Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
11-22-2010, 01:45 PM   #1
New Member




Join Date: Nov 2010
Photos: Albums
Posts: 6
New K-7 user w/dumb questions

I just traded in my Canon XSi for the K-7, and so far I'm very happy. One problem, though, is that I seem to be getting a lot more noise in low ISO settings. I tend to shoot existing light or use fluorescent continuous lights (5100k temp). I try to keep the ISO at 400 or below w/a tripod, but it still seems like I'm getting more noise at equivalent settings.

I'm an old-time film guy still getting used to digital, so by no means do I claim to be an expert.

Is this just a low-light thing or do I have some cockeyed settings? Or am I being too picky? Here's a sample at 100% - RAW saved as jpg w/no post.

Also, this is a manual focus so it's soft - that's another problem, for another thread.

EXIF:

Image width : 475
Image height : 468
Make : PENTAX
Model : PENTAX K-7
Orientation of image : 1
X resolution : 72.0 ppi (pixel per inch)
Y resolution : 72.0 ppi (pixel per inch)
Resolution unit : inch
Software : K-7 Ver 1.10
File date and time : 2010:11:07 21:13:39
Artist :
Unknown tag (330) : {103358,103736}
Unknown tag (700) :
Copyright holder :
-- Exif IFD -- :
Exposure time : 1/13 s
F number : 4.5
Exposure program : Manual
ISO speed rating : 200
Date and time of original data generation : 2010:11:07 21:13:39
Date and time of digital data generation : 2010:11:07 21:13:39
Exposure bias : 1.0
Metering mode : Spot
Flash : Flash did not fire, compulsory flash mode.
Lens focal length : 37.5 mm
Sensing method : One-chip color area sensor
Custom image processing : Normal process
Exposure method : Manual exposure
White balance : Manual white balance
Focal length in 35 mm film : 57 mm
Scene capture type : Standard
Contrast : Normal
Saturation : Normal
Sharpness : Hard
Subject distance range : Close view
Make : PENTAX
Model : PENTAX K-7
Orientation of image : 8
Valid image width in pixel : 475
Valid image height in pixel : 468

Attached Images
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX K-7  Photo 
11-22-2010, 02:15 PM   #2
Veteran Member
paperbag846's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2010
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 2,396
That crop looks out of focus, or possibly the model was moving (you shot at 1/13th of a second). The k-7 has low noise at the low ISO's, but if you take the image and brighten it in post, you can increase the noise. I don't see much noise here though... just blur.

Did you push the exposure in post?
11-22-2010, 04:33 PM   #3
Pentaxian
Wheatfield's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The wheatfields of Canada
Posts: 10,158
IIRC, Canon has rather aggressive noise reduction software built into their cameras, and this affects raw as well as jpeg images.
Pentax does not do NR on raw files.
It wouldn't surprise me if the Rebel has a lower base noise either, the sensor in the K7 was never renowned for being especially noiseless at any ISO.
11-22-2010, 06:53 PM   #4
Veteran Member




Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Sacramento, CA
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 728
If you're shooting RAW, try turning off Highlight and Shadow correction in the D-Range Setting.

11-23-2010, 03:17 PM   #5
New Member




Join Date: Nov 2010
Photos: Albums
Posts: 6
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
That crop looks out of focus, or possibly the model was moving (you shot at 1/13th of a second). The k-7 has low noise at the low ISO's, but if you take the image and brighten it in post, you can increase the noise. I don't see much noise here though... just blur.

Did you push the exposure in post?
I think the soft focus is more the result of manual focus/slow shutter. I did push exposure in post, just a bit. I guess the noise seemed heavier in some of the other shots.

I'll try to post some of the others, but for some reason the uploads are glitchy today.
11-23-2010, 03:18 PM   #6
New Member




Join Date: Nov 2010
Photos: Albums
Posts: 6
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by einstrigger Quote
If you're shooting RAW, try turning off Highlight and Shadow correction in the D-Range Setting.
I'll give that a try. Thanks!
11-24-2010, 01:57 AM   #7
hcc
Pentaxian
hcc's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,533
QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
That crop looks out of focus, or possibly the model was moving (you shot at 1/13th of a second). ...
I agree that the crop looks out of focus.

* Was the Image Stabilisation (IS) on ? In the affirmative, you should wait for the Green hand symbol to appear in the Viewfinder before shooting.

The IS takes about 1-3 s to come on (usually 1-2 s).


* What range of ISO was selected ? Most Pentaxians recommend to limit the upper ISO to ISO 1600 or ISO 3200 (mine is set at ISO3200 max).


* Have you tried High ISO Noise reduction? You may be interested to read on thsi topic the work of Adam (our Moderator): {https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-dslr-discussion/106600-k-7-high-iso-success.html}


I hope that the comment will help...

Keep us posted of your results.

Last edited by hcc; 11-24-2010 at 05:35 PM.
11-24-2010, 02:37 PM   #8
Forum Member




Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Seattle, Wash. USA
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 63
Dittos out of focus,

11-24-2010, 07:33 PM   #9
Veteran Member
KJon's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Connecticut, USA
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 542
QuoteOriginally posted by hcc Quote
I agree that the crop looks out of focus.

