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10-04-2010, 03:43 PM   #61
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Hi Raylon,

You are making me laugh hysterically. The fact that we are comparing a $500 to a $1700 camera makes me feel really good about my purchase.

Have a great night!
John

10-04-2010, 03:48 PM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by john5100 Quote
Hi Raylon,

You are making me laugh hysterically. The fact that we are comparing a $500 to a $1700 camera makes me feel really good about my purchase.

Have a great night!
John
Well sorry that I can actually pay attention to an argument. Bringing in the T2i has nothing to do with the conversation on hand.
10-04-2010, 04:06 PM   #63
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QuoteOriginally posted by Raylon Quote
Not a good example. We are comparing the Kx to the 7D, not the much inferior T2i
You're completely wrong.

QuoteOriginally posted by Imaging Resource:
Calling it a "Mini 7D," Canon introduced the Rebel T2i, the highest resolution consumer SLR, and the highest resolution SLR under $900, period. The 7D association comes primarily from Canon's use of an 18-megapixel sensor that Canon say is essentially the same spec as the sensor in the 7D, the only difference being that the readout speed has been cut in half. From there, the Canon T2i shares more with the Rebel T1i than with the 7D.
Therefore, the image example above is as close as we're going to get without a 7D crop.
10-04-2010, 05:45 PM   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by Big G Quote
You're completely wrong.
Essentially the same is not the same as exactly the same. The K-5 and the K-7 are essentially the same camera. I'm sure a few people would freak out when I say that because it now has more FPS and slightly better AF and more MP. I'm sure they would say their is a huge difference. Well, from the research I did when deciding between the 7D and the 550D, the 7D sensor is still superior. I'm done in this thread. It's impossible to convince anyone of anything else because most people on pentax forums think PENTAX IS TEH AWSUM and think Canikon or anything else is too mainstream for them to even consider.

10-04-2010, 06:11 PM   #65
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Raylon
The biggest difference between K-5 & K-7 is Sony sensor vs Samsung sensor. That a huge difference.
My position is each brand have great, good and ok DSLR. I choosen last year the K-X base on MY needs not somebody else needs or dream camera. For me I made a good choice but I could have choosen Nikon or Canon. Anyway all store , I gone to , they push me to buy one of these. But they also have Pentax , I try all of these and I like the feeling of the Pentax more that Canon or Nikon. But any of these camera would have been good for 99% of my photos.
One thing peoples forget on this site is that 99% of the photo if printed will be in 4x6 or will be view on a computer screen without PP and will be taken in auto mode. Why? because 99 % of the photo will be taken at family event , vacation or kids. And for this any new DSLR will do the job.
10-04-2010, 06:30 PM   #66
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QuoteOriginally posted by Raylon Quote
Essentially the same is not the same as exactly the same. The K-5 and the K-7 are essentially the same camera. I'm sure a few people would freak out when I say that because it now has more FPS and slightly better AF and more MP. I'm sure they would say their is a huge difference. Well, from the research I did when deciding between the 7D and the 550D, the 7D sensor is still superior. I'm done in this thread. It's impossible to convince anyone of anything else because most people on pentax forums think PENTAX IS TEH AWSUM and think Canikon or anything else is too mainstream for them to even consider.
That is fine. I think people here are quite honest and reasonably fair, if biased slightly towards Pentax. I think that the difference between the K5 and K7 is likely to be a couple of stops with regard to high iso shooting and to me that is a big deal, to someone else, maybe not so much.

The 7D is a good camera, but it is not perfect in every way and there are plenty of people who would choose a Pentax over it. As others have said and I say again now: "Choose the camera system that best fits your needs." I am glad you are happy with the 7D; however, I wouldn't be. To each his own.
10-04-2010, 07:34 PM   #67
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I added a 7d and a few lenses Tamron 18-270 and 17-55 EFS to the mix with my K7.

