Stepping to the dark side: 2 weeks with a 30D...

lol101 · 10-26-2007, 03:12 AM

Hi everybody,

I have just taken a high-risk step: I borrowed a Canon 30D and a 17-55 2.8 IS from my workplace for two weeks!

I plan on using it alongside my K10 in casual shooting (hoping the grey hazy weather will lift up sometimes...) as well as indoor portraits.

I'll report my feeling on this shootout but if you would like to have specific details on some points, don't hesitate to ask and I will try to answer.

PS: I won't do extensive pixel-peeping though (I have no tripod/charts/brick walls anyway

), just use the camera in a familiar environment but if you want to know how the two cameras react in a given environment, I'll be glad to try.

and · 10-26-2007, 03:18 AM

Its nice to be able to test the grass on the other side

have fun and enjoy.

JamesD · 10-26-2007, 06:56 AM

Not sure about others, but we've made our decision for Pentax in a very conscious and deliberate manner. When I decided to purchase two Pentax cameras I did my homework quite thoroughly. In the past I've own both Canons and Nikons. When my wife told me she wanted a dslr we tried them all (even the Olympus with its odd format). Only the Pentax felt right, although the Nikon D80 was a close second. Like and, I hope you enjoy your time with the Canon but for me it would serve little purpose since I'm firmly a Pentax person and while recognizing that each camera has its strengths and weaknesses, I see little point in messing about with other brands. I want to use my time to get to know how to make better use of my camera... how to further exploit its strengths and minimize its weaknesses.

All the best.

**barondla** · 10-26-2007, 07:14 AM

It is always fun to try other cameras. Have tried C,N,S,F,and O. All have neat little quirks and features. Would like to try a Sigma once - just for fun. Enjoy the trial. You will be back to Pentax in two weeks.

thanks
barondla

and · 10-26-2007, 07:19 AM

I only got to play with other cameras in stores... would be nice to actually be able to take them home to try out. I remember the only one that instantly wow'ed me was the 5D, that viewfinder is to die for. and that smooth usm. and the 1Ds II surprisingly didnt feel that nice, but then again the electronics in that body is a bit outdated. would love to play with 1D mkIII and nikon d3.

lol101 · 10-26-2007, 08:13 AM

Originally posted by JamesD

Not sure about others, but we've made our decision for Pentax in a very conscious and deliberate manner. When I decided to purchase two Pentax cameras I did my homework quite thoroughly. In the past I've own both Canons and Nikons. When my wife told me she wanted a dslr we tried them all (even the Olympus with its odd format). Only the Pentax felt right, although the Nikon D80 was a close second. Like and, I hope you enjoy your time with the Canon but for me it would serve little purpose since I'm firmly a Pentax person and while recognizing that each camera has its strengths and weaknesses, I see little point in messing about with other brands. I want to use my time to get to know how to make better use of my camera... how to further exploit its strengths and minimize its weaknesses.

All the best.

The main reasons why I want to try the 30D camera is:

1/ because I can borrow it for cheap

(€13 for 2 weeks with 17-55 2.8 IS);
2/ because I like discovering new gear;
2/ because I've read many good thing about Canon's AF and low light capabilities and want to make my own opinion as well as the usefuleness for me of faster fps/AF tracking; You never know, if Pentax get out a new model with improved features on this front, will that be of any use to me?
3/ I'll probably have my little SR/IS match at some point

4/ because the 5D was already taken

(I'll get it next month with 24-105 and 70-200 L IS lenses);

**barondla** · 10-28-2007, 06:33 PM

Don't blame you for trying it out. In cameras and hifi equipment my rule is try it if you get the chance. You can always learn something. You also may never get the chance again. Enjoy it. The 5D would be on my list to try. FF viewfinders are great.
thanks
barondla

pop4 · 10-28-2007, 11:04 PM

Do keep us informed about your experiences with the 30D over the next two weeks, and how it compares to the K10D. I sure am interested, just out of curiosity.

and · 10-28-2007, 11:06 PM

Yup, be sure to report back

SimonMW · 10-29-2007, 12:44 AM

I looked at the Canons. I found that all but the most expensive ones felt a bit lightweight and toy like. Also found the viewfinder on the 30D to be small and dull compared with the K10.

-spam- · 10-29-2007, 12:56 AM

Originally posted by SimonMW

Also found the viewfinder on the 30D to be small and dull compared with the K10.

I regularly go between a 20D and a k10d and ive found there is hardly any noticeable difference except that the k10d lacks the visible AF points that i like so very much

SupremeMoFo · 10-29-2007, 02:05 AM

30D viewfinder is pathetic, yeah. Only competition for the K10D when I was in the market was the D80 and it probably would've won too, except it just cost a little too much. Still, other than availability of certain glass and the f**king ridiculous price of some accessories in Australia ($295, or US$270)...

Chako · 10-29-2007, 03:22 AM

I agree with Spam. I own both the 20D and K10D. The Canon is my main system, as I truly appreciate the more advanced AF for what I do...wildlife photography.

lol101 · 10-29-2007, 03:35 AM

Damn!