* Was the Image Stabilisation (IS) on ? In the affirmative, you should wait for the Green hand symbol to appear in the Viewfinder before shooting.

Snipped text
OP made reference to using a tripod. It's my understanding that when using a tripod, IS should be off.

Best to all,
Kevin
11-24-2010, 08:06 PM   #10
Forum Member
fewayne's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Wisconsin
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 84
Just to assuage my own ignorance: What does "RAW saved as jpg" mean? Because it might matter for this topic. Pentax in-camera NR for JPEGs is not as good as some others', and frequently RAW "development" s/w will apply some NR...maybe not. Most of us who care about noise shoot RAW, where the K-7 seems to stand up pretty well against its competition (at least at the lower few steps of its ISO range), and apply NR in post.

Then again if you're an old-time film guy...like, we WORRY about noise? I mean, we can shoot ISO 800 and not have the pix look like somebody tossed bricks on them! I am trying to imagine shooting my old Olympus OM-1 available-light indoors at night, handheld with a 300mm telephoto and getting anything other than a framefull of blur or a picture that looks as if it had been assembled with one of those particle-animation suites. Ain't the digital age grand?
11-24-2010, 08:25 PM   #11
New Member




Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: California
Posts: 7
QuoteOriginally posted by fewayne Quote
Just to assuage my own ignorance: What does "RAW saved as jpg" mean? Because it might matter for this topic. Pentax in-camera NR for JPEGs is not as good as some others', and frequently RAW "development" s/w will apply some NR...maybe not. Most of us who care about noise shoot RAW, where the K-7 seems to stand up pretty well against its competition (at least at the lower few steps of its ISO range), and apply NR in post.

Then again if you're an old-time film guy...like, we WORRY about noise? I mean, we can shoot ISO 800 and not have the pix look like somebody tossed bricks on them! I am trying to imagine shooting my old Olympus OM-1 available-light indoors at night, handheld with a 300mm telephoto and getting anything other than a framefull of blur or a picture that looks as if it had been assembled with one of those particle-animation suites. Ain't the digital age grand?
Amen!
11-25-2010, 12:22 AM   #12
New Member




Join Date: Nov 2010
Photos: Albums
Posts: 6
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by fewayne Quote
Just to assuage my own ignorance: What does "RAW saved as jpg" mean? Because it might matter for this topic. Pentax in-camera NR for JPEGs is not as good as some others', and frequently RAW "development" s/w will apply some NR...maybe not. Most of us who care about noise shoot RAW, where the K-7 seems to stand up pretty well against its competition (at least at the lower few steps of its ISO range), and apply NR in post.
I meant that I shot it as RAW but converted it to jpg to post here.

I agree about the film grain - I used to like having some in my old b/w shots (AE-1 with good ol' TMax 400). For some reason, digital noise just bugs the hell out of me.

Here's another shot from the same session (100% crop), with NR and sharpening. Is that too noisy/artifacty? It seems like it to me...
Attached Images
 
11-25-2010, 05:45 AM   #13
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Budapest
Posts: 821
QuoteOriginally posted by prob01 Quote
Here's another shot from the same session (100% crop), with NR and sharpening. Is that too noisy/artifacty? It seems like it to me...
That doesn't look like noise to me. It reminds me of "maze" demosaicing artifacts and maybe oversharpening. What software did you use for this?
11-25-2010, 07:25 AM   #14
New Member




Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Wrocław/Trzebnica
Posts: 7
two things i'm seeing here (or at least I think so):

1) luminance noise)
2) shake/motion induced blur

==> 1) k-7's sensor is really noisy (mine, at least). The method I use is: RAW + lightroom 3 noise reduction.

==> 2) - is your tripod sturdy, heavy? If not, then use shorter exposures/share reduction + artificial light instead. Or mirror lockup. Still, 1/13 is still going to notice some of the subject's movement.

That, and k-7's AF really, really sucks balls. Really. ; ]

Anyway, my two cents.

EDIT: Also, what lens are you using? Maybe it's just low on MTF/resolution? My Helios f/2.0 58 sure is ; ]
11-26-2010, 12:08 AM   #15
New Member




Join Date: Nov 2010
Photos: Albums
Posts: 6
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by simico Quote
That doesn't look like noise to me. It reminds me of "maze" demosaicing artifacts and maybe oversharpening. What software did you use for this?
I used Topaz DeNoise and smart sharpen.
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
camera, date, dslr, exposure, flash, image, inch, k-7, pentax, photography, pixel, settings, time
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
brand new user questions arrondee Troubleshooting and Beginner Help 4 09-19-2010 09:17 PM
USER mode for K7 ... questions. jpzk Pentax DSLR Discussion 9 12-29-2009 12:38 PM
Some potentially dumb film questions (Pentax LX) messthetics Pentax Film SLR Discussion 11 10-15-2008 06:32 PM
Just when you thought the dumb questions were over slowpez Digital Processing, Software, and Printing 5 07-28-2008 06:17 PM
Light Tent... My day for dumb questions Ed in GA Photographic Technique 2 02-08-2008 12:22 AM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:09 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top