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View Poll Results: Full Frame / Pentax Population Migration Census
I will never switch and wait desperately and infinitely for a Pentax FF 4352.44%
I am thinking about switching 3137.80%
I joined the dark forces and switched 56.10%
I switched but I'll keep my Pentax gear, definitely, because I still have hope 910.98%
Additional: I switched to Calcium (Ca) 33.66%
Additional: I switched to Nickel (Ni) 78.54%
Additional: I switched to Stannum (Sn) (_o_y) 11.22%
Additional: I switched to Oxygen (O) (Other) 33.66%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 82. You may not vote on this poll

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04-26-2012, 07:07 AM   #16
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I also got FF for 1813.5 and FF for 28.719.1.
So I guess I've switch to FF already


The poll has left out a "Don't really care for FF; but will get a Pentax one if it comes out" option.

04-26-2012, 07:13 AM - 1 Like   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by causey Quote
Voted #1 and #2, too. I took #1 as a descriptive statement, not as a declaration of intention: I just don't think I'm ever going to switch. Still, sometimes I'm thinking of switching (not necessarily for FF though). I would definitely go FF if Pentax released one.
Bonjour Causey,

Me, too ... I really do not think that I would switch totally and abandon Pentax ... I learned in HS with a K1000 and snapped up a pristine one here in France that only needs light seals ... it's nostalgia and maybe some homesickness. But, I too would be very interested by a Pentax FF, but I will evaluate that if and when it happens ... never say never.

I guess that I should fix the K1000 and/or find another SLR film body so as to shoot some B&W in FF style ... and as Lowell Goudge just wrote and reminded me: I have a FF already! (see below my current FF "first love" ... and still hunting a decent priced f1.4 to go with it ... and other equipment)

A+, John le Frog


Last edited by Jean Poitiers; 04-26-2012 at 07:24 AM.
04-26-2012, 07:26 AM - 1 Like   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jean Poitiers Quote
I guess that I should fix the K1000 and/or find another SLR film body so as to shoot some B&W in FF style ... and as Lowell Goudge just wrote and reminded me: I have a FF already! (see below my current FF first love ...)

A+, John le Frog

I would go for a PZ-1, great camera, has something else that people are asking for 1/250 flash sync, and with the exception of HSM AF lenses works with anything you can mount on the body, including some things you cant do today, like Av Mode with manual aperture lenses.
04-26-2012, 07:32 AM   #19
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Merci beaucoup ...

QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
I would go for a PZ-1, great camera, has something else that people are asking for 1/250 flash sync, and with the exception of HSM AF lenses works with anything you can mount on the body, including some things you cant do today, like Av Mode with manual aperture lenses.

Bonjour Lowell,

I was just about to ask such a question ... thanks for your advice. It's greatly appreciated!

Salut encore, J Frog


04-26-2012, 07:38 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
Just to make my objection clear here, while you may be interested in full frame only users the concern I have is with respect to the use of the poll. At some point it will be dragged up to show how many people / percentage of people have switched and with it the implied loss of market share by pentax.
This is my problem with the poll, too. It has no real frame of reference and is going to provide skewed results.
04-26-2012, 07:57 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by TaoMaas Quote
This is my problem with the poll, too. It has no real frame of reference and is going to provide skewed results.
Its a shame really, because if the poll included people who did not want FF, and showed a high % of users really did want or cared about FF then it would be much better use to anyone who is looking at market feeback.

They have really backed themselves into a corner, in that respect
04-26-2012, 08:20 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
This poll is hopelessly flawed.

The reason is simple, while it will measure the response of people desparately thinking they need full frame, it ignores the larger population of people who dont care/want full frame.

lets be clear about things here

Full frame is mostly sought after by those who want to shoot ultra fast lenses wide open. For me, they are somewhat wrong in their thinking, because unless they are in full control of the lighting and the shooting situation, shooting at F1.2 or F1.4 requires insanely high shutter speeds, because the camera cannot go low enough in ISO.

My solution for the times I want full frame is really simple, for those rare occasions, i put a roll of film (you remember what that was don't you?) into my PZ-1 and off I go.

you should add, to the poll at least the following two points.

