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12-28-2010, 06:58 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by JHD Quote
Primes blow - old school!

The best zooms are every bit as good - if not better than the best primes. I've been dumping my primes with absolutely ZERO regrets.
how much money for a fast zoom? how much for a prime? you do the math lol.

actually, can you get a f/1.2 zoom? you can get it in prime... on second thought, do you get below f/2 with zoom ever?

12-28-2010, 07:17 PM   #17
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There's pros/cons to both primes or zooms.

For my type of action photos, forget using a prime.

While you're changing prime lenses to 'perfectly' match the distance/subject/action,
I'll simply be turning my zoom ring and not miss any of that action while there's no lens on *your* camera!
And perhaps not a f1.2, but a constant f2.8 18-50mm or 24-70mm does a decent job, even for portraits, at a decent price.

Michel
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Last edited by mlatour; 12-28-2010 at 07:23 PM.
12-28-2010, 07:47 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by mlatour Quote
There's pros/cons to both primes or zooms.

For my type of action photos, forget using a prime.

While you're changing prime lenses to 'perfectly' match the distance/subject/action,
I'll simply be turning my zoom ring and not miss any of that action while there's no lens on *your* camera!
And perhaps not a f1.2, but a constant f2.8 18-50mm or 24-70mm does a decent job, even for portraits, at a decent price.

Michel
www.coderouge.com
not everyone shoot actions photo, and for most of us we rarely do it. but you can definitely get a good prime and crop them.

The thing with prime is control DOF, you can't get that blurry background (atleast not as good) even at 70 f/2.8 vs a 50-58 f/1.4 or f1.2

At the same time, they don't make macro zoom (atleast not 1:2 or 1:1 macro)... you're stuck with prime.

Low light shooting, again, f/2.8 is barely enough.

I'm not saying that zoom is not as good as prime, it's got it's use (my walk around is a zoom), but prime are better IQ and there are walk around of it's limitation.
12-28-2010, 07:56 PM   #19
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i don't think that entry level users are really going to cause a spike in the second hand lens market. most entry level DSLR buyers want the standard 2 lens kit (18-55 and 55-300 or something along those lines) or they want the all in one wide-telephoto zooms. i work in a photo lab at a big box warehouse club, and most DSLR users that print with us don't know what an f-stop is.

12-28-2010, 08:15 PM   #20
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Primes have much better microcontrast--in my experience, at least. Perhaps I pixelpeep too much, but I can't help it.

Last edited by causey; 12-28-2010 at 08:26 PM.
12-28-2010, 10:09 PM   #21
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the whole "you can get f/1.4 with your prime" is over-rated.

the FA 50/1.4 has so many aberrations at f/1.4 it's not funny. These clean up only by about f/2.8... oh wait.

also the DOF is paper-thin at f/1.4 so aside from cool bokeh tricks, i don't really use it at f/1.4 at all.
12-28-2010, 11:25 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by orly_andico Quote
the whole "you can get f/1.4 with your prime" is over-rated.

the FA 50/1.4 has so many aberrations at f/1.4 it's not funny. These clean up only by about f/2.8... oh wait.

also the DOF is paper-thin at f/1.4 so aside from cool bokeh tricks, i don't really use it at f/1.4 at all.

alot of photos are taken with the bokeh trick... it just makes things pop... sure it's not something you would do with landscape, or an amazing scene, but it's used alot in other places... hehe, takes away the work for composition of the image IMO (but nooblet like me can't really compose well so that's out of the question).
12-29-2010, 03:20 AM   #23
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@orly,
Many of us get quite good shots @f/1.4 that would just not be possible otherwise, shots where any lens imperfections just don't matter. That's why I have three 50/1.4's and a 55/1.4 -- and I don't pretend that they're good for everything. That's why my carry-bag usually has an f/1.4 AND a Macro-Takumar 50/4 (1X) AND a CZJ Tessar 50/2.8 (12 iris blades), yeah three Fifty's at once because they're different tools for different ends.

