Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
11-26-2007, 07:05 AM   #1
Veteran Member
Jimfear's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 576
Two questions on the K10D

Hi

I have long been wondering about two, rather specific, things concerning the K10D.

1. How does it handle subzero temperature? Say in -10˚C, -20˚C and -30˚C. I understand that an extra battery will help, but if I'm shooting a couple of hours straight that won't be much good, or will it? Basically, does the camera die on me if I go out in these temperatures?

2. I've heard that some DSLRs get some kind of color distortion when taking a photo with long exposure (talking minutes to hours long exposures), something to do with the battery heating the sensor during exposure. I've never heard anything about the K10D concerning this, any experiences? (If you want to test this I've read that having the lens cap on and taking a resonably long exposure will show some color in the picture when it should be totaly black...)


Do you think there will be some groundbreaking advancement in these fields in the new pentax models?

11-26-2007, 07:46 AM   #2
Veteran Member
stewart_photo's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
Posts: 1,864
1. Using the same precautions for any digital camera in colder temperatures, the K10D should work reasonably fine. We have several forum members living in such colder climates (Northern Greenland, Northern Alaska, etc) and none have reported overwhelming problems.

2. Since this is a common limitation of sensor design, the K10D is just as prone to image noise during very long exposures as any other digital camera. There is an option in the "Custom Settings" menu to increase noise reduction during long exposures.

And, no, I don't think the new Pentax models with change either of these aspects.

stewart
11-26-2007, 08:04 AM   #3
Veteran Member




Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ontario
Posts: 750
For cold weather shooting, I've found the batteries deplete quite quickly (say after 100 shots instead of the usual 500-700 shots each). Therefore, I'd recommend you keep a battery in your pocket and then switch them back & forth.

Others have reported a magenta cast to their cold-weather shots (not a subtle thing either). However, this seems to be limited to only a few K10D's and not the model line on whole as I've never had this myself and shoot in colder weather (0 celcius to -15 or so) when winter rolls around. Last year, my K10D performed flawlessly in these conditions.

For long exposures, I haven't had a problem with them either, nor can I explain the lens-cap test as I haven't bothered with it. It's not too common for me to get the chance to go out to photograph star-trails or lightning so I can only say that in the 20-40 minute exposure time range (when I have had a chance to do it) I've had no problems with colour casts. The real problem is with DSLR's in general. A 20 minute exposure takes about 15-20 minutes for the buffer to clear and this was true with the DS2 and the K10D to my experience.

Here's a shot that was a 20 minute exposure. The exif gives a different reading on the exposure time as I processed this in-camera and when you play with the sensitivity when converting to jpg it adjusts the exposure-time for some reason.



From my perspective, there won't be any real changes to these short-comings in any upcoming models. But if there are, I could use a second body!
11-26-2007, 08:41 AM   #4
Veteran Member
Jimfear's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 576
Original Poster
Thanks

That sounds reassuring, but now I came to think of the problem with the time to clear the buffer. Is there any way or any camera that does this faster? Wouldn’t want to stand waiting an extra 10 minutes per exposure in cold weather. Or is that yet another reason for me to stay with film?

Andrew you said that you can take "only" 100 shots before the battery depletes in cold weather, now a scenario, that I tend to come across a lot, of photographing winter nights. So long exposures in cold weather and a max of about ten pictures per occasion, how do you think it will handle it? Shut down in the middle and leave me furious or does it have some kind of failsafe so it finishes the exposure before shutting down?

Mayby it's best to say in time how long it takes for the cameras battery to deplete? (considering that it takes me a month for sure to go through 100 exposures that does not give me as much as a hint to what time we are talking about...)

11-26-2007, 09:12 AM   #5
Veteran Member




Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ontario
Posts: 750
To be honest, I've never done long exposure on really cold nights. However, when I refer to 100 shots, that's over the course of a couple of hours in the cold. Yesterday I had 3 hours outside and didn't have to swap batteries, but by keeping the second in my pants-pocket, I was guaranteed to have some extra juice. I've found that when cold depletes a battery, it'll partially recover when warmed up.

If you're worried about the battery performance, you're going to have trouble with any DSLR in that capacity as they're all using lithium ion batteries (AFAIK, anyways) except for the K100D, which can use the AA energizer lithiums....they hold up much better.

As for the buffer, it's a pain for long exposures and for long night exposures, film is still your preferred option if you can't afford to wait for the buffer to clear. However, if I was in a position of having to shoot long exposures in cold weather, I'd be more tempted to break my old MX and not worry about batteries at all.

I believe there is a fail-safe for the camera to stop an exposure and leave enough time for the buffer to clear. However, I can't guarantee that as I've never been in a position to test it. There are others who have done what you're thinking who might be able to answer that better. Alternatively, you could do a number of exposures (anywhere between 50-200 and much shorter in duration - like around 1 sec. each) and then stack them for the final image to get the same result if you're doing star-trails. I've never done this myself, but the results I've seen on flickr using this technique have been excellent. This might solve the problem of buffer and battery life for you.

Hopefully this helps a bit.
11-26-2007, 10:15 AM   #6
Veteran Member
Jimfear's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 576
Original Poster
Thanks Andrew for a most thorogh answer!

So far my KX has done the job very well, and seems that it will continue to do so. Just had one problem so far with the exposure indicator in the viewfinder freezing at around -15˚C...

I hadn't even though about taking many shorter exposures and putting them together afterwards, if there comes a time when I go over to digital I'll be shure to test it and see how it works.