I dont want full frame, and I am satisfied shooting film when I need/want full frame


Edit note. Just to make my objection clear here, while you may be interested in full frame only users the concern I have is with respect to the use of the poll. At some point it will be dragged up to show how many people / percentage of people have switched and with it the implied loss of market share by pentax. It needs to be grounded with the reality that a very large number of shooters are not searching for a canikon beating full frame, and that while this does imply some potential miogration away from the brand, that is a very small percentage of pentax's current market share. If the poll proves this point wrong, then it justifies potentially the development of a full frame, so lets have the proper poll so that if you really want pentax to listen, they can see the share of those who feel it is needed and wanted. I could be wrong in my assessment but I don't think so
Indeed, film is still an option but for a lot of people, doing film is quite expensive, except if you have access to a lab.
I know a certain number who'd love to use film but the costs or not having a lab holds them back.
If you are pro, you can bill this to the client, no problem. Because you define your price in relation with your costs.
But if you are not pro, or on the way to, you do some things for free, in order to have a solid book and I couldn't afford doing things for free in film.

This is the reason I put this poll in the DSLR section and not SLR. If film were cheaper or if I could add a lab in my flat, I would buy me a 645 or an old blad (have a K1000 too).
So this poll is not asking for people using film to answer the poll. No offense Doesn't exclude they can participate in the discussion.

For the option "I don't want full frame" well, it is kind of unnecessary because this poll is only adressed to those who want a FF. Hence the title of this post.
No offense again

I agree this will leave out the majority who doesn't want a FF but this is not the point of the poll. The major point is to find out how many switched already.
An additional info is that this will count the number of people who would like a FF. This question is already answered by the petition (3000+ ?) but I thought it could be
useful to have a graph that has all in one (concerning FF). In the petition, there weren't any people saying they don't care. Here it's the same ^^
I also know that this will exclude all those who switched and don't come back to pentaxforums... but that's the game.

I have my reasons for wanting a FF. Not using superfast lenses at f1.2 or so, I need that anyway. Because I do a lot of shooting in low light conditions so the extremely high shutterspeeds are not my problem.
Some people buy FF (they probably don't even know the difference between APS-C and FF) because they have money and want the most expensive thing. I've seen a lot of those people.
They're not good photographers but they don't care or worse, think they are really good ones. They have the best and they like it and for them, it's the better the camera, the better the pictures
(yes, I agree it can help but the K5 is not FF, not excessively priced and yet an excellent performer).
Everyone has it's reason. Maybe you are right about the reason even if you don't need FF for that.
That's also the reason why I repeat several times to give reasons for switching or wanting FF.


About the point of not looking for a canikon beating FF, I agree. I was not looking for that too. Just wanted a reasonably priced (not 6.000 euro or dollar) FF. I want Pentax, but there is none.
So the only option for digital FF is switching. The additional questions are there to see where people are going, not to judge if Ca or Ni is better than Pentax.
This question has a universal everlasting answer and that's why we are all here :evil:

Maybe I should have added "if there will be a Pentax FF, I'll buy one" but at the end, it's the same as sticking with Pentax and waiting for one to come out, option 1, because you're a
potential Pentax FF buyer.

Any other remarks are welcome.. maybe we'll start it all over again with the good questions.. I'll keep following and note remarks in post 1 (but not now ^^ work to do).
If later we have a new poll-plan with questions that could satisfy every FF wanting person, we could do it over and maybe ask Adam for some support so more people could answer.
I want this poll to be usefull, not just another poll that will be lost over time.
04-26-2012, 08:23 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
Its a shame really, because if the poll included people who did not want FF, and showed a high % of users really did want or cared about FF then it would be much better use to anyone who is looking at market feeback.

They have really backed themselves into a corner, in that respect
If you're looking at percentages, indeed, you need the whole market to make a judgment. If you're looking at numbers ( 3000 people want FF), you don't care.
Yet I have to agree that 3.000 on say 20.000 give a more precise idea because they could compare those numbers with real market sales.
So I'll add that idea on post 1

Someone knows if a poll can be modified (should be, by adding a column in the DB)? Adam, are you out there (if not, I'll PM)?


Last edited by ezechiel; 04-26-2012 at 08:29 AM.
04-26-2012, 08:40 AM   #24
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ezechiel, i would be interested i your reasons for full frame.