Image quality is better on the 7d back to back but it's not dramatic.
AF is why I bought it and it is no contest between the two the 7d is like having instant focus compared to the k7 and DA* lenses. The ring USM lenses are very fast.
Ill let the two systems shake out and probably sell the K7 and pick up a K5 if it can keep up with the 7d otherwise i'll sell my pentax gear. The K5 will likely win in ISO but I highly doubt the AF will be anywhere near the 7d as it's very fast esp in servo compared to AF-C on the K7. The 7d is great up to 6400 ISO which is plenty for my needs. The SDM on the DA* may be the limiting factor for the K5 AF as they are just kinda slow even if they don't hunt as well as sometimes they just don't seem to react. I had this problem at a Tahitian fire dance and this is what drove me to try the 7d. 85% of my shots were out of focus no matter how I tried and I was forced to use iso 3200-6400 as it was basically not lit other than fire at night.

I'll post a better comparison of the difference for those curious after I have figured out the 7d as the menu and controls are different. It also seems to expose much brighter than the k7 which will take a little getting used to.

I went 7d for action shots as I have had some AF letdowns with my K7 and don't think the K5 will live up to the same standard as the 7d for AF performance while probably besting it in ISO by a small degree.

The movie mode was the other deciding factor as the K5 is basically a K7 with 1080P. The 7d has a superior movie mode letting you control aperture/shutter on the fly as well as a dedicated button to turn it on/off to capture clips without having to turn the dial or start/stop video to change aperture.

The Tamron 18-270 surprised me in quality of the image for a super zoom and should be a convenient casual use lens when I don't feel like carrying a bag.

I did test a 5d and consider it but I don't need the resolution as much as I need the speed and the 7d seems to have no rival anywhere close in price for that.

So three things basically made me switch

AF (faster than K7 and probably K5)
ISO (great to 6400, K5 will probably be par or better)
Movie mode (Better than K7 and K5)


Lee
10-04-2010, 07:37 PM   #68
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The 7D has its crippled functions and blind spots as well...but its a very good camera.
Just as the Pentax makes very good cameras too...

10-04-2010, 08:42 PM   #69
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I agree with what said here. The Canon is excellent and has very good AF but cameras are like shoes, no one shoe fits everyone one the same way or fits every situation. I hope the K5 improve on AF which I know it can. I have a PZ1 film camera and its AF is much faster than my K200d. My KX has better AF than my K200D but for some reason that PZ-1 is really great. Who knows...

Last edited by john5100; 10-04-2010 at 10:42 PM.
10-06-2010, 04:23 AM   #70
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QuoteOriginally posted by Raylon Quote
Essentially the same is not the same as exactly the same. The K-5 and the K-7 are essentially the same camera
Wrong again. I am referring specifically to the crops I posted above around the sensor used, the K-5 and K-7 use a totally different sensor where as the 7D and 550D / T2i use the same sensor.

QuoteOriginally posted by PhotograhpyReview.com:
Canon has a history of incorporating prosumer DSLR features into their entry-level Rebel cameras. The T2i gets the same 18-megapixel APS-C CMOS sensor as the Canon EOS 7D but with a 4-channel “readout” instead of the 7D’s faster 8-channel readout giving the T2i a maximum burst rate of 3.7 frames per second, about half the speed of the 7D. The T2i gets the complete video feature set from the EOS 7D – full HD 1080p video resolution at your choice of 24, 25 or 30 frames per second, or 60 FPS at 720p.
I'm disappointed at the downward trend of credibility on this forum due to the complete misinformation that gets banded around.
10-06-2010, 06:23 AM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by Big G Quote

I'm disappointed at the downward trend of credibility on this forum due to the complete misinformation that gets banded around.
Straight from Canon:

"...The EOS Rebel T2i DSLR features a newly developed 18-million-pixel Canon CMOS imaging sensor..."

See those two words in there, newly developed? That means it's new. Like i said before, just because they are essentially the same sensor doesn't mean they are the same sensor. I wouldn't trust a review site for info like that.
10-06-2010, 08:46 AM   #72
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I still say that these are silly comparisons and we are talking about ridiculous things. We are comparing two wonderful cameras that do a terrific job and acting like they are worlds apart. I defy anyone of you to take a photo that can compare with Ansel Adams (essentially using a wooden box with a lens sticking out) with your new high tech toys.

