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11-02-2007, 12:32 PM   #1
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exposure and focus options

Both of these questions arise from options in the custom menus.

Meter operating time (in the custom menus, page 1). What is this? The options are 10 seconds, 3 seconds, and 30 seconds. Why would you pick anything other than 3 seconds?

AF with Press Halfway. Why would you not want to do this? I've tried setting this to OFF and using the AF button instead, but I find that much less convenient and when I turn off this option I tend to get more out of focus photos. What am I missing here (if anything)?

Link AF Point and AE. This is the one I'm really confused about. If I set this to ON, the on-screen hint says, "Exposure value for multi-segment meter set relative to AF Point pos." OK, I'm trying to decode this. First, am I right to infer that, if I don't have the metering dial set to multi-segment, then it doesn't make any difference what the setting here? I take it that center-weighted metering is not multi-segment metering for the purposes of this option. If I do have the camera set to use multi-segment metering, and this option is set to ON, then how exactly does this effect my photo? And how does this option work with the one right before it, AE-L with AF locked? I mean, if I lock the auto-exposure at the same time that I lock the focus, isn't that the same as setting Link AF Point and AE to ON, at least if you're using multi-segment metering? Does one take precedence over the other? And what does "relative to" mean? Does it mean that, if you set this option to YES, multi-segment metering suddenly gets turned into spot metering, using the focus point as the place to meter? Or does it mean that multi-segment metering works like center-weighted metering, except that the meter gives priority to a spot that might be off center?

Will

11-02-2007, 12:41 PM   #2
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Meter operating time, how long the cameras lightmeter and VF display and top lcd stay on before it goes into standby and you have to touch a button to bring it back. people pick longer times so they dont have to touch the shutter button to be able to see the lcd.

I dont have this on. I dont like it that if I need to half press the shutter to get the meter back on for instance, then the camera will AF again. if I have recomposed my shot then if I af again with center af then the focus is wrong and I need to recompose again. but then I like to keep my camera in manual because I hate it when it does things automatically without me asking for it. but this is annoying with the grip because it doesnt have the af button (very very bad design error) and also its not as good for action.

link af and ae, I have never used it so I will leave that to others
11-02-2007, 12:47 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by WMBP Quote
Both of these questions arise from options in the custom menus.

Meter operating time (in the custom menus, page 1). What is this? The options are 10 seconds, 3 seconds, and 30 seconds. Why would you pick anything other than 3 seconds?
Funny you bring this up now, I saw a post the other day asking to extend metering time
QuoteQuote:
AF with Press Halfway. Why would you not want to do this? I've tried setting this to OFF and using the AF button instead, but I find that much less convenient and when I turn off this option I tend to get more out of focus photos. What am I missing here (if anything)?
I don't know either
QuoteQuote:
Link AF Point and AE. This is the one I'm really confused about. If I set this to ON, the on-screen hint says, "Exposure value for multi-segment meter set relative to AF Point pos." OK, I'm trying to decode this. First, am I right to infer that, if I don't have the metering dial set to multi-segment, then it doesn't make any difference what the setting here? I take it that center-weighted metering is not multi-segment metering for the purposes of this option. If I do have the camera set to use multi-segment metering, and this option is set to ON, then how exactly does this effect my photo? And how does this option work with the one right before it, AE-L with AF locked? I mean, if I lock the auto-exposure at the same time that I lock the focus, isn't that the same as setting Link AF Point and AE to ON, at least if you're using multi-segment metering? Does one take precedence over the other? And what does "relative to" mean? Does it mean that, if you set this option to YES, multi-segment metering suddenly gets turned into spot metering, using the focus point as the place to meter? Or does it mean that multi-segment metering works like center-weighted metering, except that the meter gives priority to a spot that might be off center?

