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01-30-2012, 02:45 PM   #31
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I wish I could speak German

01-30-2012, 03:30 PM   #32
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Good and brave topic in this forum!

I was a Nikon user. After the Nikon D70 gear got stolen from my house. I gave pentax a try. The good lenses I have now are DA limited 40mm f2.8 and a FA 28-70mm F4. I have a K-7 body too.

Let's face it. For single AF speed and accuracy even K-7 can't match Nikon D70 with 18-70mm kit lens based on my preference. I stick with pentax because I was heard that pentax is easier to find older lenses with bigger selection. Over these years, what I noticed are:
1. Operation speed and AF speed still lag quite many years to Nikon and Canon. It seems that pentax engineers are not able to put an efficient algorithm or fast enough processor into the camera body.
2. On camera shake reduction works but may not as reliable and effective as Nikon and Canon. For pentax I have to wait for the small hand to show up.
3. Lens price hike quite a lot. Right now I think Nikon and Canon's premium fixed focal lenses may not able to get the price as pentax famous limited lenses. Even the old takumar and M serious lenses are tend to get more and more expensive. The A serious lenses price are too much for cheap lens hunters. I don't think the quality and price difference between metal and plastic are so big for fixed focal lenses since they are made in Vietnam. To me the limited lenses are high gross margin product. I only buy used. I paid $270 for the DA limited used. There are Nikon and Canon 35mm plastic fixed focal lenses that I can have in this price range brand new.
4. The last 10 years history showed that pentax had to help Samsung to bring up their capability. And then got sold to Hoya. And now Ricoh. Ricoh is a camera company which produced some nice camera before and one of it was my favorite camera about 18 years ago. What do you think Ricoh will do with Pentax? Who knows?

There are other example, Minolta and Konica. They all have best rated camera or lenses. They merged and then became a @ now.

I think pentax brand's future is not in their hands and neither in our hands. It is in Ricoh's hand! Currently I'd stick with Pentax since I've put over $1000 into it now. If I have enough budget I'd likely to go back to Nikon for sure ^_^. Pentax has an opportunity to become an antique brand.

That's my $0.02.
01-30-2012, 03:34 PM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by twitch Quote
I think it has been discussed before on these forums. Pentax AF beats Sony, Canon 7D and Nikon D7000 for accuracy in German tests...

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-news-rumors/154373-pentax-k-5-exce...ocus-test.html
01-30-2012, 03:48 PM   #34
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Thanks everyone for your opinions and advice.

I think I will do as has been sugested and try out the K-5. I'm a bit cautious about the K-5 due to so many issues with it from the day it was released.

Someone asked me what my issue with AF is (and my skill was being questioned). AF I find is just TOO SLOW. Not the lenses, I have had quite a few lenses which are VERY quick to focus (i.e. Sigma 100-300mm f/4) and even though the motor on that lens is lightning quick, the camera would hunt then micro adjust before locking focus. This was the same on my K10D, K-7 and also my current K20D.

Maybe it's just the conditions I shoot in that are beyond the capability of the AF, regardless of brand. I will be doing some further testing before making my final decision.

I don't have any issues with the AF in bright daylight, of course. The K20D and K-7 performed fine, it's just the low light conditions I regurarly shoot. Think of "night clubs" and that's basically the conditions I have to deal with and the type of people too. I do a LOT of events (all for free).

It is evident there are a few fanyboys here and will attack the photographer (without even knowing me) than admit there are a few flaws with the system. I'm not one to be blaming my tools before my skill, but I have definitely become fvery familiar with the camera's limitations and asjust my shooting style to suit. Sometimes, thought, that isnt enough and I miss out on the golden shots.

Before anyone asks, yes I have tried shoot in MF (hence why I have a small MF lens collection) but I found that too slow, especially in dark scenes as it's hard to find that focus point.

