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05-18-2011, 04:37 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
There was at one time a fairly common bit of lore that Pentax in camera jpegs were softer than those from Nikon or Canon. The reason for it was because Pentax used somewhat less aggressive in camera sharpening than Nikon or Canon, who were oversharpening in camera because tyro's were more wowed by crisp than they were by detail, which sharpening robs the image of.
We ran a comparison between my IstD and a D70 one day (with similar lenses, though nothing is absolute in these things), and to get what the Nikon was outputting as stock, Pentax would output at +1 or +2 sharpening and a bit of a contrast boost as well.
The thing with sharpening is that you can always move forward with it (towards more) but once the oversharpening damage is done, you can't go backwards, so Pentax had the right idea in the first place, though most users weren't educated enough to realize it.
Ah, thanks for the info. I remember something about that. Since I never shoot jpg I wouldn't know... People ask me about "picture modes" and "bright,landscape,portrait" and stuff... I'm like ?HUH?.

05-18-2011, 08:56 PM   #32
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A slight clarification of the history: In the 1960s and 1970s, Pentax made and sold more SLRs than all other camera makers in the world COMBINED. Look it up. As for why Pentax is where it is, dSLR-wise... several theories are floating around. They're easy to look up also.
05-19-2011, 12:59 AM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
There was at one time a fairly common bit of lore that Pentax in camera jpegs were softer than those from Nikon or Canon. The reason for it was because Pentax used somewhat less aggressive in camera sharpening than Nikon or Canon, who were oversharpening in camera because tyro's were more wowed by crisp than they were by detail, which sharpening robs the image of.
We ran a comparison between my IstD and a D70 one day (with similar lenses, though nothing is absolute in these things), and to get what the Nikon was outputting as stock, Pentax would output at +1 or +2 sharpening and a bit of a contrast boost as well.
The thing with sharpening is that you can always move forward with it (towards more) but once the oversharpening damage is done, you can't go backwards, so Pentax had the right idea in the first place, though most users weren't educated enough to realize it.
Thank you very much Wheatfield! That is exactly how I feel about this issue too. And one sometimes does wonder, 1) whether many magazine camera reviewers have ever gone beyond "AUTOPICT" in their "tests" and 2) why bother to buy a DSLR if one does not care to use the setting options to find one's personal style?

On another note, we can still read a tutorial today (2011) on a reputed, assumed neutral photosite having very square statements like these (sorry for the lengthy quote, but I would like to hear other's opinions):

QUOTE (with my emphasis in bold type):
The market leader in the professional/advanced amateur photography world is Canon. If you don't have a major investment in lenses you will probably want to buy a Canon digital SLR. The number two spot is occupied by Nikon, which is also a reasonable choice. Fuji and Kodak have made digital SLRs that accept Canon- and Nikon-mount lenses. Once you get beyond Nikon and Canon it becomes very difficult to rent lenses and the companies that make the more obscure systems don't have a large enough market share to invest enough money to build competitive bodies. Leica, Minolta, Olympus, Pentax, and Sigma are the small vendors in the digital SLR market. Unless you have an enormous investment in lenses for one of these brands the only one of these worth considering for purchase is Olympus, due to its innovative Four-Thirds system, discussed below.
END OF QUOTE

Is it I, who is too sensitive, or.......
05-19-2011, 08:21 PM   #34
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dSLR bodies have AutoPict modes?

05-19-2011, 08:33 PM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
A slight clarification of the history: In the 1960s and 1970s, Pentax made and sold more SLRs than all other camera makers in the world COMBINED. Look it up. As for why Pentax is where it is, dSLR-wise... several theories are floating around. They're easy to look up also.
And during the 80's there were screw mount lenses under every rock and at every garage sale. I wish I had some of the ones that ended up in the shop's "Junk Bin" for $5.00. I know there were at least a few dozen of the old 55 1.8 super taks, a few 50 1.4 STs, and miscellaneous 135s.
05-23-2011, 11:32 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by Stone G. Quote
Thank you very much Wheatfield! That is exactly how I feel about this issue too. And one sometimes does wonder, 1) whether many magazine camera reviewers have ever gone beyond "AUTOPICT" in their "tests" and 2) why bother to buy a DSLR if one does not care to use the setting options to find one's personal style?

On another note, we can still read a tutorial today (2011) on a reputed, assumed neutral photosite having very square statements like these (sorry for the lengthy quote, but I would like to hear other's opinions):

QUOTE (with my emphasis in bold type):
The market leader in the professional/advanced amateur photography world is Canon. If you don't have a major investment in lenses you will probably want to buy a Canon digital SLR. The number two spot is occupied by Nikon, which is also a reasonable choice. Fuji and Kodak have made digital SLRs that accept Canon- and Nikon-mount lenses. Once you get beyond Nikon and Canon it becomes very difficult to rent lenses and the companies that make the more obscure systems don't have a large enough market share to invest enough money to build competitive bodies. Leica, Minolta, Olympus, Pentax, and Sigma are the small vendors in the digital SLR market. Unless you have an enormous investment in lenses for one of these brands the only one of these worth considering for purchase is Olympus, due to its innovative Four-Thirds system, discussed below.
END OF QUOTE

Is it I, who is too sensitive, or.......
Wow, that article is amazingly biased. I sent an email to the folks at photo.net suggesting that they might want to take a look at the article and received the following reply:

I will look into it.

