I hope Pentax keeps going with Crop Sensors

coreyhkh · 06-20-2012, 05:09 PM

Everyone seems to want a FF that's all good except for sports or wildlife where the crop sensor has the edge not only in the cropping ability but also FF camera all seem to have a fairly slow burst rate.
Not to mention FF carry a hefty cost increase.

vonBaloney · 06-20-2012, 05:13 PM

Originally posted by coreyhkh

Everyone seems to want a FF that's all good except for sports or wildlife where the crop sensor has the edge not only in the cropping ability but also FF camera all seem to have a fairly slow burst rate.
Not to mention FF carry a hefty cost increase.

I think I'd go for a mirrorless FF if it had a good electronic viewfinder -- no big mirror slapping, could be more compact and maybe the burst rate a bit faster. For telephoto, I have to admit I am intrigued with what people are doing with the Q and K-mount lenses...

liukaitc · 06-20-2012, 05:37 PM

I hope too
FF camera and glass too heavy
I can carry k5 with 16-50 and 50-135 without too much burden
but think about 5d mark II with 24-70 and 70-200...OMG..big and heavy
the FF set up should give better image quality..but the k5 set up is still fine.

jimr-pdx · 06-20-2012, 05:49 PM

My shoulder and budget say "no" to FF.. but Pentax is just crazy enough to make it small enough to interest me enough..
And I have 15-150mm covered in full frame lenses now anyway. Didn't really plan that, but there it is. If they choose to talk, I'll listen - but the wallet won't approve for a while in any case. I've just picked up a set of prints with some really nice images using the ME and 15mm fisheye - it's great fun with the K-5 but sadly now I know what I'm missing!

Man I'm old though, SR really saves a lot of my shots nowadays.

**Pål Jensen** · 06-20-2012, 06:11 PM

Cropped sensors will not go away. Smaller sensors makes increasingly more sense the better the sensor technology gets. APS is a format in its own right; not just a temporary size until FF gets cheap enough. No reason to worry!

APS is defacto the new 35mm format but with much better image quality than what was available for the 35mm film format.

Lupine · 06-20-2012, 06:13 PM

FX full frame DSLRs are not going to displace DX crop DSLRs anytime soon, if ever. They are different markets and very different price points, at least for now.

However, you should anticipate that like all electronics, the costs of FF sensors will eventually drop as low or lower than high end crop sensors cost now, and will have significantly better performance than current FF sensors. Think Pentium 4 vs. Sandy Bridge CPUs. That's not a 'bad thing' and doesn't necessarily mean crop sensors will become extinct. They will also continue to improve and see decreases in real costs. Hopefully, this will result is a camera market with lots of competition and consumer options. I can easily see a future when camera bodies are commodities and are replaced on a regular basis. That already happens now, but I would expect that trend to accelerate, given past history in the electronics industry.

The lenses are the only pieces that have real, lasting value and even then, only so long as compatible bodies are available. That's a major reason why I've stayed with Pentax; their committment to maintain backwards lens mount compatibility is and has been a major selling point for me.

Blue · 06-20-2012, 07:26 PM

Originally posted by coreyhkh

Everyone seems to want a FF that's all good except for sports or wildlife where the crop sensor has the edge not only in the cropping ability but also FF camera all seem to have a fairly slow burst rate.
Not to mention FF carry a hefty cost increase.

Did Nikon or Canon dump the aps-c due to FF bodies? Canon even has that small aps-c.

kenafein · 06-20-2012, 07:37 PM

The crop sensor advantage, for telephoto, only exists if the sensor has a higher pixel density. Even then, the pro sports gear is low density full frame, with fast shutters and insanely expensive glass.

I would also be interested in a full frame mirrorless.

mickey · 06-20-2012, 07:48 PM

aps-c will likely be going for a while yet, certainly been mentioned by Pentax that they have no FF in the pipes.

The interesting point is about FF dropping in price.
There will come a time when FF can be had at a competitive price to aps-c, then all but novices will take note.

I'm hoping my K10 and K-5 will last the a years so I don't really have to mull over the dilemma.

bobmaxja · 06-20-2012, 08:04 PM - **1 Like**

You know what , my K-5 can take great photo and 99 % of the time , nobody will lknow it's from an APSC

TomTextura · 06-20-2012, 08:23 PM

I don't think APS-C is under any kind of threat from FF, for any of the brands, especially with the number lenses out there that only cover the smaller image circle. It's not as if it's one or the other. The release of a FF body from Pentax, along with new DFA lenses, will likely only benefit the brand as well as Pentaxians that stick to just APS-C cameras. If a Pentax FF camera can take the K-5's excellent features and improve on them, it'd surely bring new and positive attention to the brand. New DFA lens offerings would also be desirable to APS-C users. I can only see a large sensor camera release from Pentax as being a win all around, if done right of course.