I shoot quite a bit in max aperture

01-30-2012, 05:41 PM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by benhai Quote
I stick with pentax because I was heard that pentax is easier to find older lenses with bigger selection.
That is one of the biggest "positives" i hear about Pentax on these forums. As an ex-Nikon user, I have not seen that to be the case at all. Maybe its because I am in the US, but I can go onto craigslist or ebay and find a plethora of Nikon lenses of every price, vintage, quality, manual or automatic focus, and focal length. The same cannot be said of Pentax lenses.
01-30-2012, 05:45 PM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by cali92rs Quote
That is one of the biggest "positives" i hear about Pentax on these forums. As an ex-Nikon user, I have not seen that to be the case at all. Maybe its because I am in the US, but I can go onto craigslist or ebay and find a plethora of Nikon lenses of every price, vintage, quality, manual or automatic focus, and focal length. The same cannot be said of Pentax lenses.
Honestly, it was the case when I started with Pentax in 2007 - many very nice older lenses in the local shops here, many great deals on craigslist and even ebay. In 2008, things really took off, used lenses were flying off the shelves and started drying up as every new Pentax DSLR shooter discovered them and started building their collections. The marketplace in this forum was crazy that year.

2009 was leaner, 2010, even more so. Now it seems as though you have to be luckier to find a good deal.

Time for some new lenses, Pentax!


.

Last edited by jsherman999; 01-30-2012 at 05:55 PM.
01-30-2012, 06:10 PM   #37
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Just wondering if you have used a hotshoe flash in those times, with the focus beam?? I found sometimes I would just set my 360 to SB only (no flash) and the camera would focus very quickly in the darkest conditions. Just a thought.
01-30-2012, 06:12 PM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by jsherman999 Quote
Honestly, it was the case when I started with Pentax in 2007 - many very nice older lenses in the local shops here, many great deals on craigslist and even ebay. In 2008, things really took off, used lenses were flying off the shelves and started drying up as every new Pentax DSLR shooter discovered them and started building their collections. The marketplace in this forum was crazy that year.

2009 was leaner, 2010, even more so. Now it seems as though you have to be luckier to find a good deal.


.
I guess I really missed that boat

01-31-2012, 06:59 AM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by cali92rs Quote
That is one of the biggest "positives" i hear about Pentax on these forums. As an ex-Nikon user, I have not seen that to be the case at all. Maybe its because I am in the US, but I can go onto craigslist or ebay and find a plethora of Nikon lenses of every price, vintage, quality, manual or automatic focus, and focal length. The same cannot be said of Pentax lenses.
Correct me if I'm wrong on this, as I'm not really well versed on the finer points of Nikon. My understanding of the backwards compatibility selling point of Pentax has heavy emphasis on the compatibility, and that Nikon gimps their sub $1200 bodies so you can't meter with manual lenses at all. Pentax "just works" whether the lens is a DA, an old M, or an even older m42. So in that sense, yes, we have a lot more choices available.
01-31-2012, 07:18 AM   #40
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That's the whole reason why there's more old Nikon glass available on the used market then Pentax glass. The old Pentax glass is still very usable on the newest Pentax bodies, people aren't forced to sell the lenses, and when they are on the market every Pentaxian is able to use and buy them.
01-31-2012, 07:29 AM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by CrazyNuts Quote
Thanks everyone for your opinions and advice.

I think I will do as has been sugested and try out the K-5. I'm a bit cautious about the K-5 due to so many issues with it from the day it was released.

Someone asked me what my issue with AF is (and my skill was being questioned). AF I find is just TOO SLOW. Not the lenses, I have had quite a few lenses which are VERY quick to focus (i.e. Sigma 100-300mm f/4) and even though the motor on that lens is lightning quick, the camera would hunt then micro adjust before locking focus. This was the same on my K10D, K-7 and also my current K20D.

Maybe it's just the conditions I shoot in that are beyond the capability of the AF, regardless of brand. I will be doing some further testing before making my final decision.

I don't have any issues with the AF in bright daylight, of course. The K20D and K-7 performed fine, it's just the low light conditions I regurarly shoot. Think of "night clubs" and that's basically the conditions I have to deal with and the type of people too. I do a LOT of events (all for free).

It is evident there are a few fanyboys here and will attack the photographer (without even knowing me) than admit there are a few flaws with the system. I'm not one to be blaming my tools before my skill, but I have definitely become fvery familiar with the camera's limitations and asjust my shooting style to suit. Sometimes, thought, that isnt enough and I miss out on the golden shots.