This is why I say "please" on my first comment. For the first 100 years of photography, they didn't have auto focus or light meters or auto winding. Forget frame rate or high ISO photography and these men and women captured wars, car races, the Olympics, and every other even in recent human history. Surely any camera that we use today will suffice.
10-06-2010, 10:43 AM   #73
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I now own both the 7d and the K7

My 7d has the 17-55 EF-S on it to compare vs the K7 and 16-50 DA*


I am not a very good fanboy so I'll answer anything honestly.


Weather resistance -K7 and DA*. My 7d has no resistant lenses yet. (L glass) as I bought the 17-55 EF-s and a Tamron 18-270 superzoom. The body's are both built very solid with the precise feel going to the canon and the tough feel going to k7. I think k7 has better weather resistance.


ISO- no contest 7d is better. Pictures at 6400 look fine out of the camera on the 7d. K-7 can get ok results but it requires a lot of pp work. I think K5 will be on par or better.

AF- no contest 7d is very fast in comparison, it's almost instant lock. K7 is fine for non sports but 7d is the clear winner. I do not believe that K5 will beat 7d in this aspect but would love to be surprised as I'll replace k7 with it.

Movie mode- 7d is better than the k7 and k5 as you have manual control over shutter/aperture on the fly, no start stop and you have a dedicated button.

Lenses- DA* area steal compared to L glass options. SDM is slow compared with USM. The 17-55 is very fast compared to the 16-50 DA*. Build quality is similar between the two with the DA * having a huge plus in WR and dust. My 16-50 kept dust out successfully. If you need more than 300mm go Canon and bring a lot of cash.


Controls- I'm used to K7 so its a little different. I think Pentax has more depth in options esp in P mode but both are well laid out. I hate that I sometimes shift the shutter speed or the aperture in P mode on the K7. I hate the the 7d has no green button.

Speed- 7d is clear winner over the K7 and 5 if the buffer is not fixed. It even lets you know how many remain in buffer. You can use lower quality with K7 and keep it firing longer though and that trick may be handy for k5.

Image Quality- I played with both some and its a tossup. I think the 7d is a little sharper but the K7 puts out soft images and can be sharpened in pp. Both look good and I doubt the K5 will be anything drastic at ISO 100. They all seem to look good at low ISO. I also tried the 5d but it's AF is slow, movie mode a little clunky and it just feels a little old. The sensor is very nice but if you aren't making large prints it seems overkill. It's also not a great action camera and I have found that all the aircraft pictures I take need a fast AF camera.


Other observations.

I like things made in Japan and I have no rational argument for that I just think they build great stuff. 7d and lens are japan (tamron china though).
I love green mode button, maybe 7d has similar option but I have not discovered it.


Looking forward to how the K5 shakes out and I'll sell my K7 body and probably replace with a K5 if it is better than the 7d in enough aspects (i expect it in ISO).

I would have waited but I am back in Afghanistan and didn't want to deal with the stress of the mail here (one month is typical or it gets lost.)

I want Pentax to hit a home run as competition only gets us better camera's for less and faster.
10-06-2010, 12:03 PM   #74
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QuoteOriginally posted by Raylon Quote
Straight from Canon:

"...The EOS Rebel T2i DSLR features a newly developed 18-million-pixel Canon CMOS imaging sensor..."

See those two words in there, newly developed? That means it's new.
ARRRRRGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!

Yes it's a newly developed sensor!!!!! It's the same new sensor that it's in the EOS 7D!!! Canon didn't make one 18 MP sensor for the 7D then fabricate a completely new one for the 550D, did they!?

Man, I don't mean to be insulting, but you're really not that clever are you? I've really seen it all now, I'm absolutely done with this thread.

Last edited by Bramela; 10-07-2010 at 11:49 AM.
10-06-2010, 12:35 PM   #75
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LeeRunge: keep your head down and be safe in Afghanistan!!

Please see these interesting links.


and this one

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