It looks like I'm going to have to give up on my test: the IS on the 17-55f2.8 is apparently dying on me

I am having trouble getting sharp images with the combo and the IS is emitting "cracking" noises while the image wobbles in the VF from time to time.

I asked a Canonist friend and he told me that this is not supposed to be like that: defective unit.

I still took a few pictures with IS off but since the lens is defective, it's pretty much inconclusive (loads of CA wide open, not so sharp... not really what I had hopped for...).

Sooooo, I have basically nothing to offer, except the confirmation that K10's built quality is nothing short of exceptional and has really set a new standard for this class of camera.

Also the AF speed on the 30D didn't particularly amaze me, except in low light where it would either focus faster than the K10... or not at all. Again, this may be due to the defective lens but it doesn't change when IS is turned off.

In good light, both are really fast, too fast to tell them apart IMHO.

As far as VF are concerned, the K10 is better but not by a mile, the 30D is OK and I agree that having AF sensor marks permanently in VF is a good thing.

One thing I like on the 30D is the back wheel: I dream of a Pentax keeping the two upper wheels (front and back) and adding a concentric wheel around the directional pad customizable at will (ISO, AF points, metering mode, WB, AE compensation...).

I really don't like the "one button=two parameters" (ex: drive with front wheel, WB with back) but that's part of Canon's philosophy and maybe I just need some time to adapt to it.

It took me a while to find the DoF preview button, until I remembered the old days of my very first SLR (a Canon AE1) and looked at the front left of the camera: there it is! Still at the same (strange) place

On the IQ front, well, I think the 30D sets the reference for high ISO quality: ISO1600 is really clean and ISO 3200 useable. I'd say about 1 stop better than K10.

One funny (?) thing is that I could find obvious traces of HPN (Horizontal Patern Noise) in the shadows of the Canon high ISO images: not really a problem but it's there... to me it's about the same magnitude than VPN is on the K10 (ie very faint) and doesn't really appear until you push the enveloppe 1 or two stops.

OK, I think I'll stop here, I haven't got the impression of having reavealed anything new but I had back luck with the lens. I'll try to get another one that works next time.

and · 10-29-2007, 03:51 AM

Does the 30D have an AF assist light? Is it only Nikon that has that function on the body. I wonder why everyone doesnt have it when so many compact cameras have it and it makes a big difference.

10-26-2007, 03:12 AM	#1
lol101 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Garennes sur Eure France Photos: Gallery Posts: 899	Stepping to the dark side: 2 weeks with a 30D... Hi everybody, I have just taken a high-risk step: I borrowed a Canon 30D and a 17-55 2.8 IS from my workplace for two weeks! I plan on using it alongside my K10 in casual shooting (hoping the grey hazy weather will lift up sometimes...) as well as indoor portraits. I'll report my feeling on this shootout but if you would like to have specific details on some points, don't hesitate to ask and I will try to answer. PS: I won't do extensive pixel-peeping though (I have no tripod/charts/brick walls anyway ), just use the camera in a familiar environment but if you want to know how the two cameras react in a given environment, I'll be glad to try.

10-29-2007, 03:35 AM	#14
lol101 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Garennes sur Eure France Photos: Gallery Posts: 899 Original Poster	A quick follow up on my thread... Damn! It looks like I'm going to have to give up on my test: the IS on the 17-55f2.8 is apparently dying on me I am having trouble getting sharp images with the combo and the IS is emitting "cracking" noises while the image wobbles in the VF from time to time. I asked a Canonist friend and he told me that this is not supposed to be like that: defective unit. I still took a few pictures with IS off but since the lens is defective, it's pretty much inconclusive (loads of CA wide open, not so sharp... not really what I had hopped for...). Sooooo, I have basically nothing to offer, except the confirmation that K10's built quality is nothing short of exceptional and has really set a new standard for this class of camera. Also the AF speed on the 30D didn't particularly amaze me, except in low light where it would either focus faster than the K10... or not at all. Again, this may be due to the defective lens but it doesn't change when IS is turned off. In good light, both are really fast, too fast to tell them apart IMHO. As far as VF are concerned, the K10 is better but not by a mile, the 30D is OK and I agree that having AF sensor marks permanently in VF is a good thing. One thing I like on the 30D is the back wheel: I dream of a Pentax keeping the two upper wheels (front and back) and adding a concentric wheel around the directional pad customizable at will (ISO, AF points, metering mode, WB, AE compensation...). I really don't like the "one button=two parameters" (ex: drive with front wheel, WB with back) but that's part of Canon's philosophy and maybe I just need some time to adapt to it. It took me a while to find the DoF preview button, until I remembered the old days of my very first SLR (a Canon AE1) and looked at the front left of the camera: there it is! Still at the same (strange) place On the IQ front, well, I think the 30D sets the reference for high ISO quality: ISO1600 is really clean and ISO 3200 useable. I'd say about 1 stop better than K10. One funny (?) thing is that I could find obvious traces of HPN (Horizontal Patern Noise) in the shadows of the Canon high ISO images: not really a problem but it's there... to me it's about the same magnitude than VPN is on the K10 (ie very faint) and doesn't really appear until you push the enveloppe 1 or two stops. OK, I think I'll stop here, I haven't got the impression of having reavealed anything new but I had back luck with the lens. I'll try to get another one that works next time.