Thanks again
11-26-2007, 03:41 PM   #7
Senior Member




Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Moscow, Russia
Posts: 239
Hi Jimfear!
I am one of those who actually live in a rather cold climate - Russia. So something about low temperatures and my GX-10... I was shooting for like 2 hours with internal battery only when it was -5. Everything worked fine, looks like at this temperature camera produces enough heat to keep battery from freezing.
I have not experienced lower temperatures yet (they are yet to come) with THIS camera but from experience of others I know that when it gets down to -15 or so, LiIon batteries begin to freeze, and stop giving power. To avoid this, keep the battery in your warm pocket between shooting series, that's all.
One more problem may occur with some lenses... I don't know the cause of this, but as they freeze, they begin to badly overexpose images... Perhaps blades of diaphragm greeze and do not close, or something like that. This happens only to newer lenses. Old ones continue to work perfectly.
Anyway, noone in Russian pentax club ever said that permenent damage was done to a Pentax by low temperatures.
11-26-2007, 04:27 PM   #8
Loyal Site Supporter
Canada_Rockies's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Sparwood, BC, Canada
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 9,547
My solution to the extremely cold weather is my SF-1. I bought a "cold pack" for it. This is a replacement grip that has a 1 meter cord and a 4 AA battery pack on the end of the cord. It goes in my shirt pocket. The batteries stay toasty warm. My fingers don't though.

11-26-2007, 08:46 PM   #9
Senior Member




Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Vancouver BC
Posts: 230
If the buffer clearing on long exposures is a problem turn off the noise reduction feature. It spends close to an equal amount of time after the exposure working on the noise reduction. The downside is you will then have to do it on your computer, or live with the noise.
11-26-2007, 09:29 PM   #10
Pentaxian
rvannatta's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Apiary, Oregon
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,176
QuoteOriginally posted by Jimfear Quote
Thanks

That sounds reassuring, but now I came to think of the problem with the time to clear the buffer. Is there any way or any camera that does this faster? Wouldn’t want to stand waiting an extra 10 minutes per exposure in cold weather. Or is that yet another reason for me to stay with film?

Andrew you said that you can take "only" 100 shots before the battery depletes in cold weather, now a scenario, that I tend to come across a lot, of photographing winter nights. So long exposures in cold weather and a max of about ten pictures per occasion, how do you think it will handle it? Shut down in the middle and leave me furious or does it have some kind of failsafe so it finishes the exposure before shutting down?

Mayby it's best to say in time how long it takes for the cameras battery to deplete? (considering that it takes me a month for sure to go through 100 exposures that does not give me as much as a hint to what time we are talking about...)
All batteries in all applications become radically less functional in extreme cold temperatures. To some extent they rely on chemical reactions to produce the power and chemical reactions usually happen more slowly at colder temperatures.


My suggestion (and this applies to all batteries) is to keep them warm. Camera batteries for example can be carried in a warm inside pocket as an alternative to the saddlebag on the dog sled and only put in the camera when ready for use.
11-27-2007, 01:49 AM   #11
Veteran Member
Jimfear's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 576
Original Poster
Wow lots of replies Thanks

QuoteOriginally posted by Canada_Rockies Quote
My solution to the extremely cold weather is my SF-1. I bought a "cold pack" for it. This is a replacement grip that has a 1 meter cord and a 4 AA battery pack on the end of the cord. It goes in my shirt pocket. The batteries stay toasty warm. My fingers don't though.
That's smart! Do you know if there's anything like this for the K10D?

QuoteOriginally posted by jnorth Quote
If the buffer clearing on long exposures is a problem turn off the noise reduction feature. It spends close to an equal amount of time after the exposure working on the noise reduction. The downside is you will then have to do it on your computer, or live with the noise.
So it would only spend some 5-10 minutes on cleaning the buffer after a 20 minute exposure? Or something in that range?

Is the K10D's noise bad at lowest ISO setting or why do I need to use niose reduction in the first place?


QuoteOriginally posted by Snowcat Quote
Hi Jimfear!
One more problem may occur with some lenses... I don't know the cause of this, but as they freeze, they begin to badly overexpose images... Perhaps blades of diaphragm greeze and do not close, or something like that. This happens only to newer lenses. Old ones continue to work perfectly.
I've never experiensed something like this myself (I don't use new lenses), the only problem with lenses I have had is that the focusing tends to get very stiff in cold weather.

When you say it only happens with newer lenses do you mean newer constructions (like the DA series as opposed to older models FA/A) or whatever lens bought new?
11-27-2007, 12:18 PM   #12
Senior Member




Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Moscow, Russia
Posts: 239
QuoteQuote:
I've never experiensed something like this myself (I don't use new lenses), the only problem with lenses I have had is that the focusing tends to get very stiff in cold weather.

When you say it only happens with newer lenses do you mean newer constructions (like the DA series as opposed to older models FA/A) or whatever lens bought new?
By new lenses I mean relatively new models. I heard about freezing lenses twice, onece it was kit lens DA 18-55, the other time it was FA-J 100-300 (I can be wrong about focal range, but it was that low cost tele zoom with plastic mount). Don't have any info of other lenses.
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
battery, camera, color, dslr, exposure, hours, k10d, photography
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
k10d questions cutlerjay Pentax DSLR Discussion 7 11-03-2010 03:13 PM
K10D questions kev.pride Pentax DSLR Discussion 2 10-30-2008 04:17 AM
Questions about K10D sweet bay Pentax DSLR Discussion 7 01-17-2008 11:54 AM
K10d Related Questions Takman Pentax DSLR Discussion 5 10-31-2007 12:03 PM
Other K10D questions then. steffi Pentax DSLR Discussion 16 04-17-2007 05:18 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:20 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top