Before anyone asks, yes I have tried shoot in MF (hence why I have a small MF lens collection) but I found that too slow, especially in dark scenes as it's hard to find that focus point.

I shoot quite a bit in max aperture

If it is for live music etc in low lit clubs all brands suffer on the speed (I've shot music for years and have friends using all brands) the faster lenses make a difference. a Tamron 70 -200 2.8 just isn't that fast in the scheme of things and screw drive lenses do hunt more than SDM/USM lenses (my sigma 24-70 2.8 suffers the same as it's an older model screw drive not the newer usm type.)
I haven't tried a K5 (i use a K7) but I understand it is faster than my K7 (and my K7 seems fast and accurate compared to my K10)
The biggest issue i see if you want to move over is what it costs to get the best performance out of the system. The Body isn't the issue it's the high end glass which costs an order of magnitude more

Try a 50-135 with a K5 and compare that to the others. also you might look for a faster prime than the DA70 (look at the sigma 85 1.4 or 50 1.4 bot very fast focusing AFAIK)

All that being said I think you can shoot what you shoot with manual focus lenses (hell it was the only way when i shot the early punk scene in London and Toronto back in 76-77, and light in those clubs was as bad as you'll ever see and it was a frenetic scene as well so needed speed. Like shooting sports the trick to MF in this scenario is to predict action rather than the spray and pray of modern fast af systems with unlimited shots at no cost.
Reality is crappy tungsten (or even worse LED) club lighting is a challenge to all AF systems
01-31-2012, 08:40 AM   #42
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This all got me thinking about brand loyalty. I can not think about any think for which i have it, exept my camera. I was once given a tshirt made by a friend that was a bell shaped curve and then an asterisk way off to the left. It said "I have been excluded from your dataset" It did not last many washings but nice gesture because I am not include din most marketing datatsets. I don't own a TV, I hate fiction, I typically laugh at the chochkey things USAians buy. I did have Pentax gear in highschool (film days). But it was not enough glass to sway the decision. I liked qualities of Pentax that i was not seeing elsewhere. And i think that is 100% of my brand loyalty. The fact that Pentax had cameras that ran on AA. The fact that at the time weather proof bodies and sturdy bodies were available on entry levels. And the kind support of this forum were the key factors. If any of these are lost in the long term (especially the AAs) I will have no qualms about switching. But would miss out on the pretty cheap kmount deals on ebay. Those AAs make travel and wilderness work SO NICE.

Last edited by cadmus; 01-31-2012 at 08:40 PM.
01-31-2012, 11:24 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
That's the whole reason why there's more old Nikon glass available on the used market then Pentax glass. The old Pentax glass is still very usable on the newest Pentax bodies, people aren't forced to sell the lenses, and when they are on the market every Pentaxian is able to use and buy them.
Nikkor Lens Information by Thom Hogan

Check out the table. If you go to ebay, you will see a lot of lenses that will meter even on the cheap D3100.
And if you want to have even more lenses available to you which meter, the D300 and D700 meter with the old AI lenses, and there are a ton of those available.
01-31-2012, 11:49 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by cali92rs Quote
Nikkor Lens Information by Thom Hogan

Check out the table. If you go to ebay, you will see a lot of lenses that will meter even on the cheap D3100.
And if you want to have even more lenses available to you which meter, the D300 and D700 meter with the old AI lenses, and there are a ton of those available.
But all those Pre-AI, AI, AI-S, and E lenses don't meter on anything less than the D7000. And you have to manual focus anything that isn't AF-S or AF-I.

Nikon's can't use M42 lenses either. But you can use those Nikon lenses on a Pentax. The Pre-AI lenses don't even need to be modified.
01-31-2012, 12:40 PM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
But all those Pre-AI, AI, AI-S, and E lenses don't meter on anything less than the D7000. And you have to manual focus anything that isn't AF-S or AF-I.

Nikon's can't use M42 lenses either. But you can use those Nikon lenses on a Pentax. The Pre-AI lenses don't even need to be modified.
Yep. But i will give Nikon credit for at least providing some backward support. no-one else has aside from Pentax, and no-one has provided the pentax level of legacy support
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