusing transition points as well.

I do think that Pentax should include the option for auto focus in video, but particularly with screw driven lenses, seems like there could some negatives to using it.
09-23-2010, 06:21 AM   #27
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I'm sorry, none of the Sony and Nikon videos showcase any continuous AF capability.
The camera wasn't tracking anything that was changing in focus distance to any large extent.
The one example in bright sunlight was done with a deep DOF - again no real test of continuous AF.

The models which I've tried out ARE clunky in continuous AF.
09-23-2010, 07:53 AM   #28
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Look more closely, on several of these examples (especially the second video, shot at night or in dark ambient lighting) you can tell the AF is working and working quite well in my opinion. I bet you the dollars in my pocket that if AF was disabled and same footage was shot, you'd see a heck of a difference. For anyone who has either dabbled or shoots regularly video in a non AF DSLR for video, an able AF option is very welcome. Sure you can disable AF if you want those trendy shallow depth focal changes, but for most other shooting, a good working AF makes shooting video much more inviting and a positive feature to have in our camera bodies.

For purists or those convinced AF is a gimmick or whatnot, time will tell. It's just a shame, in my opinion, Pentax has been slow (failed to) to add this feature since it is touting a new AF system in the SAFOX IX.

Jason
09-23-2010, 10:30 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jasvox Quote
These bodies have full HD video with AF.....look clunky to you?
The Panasonic GH1 and GH2 also feature AF and HD video....if the technology is there and has been there for more than just a few months, why sell yourself short?
We are talking about DSLRs not EVIL.
Nikon is ahead in this area, no doubt. But I would reserve my judgement until I can try it out myself. And I feel that you need dedicated video lens to get the best results.
09-23-2010, 11:16 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by shady Quote
I never understood why anybody is putting up with the limitations and workarounds of a DSLR for video if the objective is over and beyond shooting a casual video clip. Video cameras are available plentiful at reasonable prices and do a much better job. They don't overheat, they do autofocus, they allow manual exposure control, and they handle more conveniently for video than a DSLR. And HD video requires just about 2 MP. What am I missing?

An entire industry has sprung up offering gadgets helping you to overcome the deficiencies of a DSLR as a video camera. This is one of my favorites LOL:
I use my Panasonic HDC-TM700 3MOS camcorder for most of my home videos since it could shoot 1080p @60fps that is not available from any DSLR and has a F1.5 Leica lens that I use in the 35-630mm (35mm eqiv) range handheld with active OIS. But for extreme wide angle or extreme telephoto I use my K-7 for HD video. I plan on getting the K-5 for better low light 1080p HD video with my K mount lenses from 6.5mm to 2350mm.
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