Will
Good question, I will need to think about this one, I always assumed that it locked the exposure at the same time as focus was locked, since I did not think the metering points were physically at the same point as the focusing points, except for the center spot
11-02-2007, 01:23 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by and Quote
Meter operating time, how long the cameras lightmeter and VF display and top lcd stay on before it goes into standby and you have to touch a button to bring it back. people pick longer times so they dont have to touch the shutter button to be able to see the lcd.

I dont have this on....

Andreas,

Turning this OFF is not an option, so I don't know what you mean when you say you don't have it on. The options are 10 seconds, 3 seconds, and 30 seconds. OFF is not an option.

But I do see now that, setting this option to 3 seconds, if I look through the viewfinder and tap the shutter button to get the camera's attention, I can see the exposure indicator (in M mode) for only about 3 seconds, and then the VF goes completely dark. The LCD on top doesn't go completely dark -- which confused me at first -- but I see now that the exposure indicator after 3 seconds stops, um, indicating the exposure.

Thanks. Clarifies THAT issue at least. Also explains why the order of the options is what it is: 10, 3, and 30. I would have made it 3, 10, 30. But I guess Pentax likes the first option to be the default, and 10 seconds probably does make sense as a default here.

Will

11-02-2007, 02:31 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by WMBP Quote
Andreas,

Turning this OFF is not an option, so I don't know what you mean when you say you don't have it on.

Will
You miscut my quote, I said I didnt have AF by half press on.
11-02-2007, 02:44 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by and Quote
You miscut my quote, I said I didnt have AF by half press on.
Andrea,

I failed to see that "this" in your reply (first sentence, second paragraph) was referring not to what you'd just been talking about, but back to the second question in my original post. Sorry for the misunderstanding and thanks for the clarification. So, to get it back in context, with respect to the AF with Press Halfway option, you said:


[/quote]I dont have this on. I dont like it that if I need to half press the shutter to get the meter back on for instance, then the camera will AF again. if I have recomposed my shot then if I af again with center af then the focus is wrong and I need to recompose again. but then I like to keep my camera in manual because I hate it when it does things automatically without me asking for it. but this is annoying with the grip because it doesnt have the af button (very very bad design error) and also its not as good for action.[quote]

Well, if you set the metering time (now that I understand THAT, thanks to your explanation) to 30 seconds, and did not link focus and exposure, you'd not have to worry about the meter going off. But it sounds like the basic idea here is that you like to control all these elements independently, which I can certainly understand.

I think you're right that, if Pentax is going to provide an AF button on the body, they should provide it on the grip, too. The fact that it's missing from the grip, seems a reason NOT to get used to the AF button.

Anyway, thanks for the replies.

Will
11-02-2007, 02:51 PM   #7
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Yea the lack of AF button on the grip is very annoying. For me another thing about the AF button is not having to keep my finger on the shutter all the time, its kinda like using manual focus but with af, in that once its focused it stays that way untill you do something about it. I do a lot of MF so I guess I like it that way. Its just another option for those who prefer it, in the end.

oh and the meter, normally the longer the better for me, Id keep it at 30 but then I dont know how badly that is going to affect battery life, so I dont.
11-02-2007, 02:53 PM   #8
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The "Link AE to AF point" option simply (? ) instructs the matrix metering engine to apply some form of bias towards the selected AF point. AE is *not* locked when you half-press (that is the "AE-L with AF lock" option). It has no effect in center-weighted or spot metering modes.

11-02-2007, 02:56 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by RBellavance Quote
The "Link AE to AF point" option simply (? ) instructs the matrix metering engine to apply some form of bias towards the selected AF point. AE is *not* locked when you half-press (that is the "AE-L with AF lock" option). It has no effect in center-weighted or spot metering modes.
That rings a bell when you mention it. Wasnt there some issue about... was it p-ttl flash..? where that was the solution. In any case, that makes sense to me
11-03-2007, 06:04 AM   #10
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Hmm -- my 2 cents

QuoteOriginally posted by and Quote
Meter operating time, how long the cameras lightmeter and VF display and top lcd stay on before it goes into standby and you have to touch a button to bring it back. people pick longer times so they dont have to touch the shutter button to be able to see the lcd.