Currently I don't do any kind of sports or wildlife photography, and I don't have much use for fast bursts rates either. I do, however, really like wider angles and large apertures. Hence the desire for a full frame camera. FF offers a more favorable working distance than APS-C but in the range from wide to medium telephoto, at least for me. I would use my K-5 alongside any potential FF Pentax offering though and would opt for the smaller body whenever it's better suited for the task at hand. The FA Pentax Limiteds are already rather diminutive so if Pentax can release a FF body that's smaller than the competition's, I will be very happy.

adpo · 06-20-2012, 08:41 PM

only reason i would want FF is to throw a 35mm f1.4 or the 31mm LTD on for wide angle shallow DoF shots. But the DA*55 with brenizer pano works well enough that I could live without it. If anything, I'd much rather see pentax make more fast DA* primes

coreyhkh · 06-20-2012, 09:13 PM

I found this

Pentax To Announce the K-3 Full Frame DSLR At Photokina

ElJamoquio · 06-20-2012, 09:21 PM

Originally posted by coreyhkh

Everyone seems to want a FF that's all good except for sports or wildlife where the crop sensor has the edge not only in the cropping ability but also FF camera all seem to have a fairly slow burst rate.
Not to mention FF carry a hefty cost increase.

Without a doubt, Pentax will continue with a APS-C *something* for many years to come and a DSLR APS-C for at least five (my opinion, of course). If DSLR 'dies' after five years it'll be because EVF's have vastly improved (we'll see).

FWIW the k-5 doesn't have an advantage over the D800 in cropping, and the wider field of view makes it easier to track wildlife and sports in FF. Personally I'd take a 24MP FF 'in the field' over a 16MP APS-C any day. The disadvantage is in 'burst rate' as you mention.

ElJamoquio · 06-20-2012, 09:23 PM

Originally posted by coreyhkh

I found this

Pentax To Announce the K-3 Full Frame DSLR At Photokina

Does someone at petapixel need to be emailed explaining the april fool's day joke (and not the lens price joke)?

06-20-2012, 05:09 PM	#1
coreyhkh Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: London Ontario Posts: 131	I hope Pentax keeps going with Crop Sensors Everyone seems to want a FF that's all good except for sports or wildlife where the crop sensor has the edge not only in the cropping ability but also FF camera all seem to have a fairly slow burst rate. Not to mention FF carry a hefty cost increase.

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06-20-2012, 05:13 PM	#2
vonBaloney Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 6,029	Originally posted by coreyhkh Everyone seems to want a FF that's all good except for sports or wildlife where the crop sensor has the edge not only in the cropping ability but also FF camera all seem to have a fairly slow burst rate. Not to mention FF carry a hefty cost increase. I think I'd go for a mirrorless FF if it had a good electronic viewfinder -- no big mirror slapping, could be more compact and maybe the burst rate a bit faster. For telephoto, I have to admit I am intrigued with what people are doing with the Q and K-mount lenses...

06-20-2012, 05:37 PM	#3
liukaitc Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: New York Photos: Albums Posts: 1,008	I hope too FF camera and glass too heavy I can carry k5 with 16-50 and 50-135 without too much burden but think about 5d mark II with 24-70 and 70-200...OMG..big and heavy the FF set up should give better image quality..but the k5 set up is still fine.

06-20-2012, 05:49 PM	#4
jimr-pdx Pentaxian Join Date: May 2010 Location: now 1 hour north of PDX Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,897	My shoulder and budget say "no" to FF.. but Pentax is just crazy enough to make it small enough to interest me enough.. And I have 15-150mm covered in full frame lenses now anyway. Didn't really plan that, but there it is. If they choose to talk, I'll listen - but the wallet won't approve for a while in any case. I've just picked up a set of prints with some really nice images using the ME and 15mm fisheye - it's great fun with the K-5 but sadly now I know what I'm missing! Man I'm old though, SR really saves a lot of my shots nowadays.

06-20-2012, 06:11 PM	#5
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Cropped sensors will not go away. Smaller sensors makes increasingly more sense the better the sensor technology gets. APS is a format in its own right; not just a temporary size until FF gets cheap enough. No reason to worry! APS is defacto the new 35mm format but with much better image quality than what was available for the 35mm film format.