You are right that it was jut one person's opinion and is out of date.

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05-23-2011, 02:41 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by baj Quote
Wow, that article is amazingly biased. I sent an email to the folks at photo.net suggesting that they might want to take a look at the article and received the following reply:

I will look into it.

You are right that it was jut one person's opinion and is out of date.

Josh
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GREAT - thanks!
05-23-2011, 04:04 PM   #38
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Thank you MPrince - Additionally,I feel its the image. MY image. I work very hard to discourage lurkers who try to steal my images from my website. And I dont have the time to notice what other photogs around me are shooting (I already know the probably shoot Nikons or Canons) If, however, I saw a Hasselblad or Pentax 645D I'd be very curious!!
Tony
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05-23-2011, 06:14 PM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by drobbia Quote
Thank you MPrince - Additionally,I feel its the image. MY image. I work very hard to discourage lurkers who try to steal my images from my website. And I dont have the time to notice what other photogs around me are shooting (I already know the probably shoot Nikons or Canons) If, however, I saw a Hasselblad or Pentax 645D I'd be very curious!!
Tony
"It's not what you look at, its what you see" - Thoreau
I held onto my EL/M for years hoping they'd release a Digital back for it I could afford, but the Hassy part didn't work on my old beast. *sigh*. And you can buy a Pentax 645D for what the Phase1 back costs for an EL/M.
05-23-2011, 08:29 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
A slight clarification of the history: In the 1960s and 1970s, Pentax made and sold more SLRs than all other camera makers in the world COMBINED. Look it up.
I believe that may be true for the 60s, but is it really true for the 70s? All camera companies were putting out great products at that time and if anything, the playing field was probably more level in that decade than it has ever been before or after. At least, that is the case if we look at Japan - I'm wondering whether USSR has produced more SLRs than all other Japanese companies - they put out plenty of Zenit cameras at that time.
05-23-2011, 11:01 PM   #41
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that's real, but pentax has been much more popular these years~~
05-24-2011, 05:30 AM - 1 Like   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by Laurentiu Cristofor Quote
I believe that may be true for the 60s, but is it really true for the 70s? All camera companies were putting out great products at that time and if anything, the playing field was probably more level in that decade than it has ever been before or after. At least, that is the case if we look at Japan - I'm wondering whether USSR has produced more SLRs than all other Japanese companies - they put out plenty of Zenit cameras at that time.
That's true for the 70's as well. In the early 70's they produced more cameras than Nikon and Canon combined. In the late 70's the M-series was the worlds most sold SLR along with the Canon AE-1. By 1981 they had sold more SLR's than any other manufacturer.
05-24-2011, 12:41 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
That's true for the 70's as well. In the early 70's they produced more cameras than Nikon and Canon combined. In the late 70's the M-series was the worlds most sold SLR along with the Canon AE-1. By 1981 they had sold more SLR's than any other manufacturer.
Yes I read that they were the first to produce 10 million SLR's
AOHC website
05-24-2011, 04:42 PM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
By 1981 they had sold more SLR's than any other manufacturer.
QuoteOriginally posted by Macario Quote
Yes I read that they were the first to produce 10 million SLR's
AOHC website
Selling some number by some date doesn't tell me much about how much they sold within the last decade prior to hitting that milestone. In other words, they may have hit the milestone first because of a significant head start in the 50s and 60s, but in the 70s their share of the market may have already dropped.

I'd like to see some more detailed numbers. Unfortunately, data is not easy to find. I found out for example that Canon produced 10 million EOS cameras in 1987-1997 - their first decade of production. They also produced camera models in the 70s reaching 1 million over 3 years (FTb). But I can't find anything about Nikon numbers.

QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
In the late 70's the M-series was the worlds most sold SLR along with the Canon AE-1.
That sounds like Canon was already at parity with Pentax in the late 70s. But I'm not sure what Nikon's status was back then . I have seen more journalists with Nikon cameras in movies from the 70s than with any other camera, so it feels as if Nikon already was in the lead, at least in the photojournalism area.
05-24-2011, 05:03 PM   #45
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Don't see a lot of these, either :)

.



These are kinda rare also.




... But you do see a lot of Canon shooters, usually doing something like using on-board flash in noonday sun!





..... Sometimes they know what they're doing.






.... And a film shooter is cool no matter what.





... Folks struggling with big equipment is a normal sight.





... But more and more these days, you just see...





Last edited by jsherman999; 05-24-2011 at 06:39 PM.
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