In my simplistic point of view there are the following resons

1 Shallow DOF with respect to a specific angle of view. This means wanting to shoot at 85mm and F1.4 for example, or 50mm at F1.2 and have razor thin DOF
2 Ultra wide angle shots
3 the perception that you get lower noise with bigger sensor cells
4 the possibility of higher MP shots in the same form
5 brighter bigger view finder

If we follow these points, due to the cost of FF cameras at present, and the yeild etc, as well as the release rate of FF sensors, point 3 and 4 are only perhaps relevant at the instant of release, but newer APS-C sensors generally far exceed the resolution and noise of a FF sensor quickly.

1, 2, and 5 are really the reasons to need full frame, other than the ego trip many people take of having the best regardless of having the wit to use it

Your need to shoot wide open in low light, for example is format independant.
04-26-2012, 09:39 AM   #25
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A: None of the above.

I would supplement my existing gear with an appropriate FF if/when I could afford such. I WOULD NOT DITCH MY PENTAX GEAR! Of my 235 current lenses, maybe a dozen are not suitable for FF, and all the rest work quite well with either platform -- and I have a half-dozen FF film bodies they fit on too.

There is no Dark Side. There are different tools for different tasksl
04-26-2012, 10:41 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
A: None of the above.
I would supplement my existing gear with an appropriate FF if/when I could afford such. I WOULD NOT DITCH MY PENTAX GEAR!
RioRico speaks for me on this one.

I find the poll wording to be presumptuous here
I switched but I'll keep my Pentax gear, definitely, because I still have hope
How about I switched for FF but I'll keep my Pentax gear because it flat out rawks
04-27-2012, 01:02 AM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
ezechiel, i would be interested i your reasons for full frame.

In my simplistic point of view there are the following resons

1 Shallow DOF with respect to a specific angle of view. This means wanting to shoot at 85mm and F1.4 for example, or 50mm at F1.2 and have razor thin DOF
2 Ultra wide angle shots
3 the perception that you get lower noise with bigger sensor cells
4 the possibility of higher MP shots in the same form
5 brighter bigger view finder

If we follow these points, due to the cost of FF cameras at present, and the yeild etc, as well as the release rate of FF sensors, point 3 and 4 are only perhaps relevant at the instant of release, but newer APS-C sensors generally far exceed the resolution and noise of a FF sensor quickly.

1, 2, and 5 are really the reasons to need full frame, other than the ego trip many people take of having the best regardless of having the wit to use it

Your need to shoot wide open in low light, for example is format independant.
Yes, for the need for wide open in low light, no matter if it's FF or APS-C. I said that already ^^
The shallow DOF is definitely number one reason for wanting FF. It makes a lot of difference and some clients notice it.
The ultra wide angle is another reason, although not as important.
Lower noise.. well, if I had bought a K5, I would have lower noise also.
Higher MP shots: an advantage but not a deciding factor. I never would by a D800 for example. Way too much MPs.
But it allows to have some more detail in the picture, which you can also notice without pixel peeping, in some conditions.
04-27-2012, 01:07 AM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
I would supplement my existing gear with an appropriate FF if/when I could afford such. I WOULD NOT DITCH MY PENTAX GEAR! Of my 235 current lenses, maybe a dozen are not suitable for FF, and all the rest work quite well with either platform -- and I have a half-dozen FF film bodies they fit on too.
Of course, if you have 235 K mount lenses ( ) I would not change too.
I will sell my K7 because if I keep it, I'll lose money and I probably won't use it even if my attachment to the brand makes me want to keep it.
But I'll keep my 77mm Ltd, definitely!

QuoteOriginally posted by RioRico Quote
There is no Dark Side. There are different tools for different tasksl
This is just a joke. A wink to all those this-brand-is-better discussions that make no sense. Please do not take this seriously
04-27-2012, 02:16 AM   #29
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Just added some comments about new choices in the first post.
Please post some remarks / comments / ... about this.

Some say certain modifications should be made to make this poll more accurate and it would be great if it could be
so this poll can have a real impact.

Thanks for your support
04-27-2012, 02:37 AM   #30
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I don't have the money, need or want to run 2 systems. So unfortunately the more and more I hear about Nikon's new offerings, along with a wall of silence from Pentax, the closer I'm getting to switching before I invest any more coin. I think I'll give Pentax another 8-12 months...
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