06-20-2012, 06:13 PM	#6
Lupine Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: SF Bay Area Posts: 93	FX full frame DSLRs are not going to displace DX crop DSLRs anytime soon, if ever. They are different markets and very different price points, at least for now. However, you should anticipate that like all electronics, the costs of FF sensors will eventually drop as low or lower than high end crop sensors cost now, and will have significantly better performance than current FF sensors. Think Pentium 4 vs. Sandy Bridge CPUs. That's not a 'bad thing' and doesn't necessarily mean crop sensors will become extinct. They will also continue to improve and see decreases in real costs. Hopefully, this will result is a camera market with lots of competition and consumer options. I can easily see a future when camera bodies are commodities and are replaced on a regular basis. That already happens now, but I would expect that trend to accelerate, given past history in the electronics industry. The lenses are the only pieces that have real, lasting value and even then, only so long as compatible bodies are available. That's a major reason why I've stayed with Pentax; their committment to maintain backwards lens mount compatibility is and has been a major selling point for me.

06-20-2012, 07:26 PM	#7
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	Originally posted by coreyhkh Everyone seems to want a FF that's all good except for sports or wildlife where the crop sensor has the edge not only in the cropping ability but also FF camera all seem to have a fairly slow burst rate. Not to mention FF carry a hefty cost increase. Did Nikon or Canon dump the aps-c due to FF bodies? Canon even has that small aps-c.

06-20-2012, 07:37 PM	#8
kenafein Veteran Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Southern California Photos: Albums Posts: 4,082	The crop sensor advantage, for telephoto, only exists if the sensor has a higher pixel density. Even then, the pro sports gear is low density full frame, with fast shutters and insanely expensive glass. I would also be interested in a full frame mirrorless.

06-20-2012, 07:48 PM	#9
mickey Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Japan Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,146	aps-c will likely be going for a while yet, certainly been mentioned by Pentax that they have no FF in the pipes. The interesting point is about FF dropping in price. There will come a time when FF can be had at a competitive price to aps-c, then all but novices will take note. I'm hoping my K10 and K-5 will last the a years so I don't really have to mull over the dilemma.

06-20-2012, 08:04 PM - 1 Like	#10
bobmaxja Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Laval, Quebec Canada Posts: 2,171	You know what , my K-5 can take great photo and 99 % of the time , nobody will lknow it's from an APSC

06-20-2012, 08:23 PM	#11
TomTextura Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Denver Photos: Albums Posts: 570	I don't think APS-C is under any kind of threat from FF, for any of the brands, especially with the number lenses out there that only cover the smaller image circle. It's not as if it's one or the other. The release of a FF body from Pentax, along with new DFA lenses, will likely only benefit the brand as well as Pentaxians that stick to just APS-C cameras. If a Pentax FF camera can take the K-5's excellent features and improve on them, it'd surely bring new and positive attention to the brand. New DFA lens offerings would also be desirable to APS-C users. I can only see a large sensor camera release from Pentax as being a win all around, if done right of course. Currently I don't do any kind of sports or wildlife photography, and I don't have much use for fast bursts rates either. I do, however, really like wider angles and large apertures. Hence the desire for a full frame camera. FF offers a more favorable working distance than APS-C but in the range from wide to medium telephoto, at least for me. I would use my K-5 alongside any potential FF Pentax offering though and would opt for the smaller body whenever it's better suited for the task at hand. The FA Pentax Limiteds are already rather diminutive so if Pentax can release a FF body that's smaller than the competition's, I will be very happy.

06-20-2012, 08:41 PM	#12
adpo Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery Posts: 888	only reason i would want FF is to throw a 35mm f1.4 or the 31mm LTD on for wide angle shallow DoF shots. But the DA55 with brenizer pano works well enough that I could live without it. If anything, I'd much rather see pentax make more fast DA primes

06-20-2012, 09:13 PM	#13
coreyhkh Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: London Ontario Posts: 131 Original Poster	I found this Pentax To Announce the K-3 Full Frame DSLR At Photokina

06-20-2012, 09:21 PM	#14
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873	Originally posted by coreyhkh Everyone seems to want a FF that's all good except for sports or wildlife where the crop sensor has the edge not only in the cropping ability but also FF camera all seem to have a fairly slow burst rate. Not to mention FF carry a hefty cost increase. Without a doubt, Pentax will continue with a APS-C something for many years to come and a DSLR APS-C for at least five (my opinion, of course). If DSLR 'dies' after five years it'll be because EVF's have vastly improved (we'll see). FWIW the k-5 doesn't have an advantage over the D800 in cropping, and the wider field of view makes it easier to track wildlife and sports in FF. Personally I'd take a 24MP FF 'in the field' over a 16MP APS-C any day. The disadvantage is in 'burst rate' as you mention.

06-20-2012, 09:23 PM	#15
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873	Originally posted by coreyhkh I found this Pentax To Announce the K-3 Full Frame DSLR At Photokina Does someone at petapixel need to be emailed explaining the april fool's day joke (and not the lens price joke)?