I don't think this is right (I've never noticed anything abou the LCD or VF display). The meter operating time controls how long a particular exposure is "locked" once you press the "AE/L" button (on the K100d) or the "green dot" button (on the K10d). I've set mine to the max -- 30 seconds -- because of the way I usually work. E.g., I usually use Manual exposure mode, and spot meter as well. When I spot meter at the point in the frame that I want to use to set the exposure, I lock that particular exposure (by pressing either the AE/L or green button), which is then set for a particular period of time (either 3, 10, or 30 seconds) regardless of where I then move the frame. Thus, I've chosen the 30 second option because it allows me to recompose and think about the picture -- at the precise exposure I want -- before pressing the shutter.

At least I think that's what it does. But who knows -- maybe I'm confusing two different things.

As to Will's 2 other questions:

2. Why one would not use the shutter buttom to set the AF is beyond me as well.

3. I don't link the AF point with the AE point, again because of my particular working method. I use selective focus points (as you asked about in another thread), and I use spot metering. But these aren't usually at the same spots -- i.e., where I choose to spot meter in the frame is often not where I'd like the focus to be. So, I de-link the points.

As for whether this features is applicable when using center-weighted metering, well, I'm not sure about that.

BTW -- it's funny that so many of us, even very experienced users, don't understand some of these basic features of the camera. Perhaps Pentax should have someone rewrite that very thick, but really quite unhelpful, user's manual ...

Hope I'm not adding to the confusion ...

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11-09-2007, 10:26 PM   #11
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I turn off the [AF on half press] on my MZ-S (and will on my K10D next weekend!) at about this time every year, and turn it on again in the spring when I no longer operate the camera with gloves on.

I can also see this when I get a bit older, and the shakes from my blood pressure medication gets worse. Maybe I'll never turn it off.

Never had the grip before - but it looks like a h*** of a long reach to the AF button! Bummer.

A little late in the thread, but then I just joined.
11-09-2007, 11:58 PM   #12
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AF again

QuoteOriginally posted by WMBP Quote
Both of these questions arise from options in the custom menus.

Meter operating time (in the custom menus, page 1). What is this? The options are 10 seconds, 3 seconds, and 30 seconds. Why would you pick anything other than 3 seconds?
Sorry - I have never set this function - just how long the image shows up after I take it. I am almost at the point where I am going to turn off automatic LCD display - hurts, in low light with the LCD coming on after each shot.

QuoteOriginally posted by WMBP Quote
AF with Press Halfway. Why would you not want to do this? I've tried setting this to OFF and using the AF button instead, but I find that much less convenient and when I turn off this option I tend to get more out of focus photos. What am I missing here (if anything)?
Yes, this is the first thing I turned off on the K10D. I choose what is is focus not what the camera thinks I am pointing it at. We have had this discussion before. Just think process, focus, set the exposure, compose then expose. Think back to the old manual days - use AF as a tool not a crutch. For instance - in sports - set the focus point - then take three shots with say 2 seconds between each shot. Guess what - AF does not hunt since you are following the action - when you need to refocus - either do it manually (finger on the focus ring) or push AF and let it lock. The key is technique, to each his own, but why let the camera do the thinking about what is to be in focus?

QuoteOriginally posted by WMBP Quote
Link AF Point and AE. This is the one I'm really confused about.
snip
Will
Same here - not clue as to why anyone would do this - but it is nice to know that the camera has the capability of doing things that I really do not understand. Sort of makes me want to ---- experiment?

The Elitist - formerly known as PDL
11-10-2007, 01:12 AM   #13
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Regarding meter operating time, it also affects the focus aid, and if you are using a manual lens you often want more than three seconds to set the focus.
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