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10-26-2007, 03:18 AM	#2
and Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,476	Its nice to be able to test the grass on the other side have fun and enjoy.

10-26-2007, 06:56 AM	#3
JamesD Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 536	Not sure about others, but we've made our decision for Pentax in a very conscious and deliberate manner. When I decided to purchase two Pentax cameras I did my homework quite thoroughly. In the past I've own both Canons and Nikons. When my wife told me she wanted a dslr we tried them all (even the Olympus with its odd format). Only the Pentax felt right, although the Nikon D80 was a close second. Like and, I hope you enjoy your time with the Canon but for me it would serve little purpose since I'm firmly a Pentax person and while recognizing that each camera has its strengths and weaknesses, I see little point in messing about with other brands. I want to use my time to get to know how to make better use of my camera... how to further exploit its strengths and minimize its weaknesses. All the best.

10-26-2007, 07:14 AM	#4
barondla Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: midwest, United States Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,714	It is always fun to try other cameras. Have tried C,N,S,F,and O. All have neat little quirks and features. Would like to try a Sigma once - just for fun. Enjoy the trial. You will be back to Pentax in two weeks. thanks barondla

10-26-2007, 07:19 AM	#5
and Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,476	I only got to play with other cameras in stores... would be nice to actually be able to take them home to try out. I remember the only one that instantly wow'ed me was the 5D, that viewfinder is to die for. and that smooth usm. and the 1Ds II surprisingly didnt feel that nice, but then again the electronics in that body is a bit outdated. would love to play with 1D mkIII and nikon d3.

10-26-2007, 08:13 AM	#6
lol101 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Garennes sur Eure France Photos: Gallery Posts: 899 Original Poster	Originally posted by JamesD Not sure about others, but we've made our decision for Pentax in a very conscious and deliberate manner. When I decided to purchase two Pentax cameras I did my homework quite thoroughly. In the past I've own both Canons and Nikons. When my wife told me she wanted a dslr we tried them all (even the Olympus with its odd format). Only the Pentax felt right, although the Nikon D80 was a close second. Like and, I hope you enjoy your time with the Canon but for me it would serve little purpose since I'm firmly a Pentax person and while recognizing that each camera has its strengths and weaknesses, I see little point in messing about with other brands. I want to use my time to get to know how to make better use of my camera... how to further exploit its strengths and minimize its weaknesses. All the best. The main reasons why I want to try the 30D camera is: 1/ because I can borrow it for cheap (€13 for 2 weeks with 17-55 2.8 IS); 2/ because I like discovering new gear; 2/ because I've read many good thing about Canon's AF and low light capabilities and want to make my own opinion as well as the usefuleness for me of faster fps/AF tracking; You never know, if Pentax get out a new model with improved features on this front, will that be of any use to me? 3/ I'll probably have my little SR/IS match at some point 4/ because the 5D was already taken (I'll get it next month with 24-105 and 70-200 L IS lenses);

10-28-2007, 06:33 PM	#7
barondla Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: midwest, United States Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,714	Don't blame you for trying it out. In cameras and hifi equipment my rule is try it if you get the chance. You can always learn something. You also may never get the chance again. Enjoy it. The 5D would be on my list to try. FF viewfinders are great. thanks barondla

10-28-2007, 11:04 PM	#8
pop4 Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: YMML Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,879	Do keep us informed about your experiences with the 30D over the next two weeks, and how it compares to the K10D. I sure am interested, just out of curiosity.

10-28-2007, 11:06 PM	#9
and Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,476	Yup, be sure to report back

10-29-2007, 12:44 AM	#10
SimonMW Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: England Posts: 21	I looked at the Canons. I found that all but the most expensive ones felt a bit lightweight and toy like. Also found the viewfinder on the 30D to be small and dull compared with the K10.

10-29-2007, 12:56 AM	#11
-spam- Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 354	Originally posted by SimonMW Also found the viewfinder on the 30D to be small and dull compared with the K10. I regularly go between a 20D and a k10d and ive found there is hardly any noticeable difference except that the k10d lacks the visible AF points that i like so very much

10-29-2007, 02:05 AM	#12
SupremeMoFo Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Queensland, Australia Posts: 668	30D viewfinder is pathetic, yeah. Only competition for the K10D when I was in the market was the D80 and it probably would've won too, except it just cost a little too much. Still, other than availability of certain glass and the f**king ridiculous price of some accessories in Australia ($295, or US$270)...

10-29-2007, 03:22 AM	#13
Chako Inactive Account Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Sault Ste Marie, Ont, Canada. Posts: 563	I agree with Spam. I own both the 20D and K10D. The Canon is my main system, as I truly appreciate the more advanced AF for what I do...wildlife photography.

10-29-2007, 03:51 AM	#15
and Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,476	Does the 30D have an AF assist light? Is it only Nikon that has that function on the body. I wonder why everyone doesnt have it when so many compact cameras have it and it makes a big difference.