If thin DOF bothers you, consider that a 200/5.6 is just as thin as a 50/1.4, and a 135/3.5 is thinner.

@clockwork247,
Nope, there just ain't no f/2 zooms for APS-C or larger format cameras. This was explored in another thread somewhere and I think the fastest anyone found was an Angenieux 35-70/2.5 which only costs around US$5k. For smaller formats, no problem -- my Bell & Howell Filmovara 15-25/1.2 is nothing exceptional in the cine-CCTV range and it only cost me ONE BUCK. The main reason I'd consider an EVIL/MILC or m4/3 etc is to mount cheap short fast glass.

12-29-2010, 04:20 AM   #24
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In Oly 4/3 mount, you have f/2 zoom lenses.
ED 14-35mm f2.0
ED 35-100mm f2.0
I'm pretty sure these are amazing lenses, but the price & size?

That said, I'm fine with my primes starting at 2.4/2.8, so
12-29-2010, 07:26 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by orly_andico Quote
the whole "you can get f/1.4 with your prime" is over-rated.

the FA 50/1.4 has so many aberrations at f/1.4 it's not funny. These clean up only by about f/2.8... oh wait.
I can fit the FA50/1.4 in the front pocket of my jeans. Maybe I can ram in a 2.8 zoom if I wore baggy pants, but that would be sure to get some stares

Until the 2.8 zooms can come close to the sizes of the compact primes (and alter the laws of optics in the process), primes won't be totally replaced. I like small and relatively inconspicuous lens/camera combos.



I have to think there is some adoption of small/fast primes amongst new dslr users, what else is the 35mm/2.4 for? Nikon also released an 'entry' 35mm prime not too long ago. There must be some demand in the prime segment, so I'm optimistic in an increased demand leading to increased production and sales volume and a decrease in end price of new product. I can dream
12-29-2010, 07:41 AM   #26
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I doubt that newer photographers making the jump from P&S cameras to a micro 4/3 or one of the others are going to be gobbling up all the old manual lenses and driving up prices. There are spikes in demand and prices from time to time and a good amount of old Pentax glass has gone up in value in recent months, mostly due to increased sales of cameras. People who own older Minolta and Canon lenses may be likely customers for EVIL cameras but not too many noobs will be buying up old glass to use them on these new cameras. The adapter prices are fairly pricey also. Most of the ones I have seen are over $200 but I'm sure there will be plenty of cheap knockoffs in time.
12-29-2010, 08:08 AM   #27
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I think the only prime I will keep is the DA40 due to the novelty of what it is and my Tammy 90mm for its macro. Don't miss f 1.4 as those lenses need to be stopped down to at least 2.8 before they start to shine.
12-29-2010, 08:11 AM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by reeftool Quote
I doubt that newer photographers making the jump from P&S cameras to a micro 4/3 or one of the others are going to be gobbling up all the old manual lenses and driving up prices. There are spikes in demand and prices from time to time and a good amount of old Pentax glass has gone up in value in recent months, mostly due to increased sales of cameras. People who own older Minolta and Canon lenses may be likely customers for EVIL cameras but not too many noobs will be buying up old glass to use them on these new cameras. The adapter prices are fairly pricey also. Most of the ones I have seen are over $200 but I'm sure there will be plenty of cheap knockoffs in time.
adaptors are only 20 bucks a pop. only the ones by manufacture are in the 200. I have a PL1 lol been looking at that stuff pretty hard.
12-29-2010, 10:03 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by BrianR Quote
I can fit the FA50/1.4 in the front pocket of my jeans. Maybe I can ram in a 2.8 zoom if I wore baggy pants, but that would be sure to get some stares
"Is that a superzoom in your pocket or are you just glad to see me?"

heh heh
12-29-2010, 10:24 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
"Is that a superzoom in your pocket or are you just glad to see me?"
Well done, RR!
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